Is anyone else starting to become a bit worried? mod note in first post

Isn't the real problem though that increased regulation and cleaning out of criminals will reduce the demand and consequently value of crypto assets. This isn't some high minded libertarian motivated objection - it's just greed.

cnocbui wrote: »

Do you believe there is significantly less money laundering, prostitution and drug use than 20 years ago because of the success of increasingly obstructive and punitive legislation? Really?

No. You are making a bizarre argument that because a type of crime exists, then measures to reduce it don't work. Which is, of course, ridiculous.

The use case for crypto is not 100% ransomware, tax evasion, gambling, child porn & the dark web……but i think one would be completely ignorant of the facts to not admit that 95% of use cases/transactions, currently, fit into one of those buckets…….lets be kind and call the gambling bucket asset appreciation/investing.

The question or debate is not the statement above - the real question is whether bitcoins usefulness /advantages are sufficiently significant enough to negate its downsides……………..which is indeed as a better widget for the carrying on of crime than the previous solution….. cash or bank transfers.

You dont think so? - why the payment method of choice for Colonial Pipeline/ HSE attack……because the cyber hackers are stupid? No because they’re smart and crypto is the better vehicle for crime over and above cash/bank transfer. Not perfect but incrementally more likely to not get them caught & deliver expected returns.

Please dont tell me that the Colonial Pipeline BTC was eventually recovered - the point is the best monetary instrument available right now to scumbags is a some form of crypto…….yet crypto has failed to trickle down and demonstrate real benefits to the non-laser beam eyed masses……and please dont tell me about a handful of people in bitcoin beach in El Salvador who use crypto to pay for tomatoes. I’m talking about your ole one sending money to her friend for bingo and telling you how great it is and how easy. That’s when tech advances truly become mainstream…like your ole one getting a smartphone and getting the Lotto number on her phone……….society can tolerate the downsides created by any tech……advancements like the internet, mobile phones, automobiles……..wonderful advances which have some negative consequences but to all rational observers are clearly out weighed by the advantages.

Cash before people bring it up - was/is a wonderful advancement………….it of course facilities bad things and bad people but its invention supports today something like 20% of commerce value…..close to 99% not so long ago…..………but if CASH went away tomorrow your gonna find normal life greatly disrupted and less convenient.

If crypto disappeared tomorrow from Ireland - tell me of the 5 million people in the Republic - how many people would know? and more importantly how many would be impacted in terms of how they go about their daily commerce……like basically nobody…..0.0001%

This is the real issue for BTC - it has failed to gain mass popular adoption (yet) such that its downsides can be explained away by its benefits. It fails the “ole one test” and so remains vulnerable to regulatory action because no one can point to how anybody in the normal world will be impacted if it went away. This is the big downside for Bitcoin………..its still desperately trying to find, in Silicon Valley terms, product market fit. That’s its risen 300 or 400% in the last twelve months is beside the point, so what - so has Tesla, Plug Power, Nio, GameStop, AMC. Just because a crowd start chasing an asset class upwards….buying and selling to each other……..it doesn’t signal anything……its just noise and the madness of crowds. Its especially crazy when I feel, as I’ve mentioned before in this thread, that the regulatory authorities are doing the math on BTC……pluses & minuses and weighing up the right course of action for their respective societies……..the answer currently is as I’ve covered already is not good for BTC/crypto……the questions asked are:

’what does crypto help with again exactly?”
“What problem does is solve that isn’t currently being solved by other payment instruments/solutions”
‘Who uses crypto and for what exactly anyway’
‘why is it better again than cash/electronic transfer/credit/debit cards’

The irony is the questions above would be asked by the average dragons den investor looking at any ‘new’ product…….the answer, if anyone cared to answer, would be in my opionion very flimsy for BTC right now…….and the entrepreneurial investor would say your crazy and pass.

Crypto.com has made a $100 m advertising sponsorship deal with a Formula One racing team, Aston Martin.

Does that give crypto a James Bond 007 imprimatur/cred ?

https://www.forbes.com/sites/bryancampbell/2021/06/29/cryptocurrency-is-expanding-its-presence-in-formula-one-with-a-100-million-deal/

Deleted User wrote: »

This is bad news?

It might crash?

Or maybe they all have the same information on what is and isn't going on there

http://www.centralbank.ie/news/article/blog-digital-money

Central Bank of Ireland describing the activity around cryptos like bitcoin as having "some characteristics similar to the excitement generated by tulips in the seventeenth century". That blog post shows the regulatory lay of the land and understanding of the regulator from an Irish perspective. I don't think I agree with it but it is important to note as it indicates they are concerned which could be a sign of what the inevitable regulation will look like. This is likely to be consistent with how other EU regulators are viewing cryptos.

What a joke of an article. Comparing crypto to collecting stamps! It's obvious they understand the technology but are trying to spook the public away from the space.

What's the story with the trial, are they rolling it out in a few countries to see how it goes? I don't get the point of CBDCs at all, basically a quicker version of online banking. So much for crypto getting rid of the middle men!

Paypal hiring crypto experts makes sense though, they can't afford to be left behind.

It's based on trust of a system that regulates the supply and adheres to regulations/laws/rules/controls/etc. When an economy doesn't adhere, then there can be issues (e.g. Germany in the 30's, Zimbabwe in the 90's, Venezuela recently). Works well if done correctly.

Banks can create credit from deposits they hold because they know that not everyone will be removing all their money at once. There are limitations and controls on this. This credit allows the money supply to expand. A fixed or inflexible money supply would be a nightmare.

Can look up any of this info online (use good quality sources of course)

All countries print/create their currencies, that's how it's made. It has to be done correctly.

Conversely, cryptos are usually created out of thin air or via artificial systems (mining) by private individuals or companies with little or no regulation. In terms of functioning as a currency, most cryptos are technologically advanced, but economically quite backwards. Most (non-stablecoins) have little in common with modern currencies and are more akin to speculative tokens with artificial supply caps. Basically volatile assets with no stability mechanisms or fluid supplies. Which is why we gamble on them as speculative investments and don't use most to pay for sandwiches.

This is will be the selling point for the public (and it indeed is a genuine advantage).

What they won't say is that it also gives the central bank full visibility (and control) over all monetary transactions. This has massive implications in terms of surveillance capabilities but also in terms of control (for exemple they could apply negative interest rates to all balances whereas currently they can't as people always have cash as a way to avoid it, issue cash with a limited lifespan, prevent an organisation from receiving payments, revert certain transactions, etc).

They would rather all of us keep our money in the bank where it can be loaned out while it's depreciating due to insane inflation.

The banks are being threatened by the massive outflow of capital.

In the current climate the last thing banks want is your money. And there is a difference between the mandates of a central bank and a commercial bank.

Where are you seeing "insane" inflation? If you think that current inflation is "insane" you should have a look to see where it used to go to before we joined the Euro!

Back to where we were at the start of the month. Might be a good opportunity to get some in for anyone who's been waiting for a correction recently.