Lions Tour

I stuck with trophies initially as someone else mentioned trophies. Fine, I probably should have included the drawn series in NZ when I mentioned stuff like the RWCs, but does that really change the substantive point much, if at all. The guy has strengths and weaknesses. He's done some great things and had some pretty average days too. The bizarre thing about Gatland is that he polarises people into talking about either how great he is or how awful he is, with both completely ignoring facts that don't suit their agenda. I've no idea why he does and why people can't recognise things like how good his Welsh sides had been against NH opposition at times but how he was never really able to replicate that against SH opposition at all. I'm not saying he is terrible by any means. Just that he has done really well some times and not great others.

I'd agree with Gatland being the right kind of guy for the Lions, far more than Schmidt. Gatland has a real ability to galvanise a side in ways few other coaches can. Schmidt is a detail guy and he wouldn't really have the time to pull that all together on a tour like this. In the modern game, trying to pull a squad together from different countries in a short period to play a quality, settled team that are one of, if not the best in the world is beyond difficult. Gatland can do it so that squad is competitive. I'm not sure who else could.

Very good team but they had peaked a few years earlier. I’m not sure you can argue with that. Was a very good Lions squad too compared to this tour.

I completely understand why Gatland is disliked by many in Irish rugby. He has mellowed with age (and possibly a little more humility after the Chiefs debacle of a season) but certainly was antagonistic and inflammatory towards his opponents. I think most people harbour bitterness towards him based on his selections however. There's a bizarre belief that it's personal even when there's a genuine logic at play for his omission of specific players. Henderson, BOD and now Beirne are players who didn't get selected at key moments and Irish fans refuse to accept the rationale for looking to other players.

However, I will never get the insistence from some to try and undermine his achievements and successes. Did he knock it out of the park every season? Absolutely not. In fact, if an Irish coach had some of his seasons, he'd have been sacked. For example, they won the GS in 2008 but finished 4th for the next 3 seasons. They also only beat Australia once and Argentina once from top tier opposition in those 3 years of autumn tests (which included only drawing with Fiji in Cardiff).

But that doesn't mean Wales didn't deliver to an incredibly high level under his guidance at key times also. His ability to motivate his teams and get key selections/calls right on the biggest stage is exceptional. He brought Wales to 2 RWC semi finals and they were 4 minutes away from another in 2015 against South Africa. He brought a Lions team close to a series win in NZ. NZ have only failed to beat the Lions on 11 of 41 occasions in history and 2 of those 11 were against Gatland. It doesn't matter if there was a dubious call in the last minute of the game to secure the draw. The fact is that they did. There are dodgy calls in plenty of games. He brought Wasps from having finished 7th the previous season to being champions three times in a row as well as European champions.

People can call him lucky, boring, whatever they want. The statistics and trophy cabinets are going to utlimately reflect his career more than anything.

There's not an achievement in rugby where luck hasn't played some part.

If you're happy to dismiss the Lions achievement in 2017 I hope you're as happy to chalk off all the other ones

Gatland is a better coach than Schmidt.

Gatland was one red card and one last minute penalty away from having Wales in 2 World Cup Finals.

Joe got annihilated in the 1/4s in both his World Cups.

Gatland also got Wales out of the group of death and knocked out the hosts in 2015 with one of the biggest injury crisis ever.

Gatland also has 2 more Grand Slams.

You can try to make it nothing to do with Gatland if you like

but he still did it.

2 RWC semi-finals vs 2 quarter-final thrashings

I see the table functionality has changed. I've taken a lot of rubbish from this new upgrade, but some things are sacred. Feck this!