Right this is a rant and rave against eircom

super_canard

Yeah.. also means they can cut me off at any time... coz they ain't bind to a contract either...

De Rebel

Originally posted by super_canard
Yeah.. also means they can cut me off at any time... coz they ain't bind to a contract either...

Not true, in reality.

(1) any court would take a David and Goliath view of the situation. As Goliath, eircom would be expected to have the wit and the means to inform you of your contractual obligations. if they fail to do so, its their loss. Not a legal certainty, but the balance is in your favour as the "small man".

(2) The USO kicks in. They USO obliges them in many instances to provide you with a service. De facto, they have a relationship with you, and for them to suddenly terminate that would leave them with a lot of explaining to do.

De Rebel

Originally posted by shinzon
Im also getting a little peeved , all the replies to my e-mails the letters ive received, phone calls made and basically **** all has been done

Shin

I think you have a strong case. If I understand your situation, the line previously passed the DSL test, and is now failing. There is a serious issue here. One possibility is that the copper deteriorated very very very very very rapidly in the course of the last few weeks. At the other extreme is a possibility that Eircom are deliberately failing your line in order to preserve revenue. (I know that this is most improbable and of course I am in no way accusing eircom of fraudulent or improper behaviour, I am simply moving beyond the most obvious explanation that your line suffered greatly accelerated acute/terminal degradation over the last few weeks and looking at the most extreme of other possible explanations).

It would appear to me that the best route open to you is a formal written complaint to ComReg. The politicians will empathise, sympathise and in the long term your representations will contribute to the greater good. But to get action in your specific case, ComReg is probably the best placed to assist. All this assumes that you are earnest and serious about getting DSL into your premises, and not just venting.

You might consider something along these lines

Dear ComReg

I would like to formally complain about the conduct of Eircom (the incumbent) and their refusal to provide me with a broadband (DSL) connection.

On or about the xxth of xxxx 2003 I entered my details in eircom's online adsl checker and was informed that my line ( the copper cable provided by Eircom ) was adequate in all respects to meet the minimum standards necessary for them to provide me with DSL.

To the best of my recollection eircom's response to the test began with the words "Congratulations, you've passed....."

I NEED DSL. I need it for many reasons. I need it because.........

For various reasons it took me some weeks to reach the point where I was ready to place an order. As you are well aware the start-up costs are not insignificant and this contributed to the delay.

To my shock, horror and utter amazement, the eircom agent was unable to process my order because my line "failed the pre-qual test". I have since made a number of attempts to get a response from eircom as to the possible reasons for this failure, given that the self same line passed the test a few weeks previously. I have failed to elicit anything approaching a rational explanation. Eircom have been singularly unhelpful and have point blank refused to conduct any further testing.

I am deeply concerned that there may be a more sinister aspect to this. Currently I pay eircom a significant amount of money each month because I use the internet extensively for (... reasons...). The reality is that if I were to switch to a DSL based service, because it is a fixed price service, eircom would actually extract LESS revenue from me. Obviously I am not in a position to prove this, but it is a real concern for me that I am being denied access to this essential service for the most inappropriate of reasons..

I am hereby lodging a formal complaint with you in relation to this matter. I would urge and plead with you to investigate this matter on my behalf to the fullest possible extent, to the point where you can satisfy the obvious concerns which the matter raises.

My first and foremost concern is to get a working DSL connection to my premises. Your assistance in achieving this objective would be greatly appreciated. Failing that, a clear, unambiguous and rational explanation would go some way towards satisfying my concerns regarding the inexplicable deterioration of my line..

Should you require any clarification I am available to be contacted at any time on the following numbers....

Yours…………

You will obviously need to modify the words to suit your specific case.

Hope that this helps.

shinzon

Comreg has made a complaint on my behalf to eircom over this whole business, eircom has ten days to reply to that complaint.

Im just wondering what if eircom doesnt reply does comreg take it further or just drop it.

SHIN

super_canard

Originally posted by De Rebel
Not true, in reality.

(1) any court would take a David and Goliath view of the situation. As Goliath, eircom would be expected to have the wit and the means to inform you of your contractual obligations. if they fail to do so, its their loss. Not a legal certainty, but the balance is in your favour as the "small man".

(2) The USO kicks in. They USO obliges them in many instances to provide you with a service. De facto, they have a relationship with you, and for them to suddenly terminate that would leave them with a lot of explaining to do.

I pretty much understand what you mean :-)

But as their is no contract, legally no patries (them or me), are bind to anything... right?

shinzon

Received new correspondence from the dail today, it seems that dermot aherne has being receiving my e-mail from half a dozen ministers and has been actually looking into my case and will have some news either way for me next week

Progress I bloody hope so

SHIN

super_canard

Let me guess :

Dear Mr ###

I wish to acknoledge receipt of your further correspondence dated '''''''''''' regarding ###############, the content of which has been noted.

the matter is currently receiving attention and we will be back in touch.

Yours sincerely.....


dermot Ahern... Etc...

shinzon

in a word


NO

El_MUERkO

lol you got the minister dealing with your problem, if Bertie hosts you a fund raising concert i'll be truely impressed.

Paddy20

shinzon,

Well done, keep fighting for your rights and civil liberties.

I for one am impressed already. For you are in reality campaigning for a fair deal for US ALL.

Good luck,

N.B.:- I hope the Mr Ahern in question takes you out too lunch as well. Lets face facts, you have probably given him some more ammunition that he can use to further his political career and reputation.;)

MadsL

Once again Shinzon, much respect for fighting the powers...

shinzon

The only reason i did all this was because i got so angry when eircom denied me broadband when they passed me earlier.

I never undertook anything like this before. let alone sent an e-mail to the government ministers or comreg (didnt even know we had a comreg until i came here and started posting)

I do hope at the end of the day that my main goal will have suceeded (namely broadband for myself greedy git lol).

But at the same time i hope it at least shows guys like synkronite that there are ways and means to have your voice heard, that you dont have to take the crap eircom dishes out

You can have dsl, its just some of us need to fight a little harder to get it

On a bit of very good news and i hope DE REBEL doesnt mind me mentioning this, but with the help of comreg he now has BROADBAND so congratulations to him as hes given me renewed vigour to carry on.

God i hope this doesnt sound like a swelled head

SHIN

Paddy20

shinzon,

Quote:- " God I hope this doesnt sound like a swelled head "?.

Answer:- A braveheart morelike!, and may the sun always shine on your parade.

Keep it up.

Paddy20;)

super_canard

Originally posted by shinzon
in a word


NO

that Ain't fair... why am I the only one receiving the standard letters? :-D

qwertyup

Somewhat in the same boat as some of the others in this thread.

Got a normal line, and a separate ISDN line. Both fail the test according to Eircom.

However, upon checking with a neighbour, I found that it is definitely not the local copper/distance causing the problem. He said that initially, like shinzon, he passed, but a few weeks later failed. After a few weeks of rigmarole, he eventually got a second line installed, which passed the tests.

So what I am wondering is, why is my line failing, and what if anything can I do about this. The house is somewhat wired to the moon with regards to sockets and whatnot, on both the ISDN and normal line.

Since I want to ditch the IDSN anyway, is there any chance that getting the line downgraded to a PSTN line get it to pass the tests? Or do I need to take the plunge, get a third line, hope to god that it passes and I can ditch the others?

Sorry to derail this a bit, but I didn't really see another suitable thread, or that this was worthy of one of its own.

Plus Shinzon, maybe you should consider getting a second line and get that tested if you are in a similar situation?

shinzon

Im just passing on other info that ive seen in different threads on the matter

The second time i rang 1901 to get it tested for faults, the person said that it came back as a fault, i unplugged my interent connection from the socket and it passed for no faults but still failed for BB.

If as you say the house is wired to the moon, then unplug everything thats in a phone socket, ISDN any extensions, eircoms phonewatch, sky digital, electric applainces that are anywhere near your phone sockets (trust me that last one sounds crazy but ive had it quite a few times with people ringing in to my work wondering why there lines failed and theyve had something electrical plugged in near the phone socket, plugged it out and voila the line passed)

As regards the second phone line, on another thread could be this one a couple of pages back a guy rang in asking would putting in a second line and doing the BB test on that work, the Drone said they couldnt guarantee that it would, so im reluctant to shell out if it aint gonna work

SHIN

Synkronite

Make sure when you ask them to do the BB test, it's a *live* test; normal monkeys wont do this for you, so you have to go right to the top, confirm with them ten times that it was a live test.. qwertyup make sure you explain to them that this has been known to cause problems and that friends of yours have had the same problems, and when they 'cleaned up' their settings everything was fine.

As my case has been going parallel with Shin, today talking to eircom I actually mentioned I had some friends both in Cork and Waterford who couldnt get DSL and are now in the process of being able to get it (as they deserved since they originally passed).. Eircom are taking my case, unfortunately I wont be able to keep tabs as Iv got cramming for exams after a year of drinking, but believe me come May 21st, I'll be drinking by night and pestering eircom by day until I get ADSL.

Super_carnad Ive talked to you before, forget civil disobedience, wont work with eircom, they're making enough of ol joe soap logging onto eircom *cough* 4c/min *cough* free internet to come after the few of us who refuse to pay our bills.. Keep pestering them, demanding information, whatnot.. A drastic action I might take is that under the Data Protection and Freedom of Personal Information Laws -demand- eircom give me everything they have about my account, including but not limited to, customer service rep comments (each time they logged our calls), complaints (how they were dealt) and technical details (techs/engineers usually do checks, and report back*)

*I know this first hand because of a telecommunications company I worked for part-time, normal stuff, like noise level, etc would be recorded just for information, Im sure eircom do the same.. Also stuff like 'User complained about line speeds for internet, tech boosted line speed from 32k to 64k wireless'

If only eircom would understand if they made a long term investment in us and promoting broadband, it'll be revenue for them in the future (unless ofcourse they plan on milking as much money from us until demand for cheap affordable prices becomes so much they sell the company and retire in the bahamas)

*edit [to address qwertyup] Eircom give no garuntee that if you downgrade from ISDN to PTSN that you will pass the test, and afaik will charge you to upgrade to ISDN again; some people are mentioning testing for ISDN, so that may be an option.. As for getting another line installed, Im not sure how much it costs, I think most modern houses have 2 lines of copper going into them, but I could be wrong. So it depends on the cost; if they offered to install another line for free (or cheap) I might take it up on the chance of getting BB, if they charge me something ridiculous (read e100+) I wouldnt take the chance, atleast not until Ive tried pestering eircom into doing everything possible to try and get me broadband on my normal line..

qwertyup

Thanks for the advice. Would I be wrong in assuming that the problem is the wiring in my house, given that it is evidently possible to get it in my area? And if so, is this not something I can rectify for myself?

I've been looking at the wiring just as it comes into the house, and it seems to be a bit of a mess. Out of curiosity, just what is this box? The line at the top seems to be coming from the floor, and runs up beside the IDSN line which goes into the near box in the second photo. The far one is the phone line I think, and the connector seems tob e held in with sellotape!





I'm going to try to get back onto Eircom later today, or on Tuesday.

super_canard

Dam this nearly look worse than my installation LOL

De Rebel

Originally posted by shinzon
On a bit of very good news and i hope DE REBEL doesnt mind me mentioning this, but with the help of comreg he now has BROADBAND so congratulations to him as hes given me renewed vigour to carry on.

NOT a problem Shin (full story here) Hope your crusade is as successful.

Paddy20

qwertyup,

Why not send Eircoms technical bods/department, *The photos! they speak volumes, look a mess and if it was Eircom engineers that left your installation like that. Then they should be ashamedof themselves?..

Just remember, a photo is worth a thousand words - and in your case your photos could be worth a lot more, as I think the media would love them if they reflect the workmanship and service to be expected or suffered by Eircoms customers?..

Good luck.

Paddy20:ninja:

shinzon

Ive just been messing about with eircoms onlne test thingy, and have been putting in random numbers for accounts but the phone numbers have been genuine 051 numbers, each 051 number has come back as a fail

Whether this has to do with the random account numbers i dont know, but it seems strange that it accepted it and the genuine 051 numbers failed

Both the numbers ive tried are at opposite ends of waterford and they came back as a fail, does that mean no one can get it here

Strange thing to note

SHIN

CutterIE

shinzon, what is a 051 ? I ask this because a few days ago I phoned 1471 on my home phone to see if I'd missed any calls and the last number received was from 051, At the time I was waiting for eircom to switch on my ADSL.

Thanks
Will

sceptre

Originally posted by CutterIE
shinzon, what is a 051 ?

051 is the STD code (or whatever they call it these days) for Waterford.

shinzon

its the area code for waterford, sorry didnt see this question earlier cutter

shin

spongebob

Originally posted by qwertyup
Thanks for the advice. Would I be wrong in assuming that the problem is the wiring in my house, given that it is evidently possible to get it in my area? And if so, is this not something I can rectify for myself?

Picture one is an old style 1960's/1970's (maybe early 1980's)junction box from when phone were hardwired and not plugged into an RJ11 socket. The white cable running down is "twin twist" also used for doorbells of that vintage. I would swap the lot out , modern cable would be neater and have better characteristics.

Picture two is a pair of 'Mod Tap' boxes (with RJ11 connections) these are fine and may be reused with the newer wire .

Ensure all internal sockets are In Series . Mod Taps may not have enough internal conections to do this properly, ask an electrician for advice on the best sockets to get. These series sockets may require a gizmo called a Krone Tool which punches the cables in and strips/trims them simultaneously .

The very last socket in the series (maybe in an upstairs bedroom) may be a Mod Tap as there are no further connections.

HTH

M

qwertyup

Thanks for the information Muck. Any idea where I could get a new juncion box? I tried peats.ie, and maplins, with no success. I even popped into Power City when I passed it in the vague hope that I could find something, but no dice sadly.

I'd just prefer to avoid the additional cost of an electrician if I can.

DSLinAbsentia

I got some in Woodies DIY. Kinda surprised Peats didn't have them. Doubt you'd find them online though. Try Peats wholesale (think it's still across the road) - they've got all the funky stuff.

fatguy

I just wanted to remind you all of the difference between Eircom and Eircom Net. For strict legal reasons, Eircom Net cannot receive any preferential treatment from Eircom. This includes information as well as services.

The person you are chatting to is a tech at Eircom Net DSL support. They have a web page that checks phone numbers against a database of line checks. That database is provided by Eircom. Eircom Net cannot run line checks, and cannot get someone from Eircom to check your line again. As you were told it costs €70 to get one done, and they can't be wasting that kind of money on what will essentially be a futile exercise. If the line failed once, there's little or no chance it will have fixed itself.

There is clearly a difference between Eircom Net's database and IOL's. You seem to be assuming that Eircom Net's is the one that is wrong. Just be aware of all possibilities.

De Rebel

Originally posted by fatguy
I just wanted to remind you all of the difference between Eircom and Eircom Net. For strict legal reasons, Eircom Net cannot receive any preferential treatment from Eircom. This includes information as well as services.

The person you are chatting to is a tech at Eircom Net DSL support. They have a web page that checks phone numbers against a database of line checks. That database is provided by Eircom. Eircom Net cannot run line checks, and cannot get someone from Eircom to check your line again. As you were told it costs €70 to get one done, and they can't be wasting that kind of money on what will essentially be a futile exercise. If the line failed once, there's little or no chance it will have fixed itself.

There is clearly a difference between Eircom Net's database and IOL's. You seem to be assuming that Eircom Net's is the one that is wrong. Just be aware of all possibilities.

NOWHERE in any of the i-stream documentation, support material, terms & conditions, website, etc. is Eircom Net mentioned. IN ALL cases ALL references are to Eircom and/or Eircom Limited. In addition, the DSL service is being invoiced by Eircom Limited. It is perfectly reasonable that people insist on a conclusive answer and a retest when told that their lines fail. If Eircom Net happen to be doing some support work on behalf of Eircom that is not a legal constraint. The contract is between the customer and Eircom Limited.

Welcome to the IOFFL Board. One of the big problems here is the complete lack of anyone to represent Eircom's perspective. It has done Eircom a LOT of damage.