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Sam Bennett - no same day spoilers

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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,565 ✭✭✭harringtonp


    "Sam’s behaviour and lack of respect to the team , when giving contradictory claims on updates on his injury, going against team protocol by going to an outside doctor (sports teams hate this) and giving different accounts in why he didn’t make it to Belgium… won’t endear him to other teams"

    In spite of presentation you do seem to have some understanding of what is going on. I'm trying hard to understand where there is "behaviour and lack of respect to the team". Behaviour and lack of respect can be demonstrated verbally but Sam has said nothing publicly so this is not the case here. I would say he has been very professional in not commenting on PLFs outbursts. So this leaves us with what we know about his actions.

    Regarding the "going to an outside doctor" I would see it as been at least careless if both he and the team doctor were in Monaco. But if there is any distance at all between them (e.g. Sam in Monaco/Ireland and the doctor in Belgium) going to a local doctor seems a very reasonable thing to do and something which any reasonable team manager should completely understand.

    Where are these "contradictory claims on updates to his injury", I would like to see them. I only saw a clear early statement from him which seems to have held up. And even if there have been minor alteration to injury reports as you go along, isn't that the nature of injuries as they progress.

    On failing to turn up "for the pre tour of Belgium meeting" why would anyone ever fly if they knew in their heart and soul they were not in a condition to ride the event. I certainly wouldn't. People ring in sick for work, they never travel in to show the office they are unwell and then travel home again. And this would be very short travel in comparison to the Bennett situation. Why would any reasonable team manager not take this word or expect him to show up.

    In spite of how he is and what he represents, something obviously rankles PLF. You may have a better feeling than most what this is, I for one would certainly be interested in knowing.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,611 ✭✭✭happytramp


    Given everything that lefevere has said over the years you'd almost have to be a friend or family member to automatically believe his assessment of any situation.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,196 ✭✭✭Junior




  • Registered Users Posts: 213 ✭✭sham58107


    According to Cycling News, ( coming from DQS) Sam still has to have knee operation ?? if so would he not have had this done before now ?? he has been off bike since March/April, seems strange if true. Really wonder what Bora make of it all !!

    On a side note with Soudal now going to partner DSQ anyone thing Caleb will go ? if so next year green jersey is gone .



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,387 ✭✭✭Macy0161


    It's not really that strange - the operation is probably last resort and/or something that would normally wait until the off season. Given Lefevere is unlikely to race him, why wait?

    I think Ewan is tied down long term. It was recent enough that a sponsor jumped between the two, and I don't recall riders moving (Omega Pharma went from Lotto to QS).



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  • Registered Users Posts: 859 ✭✭✭Randy Archer


    Which issues over the years was PLF to be found to be wrong or lying ? Ignore the salesman talk when he plays poor mouth about difficulty in getting sponsors

    list all these examples over the years .

    Odd that you’d have such superior insight for a chap who had no links or dealings with any personnel on the world tour

    Post edited by Randy Archer on


  • Registered Users Posts: 859 ✭✭✭Randy Archer


    Covid delays everything . I doubt his knee injury would have been seen as a priority for the medics or even the sports specialists who would work on him

    there might have been medical reasons not to go under the knife immediately ?

    you’d imagine a sportsman would get two or three opinions first because operation like that might seriously harm the sport career in the future or cut it short

    If Quick Step couldn’t afford to keep Bennett , they’d have no chance of affording Ewan )whose younger) unless Ewan made a decision based on better his career wins - and even then, he’s done brilliantly at Lotto , which is carrying a little too much dead weight based on name rather than form (guys in referring to are still top lads) - so company sponsor like Souddal or Quick Step themselves (who are no small timers in their industry) aren’t going to foot the bill for everything - neither guys have Sagan’s ability to charm and whore himself to endorse any product (nothing wrong with not being able to do so btw)

    Lotto have the good fortunate of having a year to replace their current sponsor , it’s not immediate , unlike the issues other teams have - John Lelangue’s (gm of the team and ex BMC ds and of course Floyd landis boss in 2006) outbursts against the Flemish press after a disaster our giro mightn’t endear him to them but to be fair what he said needed to be said

    this ain’t the first time that a big sponsor hopped from one team to the other between these two major Belgian clubs eg Omega Pharma were with Lotto in the year Gilbert won for fun in 2011 and then jumped to Quick step the next year



  • Registered Users Posts: 533 ✭✭✭Mr. Cats


    He was wrong or lying that Sam’s injury was all in his head, as shown by him now needing surgery.

    Odd that you’d miss that given you’re so in the know about everything.



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,708 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    I would be careful with those if you don't want to end up doing a Dumoulin



  • Registered Users Posts: 859 ✭✭✭Randy Archer


    Wrong , in hindsight in news that we know now , a month later . Lying ? No. How could he ?

    If Bennett acted professionally and manned up and told the team the truth (I have addressed all that above ) , this wouldn’t have been an issue . Jesus Sam couldn’t even give a straight answer for the reason that he missed the plane to attend Belgium Tour pre Tour meeting . He shouldn’t have missed it either , but that’s life and it happens . He didn’t go out of his way to catch another flight the next day and he gave contradictory explanation - good luck pulling those stunts at your work place (unless you are self employed )

    Bennett failed to provide evidence as to the extent of his injury and refused to meet with the team selectors and medics - what else were they suppose to do and think at the time of running his mouth off ? PLF is loud and a bit too direct

    It’s Sam’s conduct , and not the injury itself , that bears the brunt of PLF’s criticism . PLF clearly also had enough of Sam’s babbling and self doubt persona before the media

    Total lack of respect and no other team would have tolerated it / they might have been less public about it but the bridges would have burned

    Liar ? Serious claim to make

    I know you weren’t the one to raise the claim “has said over the years you'd almost have to be a friend or family member to automatically believe his assessment of any situation.” But got any other examples of assessments “over the years”



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  • Registered Users Posts: 533 ✭✭✭Mr. Cats


    No he was wrong and you are wrong. He said it was all in Bennett’s head. That was wrong. He should never have come out publicly with such a statement without knowing the facts. He’s just shown himself up. Sam has shown his class by not reacting to the obvious provocation.



  • Registered Users Posts: 859 ✭✭✭Randy Archer


    “I'm trying hard to understand where there is "behaviour and lack of respect to the team". Behaviour and lack of respect can be demonstrated verbally but Sam has said nothing publicly so this is not the case here. I would say he has been very professional in not commenting on PLFs outbursts. So this leaves us with what we know about his actions.”


    You clearly aren’t trying hard enough


    1. team isn’t just the riders
    2. Ignoring and refusing to adhere to team protocol and failing to attend team meetings to update them on his injury and giving contradictory explanations for those failures show complete disrespect for the team - particularly considering what they did for him - he’d have been rotting at Tour of Turkey 2020 and maybe a run at Vuelta (he inability to ride better races has nothing to do with any issues of Sam’s ability / make that clear before his fan boys display their speculator lying skills again)

    Sam can’t say a lot to defend the indefendable here . If what was said was untrue , that would damage most riders bar maybe Sagan , as not many teams would want to touch that .

    If what was said was untrue , you’d be damn sure the McQuids (his agent) would be suing and running to their pals in the press to get their POV across - as they would have every right to do in that case

    It’s his actions or specifically his inactions and not his words that drew the ire of PLF and the rest of staff and charge of unprofessionalism

    Its a great pity because even if Sam missed the rest of the season and left the team , he could still have said that he had a terrific season pre Tour . 2020 was his year and this had left a soar note

    PLF could have handled it better but , he is who he is . He has reasonable grounds to be pissed off with Bennett (again, not because he got injured )



  • Registered Users Posts: 533 ✭✭✭Mr. Cats


    So was PLF lying or wrong when he said it was in Sams head?



  • Registered Users Posts: 859 ✭✭✭Randy Archer


    If you have an issue with time lines , take it up with someone else ! Lying ? How ?

    The injury had not been conclusively confirmed when he made the comments .

    He expressed his his view when asked to comment about question marks over Sam’s availability , which Sam had not conclusively confirmed at that point ; concerning , in Sam’s public media words “minor incident during training” which caused a “short term injury”

    Sam acted in a weak and unprofessional professional (long list given above) . Leading up to the event . You try that with HR at your workplace (where they are entitled to assess you themselves and seek proofs ) see how far you’d get .

    There was still doubt as to the extent of the injury. Sam himself gave vague comments to the press leaving some hope that he’d line up at the last minute

    That’s not **** on! Not returning calls from your boss is a sackable offence

    This is the TDF not community games or some domestic race . It’s bad show when the team doctors and team owner can’t confirm or deny , within barely two weeks before the TDF (time of statements) whether their star man is going to turn up to the biggest race

    Its pretty weak to be stringing people along !

    And it’s pretty unfair on Cav to all of a sudden be mentally ready to do TDF at short notice (well, lesser guys would have got scared . He was only too delighted)

    There’d have been no suggestions or implications that he was faking it if Bennett and his team made it clear that he was injured to the extent that he couldn’t even chance the first week - even then PLF wouldn’t put out their guy only for him to quit early.

    Its not the first time out of contract riders through a stripe and refuse to ride , even for the TDF . Plf had very reason to be suspicious and every right to call out the lack of respect that was shown to him and the team



  • Registered Users Posts: 533 ✭✭✭Mr. Cats


    “I can’t prove he doesn’t have knee pain,” Lefevere said last week. “But I’m starting to think more and more that it’s more fear of failure than just pain.”

    So he was just wrong then and not lying?



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 11,667 Mod ✭✭✭✭RobFowl


    Randy Andy simply doesn't like Sam but posted repeatedly about him on a Sam specific thread.

    We all know what you thnk, please stop repeating it and clogging up this thread with your negative vibes.....



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,444 ✭✭✭TheBlaaMan


    @Randy Archer Posting heaps of negative sh1te at 9:48AM and again at 10:17AM, 10:44AM, 11:01AM and 12:07PM and that's just today! ..........Do you really have NOTHING better to do?

    Boring.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,246 ✭✭✭CantGetNoSleep


    Looks like the Cavendish QuickStep negotiations are not going fantastically well either and PLF feels the need to negotiate via his newspaper column.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,565 ✭✭✭harringtonp


    He certainly goes about things in an unusual way, the Trump of cycling. I'd say he is the type of guy who falls out and makes up all the time. It wouldn't completely surprise me if Sam ended back there with them again at some future point (though his age probably makes that unlikely). If PLF bears grudges I would think he gets over them quickly when the situation suits.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,231 ✭✭✭deandean


    I hear that Sam is gonna be a father by the end of the year! Great news!



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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    A few places like Stickybottle and RTE reporting Sam will be racing the Euro's at the weekend, he wasn't named on the squad released the other day by CI?



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,387 ✭✭✭Macy0161


    Noticed that, probably that and the Worlds between now and the end of the season?



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,708 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    I don't see any point of him being at the worlds unless no one else wants to go



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,387 ✭✭✭Macy0161


    Perhaps, but he probably has the best chance of the options given his performance in Wevelgem? Anyway, it'd be another hard days racing in the legs for next year.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,301 ✭✭✭gordongekko


    We have qualified 6 there is plenty of room for him



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,708 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    6 for the worlds ?

    Is it the Euros you are thinking of



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    We're ranked 22nd so we get to send 4 for elite men's race for worlds, I assume the criteria for the European race is similar, can't find the criteria.


    EDIT: I see on procyclingstats Roche and Mullen are the only 2 confirmed to start so far.



  • Registered Users Posts: 20,052 ✭✭✭✭neris


    Who ever picked Sams photo for the rte spoty last year must have moved to the bbc




  • Registered Users Posts: 5,301 ✭✭✭gordongekko



    The cut off was a few weeks ago


    "In the elite men’s nations’ rankings Ireland was 17th on the Worlds team allocation cut-off date last week, which means we are permitted six riders in the road race and two in the TT."

    https://www.stickybottle.com/races-results/irish-allocation-for-world-champs-very-large-team-can-be-picked-this-year/



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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Ah good shout, we're currently 22nd I hadn't realised we were top 20 before the cut off in August. That definitely gives us 6 at the worlds. I'd imagine a fair few of those UCI points were Sam's and Dan's 4th place at La Vuelta would given us good few as well.



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