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Donald Rumsfeld dies

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  • Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Labaik wrote: »
    Don't forget that congress report in the 90s that unveiled the US was supplying Saddam with Anthrax.

    Multiple countries were west to east , funny how these despot rulers militaries were trained and supplied by Moscow too


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,693 ✭✭✭buried


    Gatling wrote: »
    Multiple countries were west to east , funny how these despot rulers militaries were trained and supplied by Moscow too

    That's fair enough Gat, but only one of those entities portrayed itself as 'the ambassador of the free world' under the cloak of so called 'global democracy'.

    What is actually funny is at the same time in the mid-80's when the United States of America was trying to convince itself they were somehow righteous in getting involved in all sorts of global murderous criminality in order to "combat the threat from Moscow", the USSR was falling in top of its own ar$e and neither the US/British intelligence services were able to cop that this was happening.

    "You have disgraced yourselves again" - W. B. Yeats



  • Registered Users Posts: 273 ✭✭Labaik


    Gatling wrote: »
    Multiple countries were west to east , funny how these despot rulers militaries were trained and supplied by Moscow too

    Yea and there scum too, but you just called Rumsfeld wiley and shrewd and not a war criminal when he was helping Saddam gas Iranians and then went onto murder 5000 Kurdish civilians in Halabja in a chemical weapon attack. Still think hes not a war criminal?


  • Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    buried wrote: »
    That's fair enough Gat, but only one of those entities portrayed itself as 'the ambassador of the free world' under the cloak of so called 'global democracy'.

    What is actually funny is at the same time in the mid-80's when the United States of America was trying to convince itself they were somehow righteous in getting involved in all sorts of global murderous criminality in order to "combat the threat from Moscow", the USSR was falling in top of its own ar$e and neither the US/British intelligence services were able to cop that this was happening.

    Totally agree ,I'm never going to defend American foreign policies , While America was off on its crusades against communism , other countries were flooding countries with weapons and technology ,if it wasn't for the Israelies Saddam would have gotten nukes ,my point is from the middle to Africa many countries were flooded with russian weaponry as well as American , Belgian , french and Swiss to a degree ,
    It's believed the gas Saddam used in Halabja 1988= was a mix of mustard and vx earlier in the same year Cuban forces used the same compound against forces in Angola ,
    We know that America were not supplying cuba with weapons or technology at the time ,
    America just had to sit back and watch Soviet Russia collapse and the fall of Berlin wall to Ukraine gaining independence without guns and bombs , but no they didn't see the obvious was happening in front of their own eyes as you said you above


  • Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Labaik wrote: »
    Yea and there scum too, but you just called Rumsfeld wiley and shrewd

    He was he sat at the big table for 40 years ,he was only one voice ,there was plenty of people to say no this is not the way to go ,
    I supported the removal of the Taliban from Afghanistan but not the tieing the Hands of the military behind their backs while blindfolded and ask to fight someone they know nothing about ,
    But America didn't cause Afghanistan ,that came thought the russian , America was involved but they didn't massacre the democratic government nor did they take a scorched earth policy against the Afghans and literally bombed the country back to the stone age , before leaving with their tails between their legs


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  • Registered Users Posts: 9,693 ✭✭✭buried


    Gatling wrote: »
    America just had to sit back and watch Soviet Russia collapse and the fall of Berlin wall to Ukraine gaining independence without guns and bombs , but no they didn't see the obvious was happening in front of their own eyes as you said you above

    But this is the thing Gat, it just shows how totally and utterly inept they were in any way to try to proclaim themselves as the guardians of anything when they couldn't even keep tabs on the regime that they were most concerned about. This (IMO) was the catalyst of the ultimate dive into the chaotic and untrustworthy world we currently now all have to inhabit in the West. Rumsfeld was centre stage in the establishment setup when this was going on. He deserves no plaudits. None of them involved from that timeframe do.

    "You have disgraced yourselves again" - W. B. Yeats



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,456 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    Gatling wrote: »
    He was he sat at the big table for 40 years ,he was only one voice ,there was plenty of people to say no this is not the way to go ,
    I supported the removal of the Taliban from Afghanistan but not the tieing the Hands of the military behind their backs while blindfolded and ask to fight someone they know nothing about ,
    But America didn't cause Afghanistan ,that came thought the russian , America was involved but they didn't massacre the democratic government nor did they take a scorched earth policy against the Afghans and literally bombed the country back to the stone age , before leaving with their tails between their legs

    Isn't that what's happening though?


  • Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Isn't that what's happening though?

    No on the scale done by the Russians, they bombed towns , villages into submission up to and including using chemical weapons , irrigation systems and other content civilian infrastructure were destroyed ,,and millions of landmines were planted most were never marked and mapped , still people are dying from russian mines dating back to the 70's
    We've not seen indiscriminate bombings and gunship attacks ,
    And yes there has been civilians killed in US actions but definitely not on the Russian scale of damage done ,
    And at least NATO has been building electricity grids and rebuilding infrastructure for civilian use , hospitals and schools which repeatedly get blown up by the Taliban


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    America fuk yeah. Here to save the motherfukin day yeah.... :D


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,324 ✭✭✭Shebean


    The man made a fortune scamming the American public, dealing in death and using American service men and women as pawns to enrich himself.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 19,038 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    Absolutely no loss whatsoever.


  • Registered Users Posts: 273 ✭✭Labaik


    Gatling wrote: »
    No on the scale done by the Russians, they bombed towns , villages into submission up to and including using chemical weapons , irrigation systems and other content civilian infrastructure were destroyed ,,and millions of landmines were planted most were never marked and mapped , still people are dying from russian mines dating back to the 70's
    We've not seen indiscriminate bombings and gunship attacks ,
    And yes there has been civilians killed in US actions but definitely not on the Russian scale of damage done ,
    And at least NATO has been building electricity grids and rebuilding infrastructure for civilian use , hospitals and schools which repeatedly get blown up by the Taliban

    You spelled the Soviet Union wrong.

    The Soviet Union was a despotic regime, just like your best friends in Washington.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,184 ✭✭✭85603




    he never actually denied being a lizard.


  • Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Labaik wrote: »

    The Soviet Union was a despotic regime,

    Still the same today only Eastern Europe and the Baltics are free


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,033 ✭✭✭joseywhales


    MAULBROOK wrote: »
    Look like he found his known known.

    Death is surely the known unknown.


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,857 ✭✭✭✭Zebra3


    Labaik wrote: »
    Listen when Saddam was gassing the Iranians the US did "NOTHING". Rumsfeld was providing Saddam with info on Iranian troop movement so he could use chemical weapons on them.

    The US also defended Saddam at the UN.

    Defending him from his crimes against Iran and against his own people.


  • Registered Users Posts: 273 ✭✭Labaik


    Zebra3 wrote: »
    The US also defended Saddam at the UN.

    Defending him from his crimes against Iran and against his own people.

    And still continue to prop up the most despotic regime in the middle east.


  • Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Labaik wrote: »
    And still continue to prop up the most despotic regime in the middle east.

    Assad


  • Registered Users Posts: 273 ✭✭Labaik


    Gatling wrote: »
    Assad

    When was the last time Assad chopped up a journalist in a foreign country.


  • Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Labaik wrote: »
    When was the last time Assad chopped up a journalist in a foreign country.

    Butchered his own population, tortured tens of thousands,bombed civilian markets,used chemical weapons against his own population.
    Killed foreign journalists reporting on his war crimes.
    Only putin and Kim in North Korea match him


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  • Registered Users Posts: 273 ✭✭Labaik


    Gatling wrote: »
    Butchered his own population, tortured tens of thousands,bombed civilian markets,used chemical weapons against his own population.
    Killed foreign journalists reporting on his war crimes.
    Only putin and Kim in North Korea match him

    Wow. The western propaganda machine is impressive.


  • Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Labaik wrote: »
    Wow. The western propaganda machine is impressive.

    Oh so your denying it .....


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,135 ✭✭✭323


    Ahh, It's just business (American style).

    Oddly, first thought when seen Rumsfeld mentioned is Aspartame. Which long term, looking like will be the cause of many times more misery and deaths than all of Rumsfeld's weapons dealing and war mongering combined.

    “Follow the trend lines, not the headlines,”



  • Posts: 6,192 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    AFAIK the chemical weapon attack accusations againest assad have largly been rubbished.....wee bit like saddams weapons of mass destruction



  • Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    For most part they haven't , plenty of Russian propaganda or sponsored articles claiming they didn't happen , meanwhile russia have spent serious efforts blocking any and all investigations into chemical weapons attacks similar to what they did during the MH17 investigations , remember how that didn't happen either 😆



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,152 ✭✭✭✭jmayo


    This post screams out at me for this one line ....

    Or is just rich, white Americans who have the right to bomb Iraq ?

    Why did the poster have to reference skin colour in this discussion?

    I know this is going off on tangent and dragging in another contentious issue here but why even reference skin colour or race of Americans?

    Does the poster not realise the great love of the left and all thing PC, one President Obama, who of course is not a white American was responsible for thousands of drone strikes around the world ?

    Anyway on topic good riddance to Rumsfeld and all the other Military Industrial complex stooges.



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,376 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm


    It is like Rumsfeld's death has filled the 'Trump void' for some Irish citizens posting on boards.ie. Each to their own.

    For me when I think of the Iraq war it is the search for WMD:


    South Park did a great take on it.


    Later Rumsfeld backtracked and denied there was WMD and said he never said it.



    And also the information minister for Iraq was also entertaining.




    I cannot find the clip but I seem to remember he was giving a live interview on SKY NEWS with explosions going on behind him - saying that they are winning the war. And the American's were being driven out of Bagdad.

    --

    Never mind all the lives lost and unnecessary destruction. As far as I remember the coverage of the war was very entertaining. The main players the American/UK and Iraqi regimes deserve thanks for that.


    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,456 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    The war coverage was "entertaining", what a shìtty thing to say, always great fun to see people die from the comfort of your living room I suppose.



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,376 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm


    i never said that. But it is entertaining and it is in part why this thread was created. As debating Rumsfeld and the WMD legacy is a form of 'entertainment' in itself.

    It enables observers to in most cases take the 'moral high ground' and say isn't that terrible etc. When in reality the whole issue around the war and/or the rights and wrongs of it is/was an extremely complex one. Both sides did not cover themselves in glory imho. And at the time of the war the media in the Western World lapped it up because it sold papers and got high tv viewing figures.

    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 25,456 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    You literally said


    "As far as I remember the coverage of the war was very entertaining."



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