US and Nato withdrawal from Afghanistan...- threadbanned users in OP

I think their is plenty of blame to go around for various US presidents starting with Bush, then Obama, Trump and now Biden. All made huge errors in regards to Afghanistan.

To believe this you have to totally ignore how Trump handled Syria. Announced he was pulling out essentially overnight blindsiding both allies and other actors in the region. This led to complete chaos on the ground with Russia and others exerting influence, and Syria remains an absolute hellhole with the Kurds thrown to the wolves and with huge numbers of refugees. The media has moved on from Syria but it remains an epic failure by Trump.

The evidence suggests Trump would have done no better with Afghanistan seeing as how he is the one who signed a "peace deal" with the Taliban which excluded the actual Afghan government and basically gave them the green light to come back into power.

Do you honestly think Trump gave a second thought to the potential outcome?

He set the timetable for withdrawal, all the Taliban had to do was wait and pay lip service to the agreement they signed.

In fairness if you remove the entire existing administration you leave a power vacuum which can be worse than working with the old administration. It's pot luck which strategy works.

The contradictions in "thought" processes of US republican Trump supporters are mind boggling for anyone sane really. A short time ago they were calling the Democrats and Biden warmongers + looking for rapid as possible end to USs "world police" role in the Middle East and elsewhere and hang the consequences.

That's what is happening in Afghanistan. Presumably it will be continuing under Biden because he/the Democrats know that is actually what alot (edit: most?) of Americans (Trump supporters or not) want now i.e. a far more isolationist foreign policy esp. when it comes to deploying the US military.

As regards the disorderly withdrawal, maybe I'm wrong but that seems like an intelligence/military failure. Unless advice on how to carry out the withdrawal was ignored, that is the fault of people further down the chain than the 2 presidents (Trump/Biden) making a strategic decision the US presence in Afghanistan must come to an end. The US looks to have underestimated weakness of their Afghan government and army allies and misjudged the situation in the country.

I said it before and I'll say it again. The Taliban, by the US's own stats, number about 80,000 to 100,000 men. Men who have been mostly hiding out in the mountains for a decade. A group like that simply cannot take control of a country that size and with a population of nearly 40 million people without having the support from the majority of that population, even if that is only in lip service.

For those that don't support the Taliban, the panic set in very quickly and once that happens any "plan" you may have, or think you have, goes out the window.

As for Trump worshipping fools, it surely comes as no surprise that they'd start waving their little flags and concocting numerous fantasies in their heads about what Trump would have done. That type lives in cloud cuckoo land and their opinions aren't worth a damn.

A mess but the bigger question is, should the west continue to intervene in these islamic states? 20 years didn't change much, it could take another 50 of minding to have any hope of bringing Afghan out of the dark ages. Are the US going to do that?

Oh be quiet.

I'm no fan of Biden or the Democrats.

Ignorant Trumpette fantasies don't belong here.

What good would it do. It's just kicking the can if you cannot make lasting change which 20 years has proven they cant

You'd need to be pretty stupid to think you could sit on the wing of a plane as it flies at 35000 ft . Makes no sense

Remember when it comes to trump and his fans Obama invaded Afghanistan and got them into this mess in the first place ,

Trump negotiated with the Taliban ,trump negotiated not just senior Taliban to be released not just in Afghanistan but Pakistan too ,and thousands of fighters along with the hardcore leadership ,

The Pakistan government must now be looking saying oh **** what did we do ,not so long ago the Taliban almost over ran Pakistan ,and now 80,000 strong with access to thousands of modern armoured vehicles ,they have to the ability to make a move on several neighbors .

Trumpets can sit there biden did this and biden did that ,but the problem is trump did this ,he lay the foundations to screw ,NATO ,Kurds and now afgans.

Putin's advisors must be sitting there saying we could take Berlin in a few days