All Ireland Senior Hurling Championship (Liam McCarthy Cup) 2021

But this was a situation where the referee didn't see the incident, the linesman who did felt it should have been yellow cards to both while 1 umpire said he witnessed the head butt. From one camera angle it looked something like he moved his head towards the other player but other camera angles showed he was butted with the hurley and lurched forward. so its not reversing the referees decision as he didn't see it, he was going on what the umpire said, maybe the umpire had the same distorted angle too? maybe he now takes it back? who knows, but a player should probably not miss out on an all ireland because of it.

The people who saw the incident disagreed too on the sanction, linesman vs umpire

Sounds fair enough but Im sure all the lads here who were delighted to see him hang and seemed to know all the facts of the case wont now admit they were wrong and get over it

No, most of the rest of us have open minds. Up to now there was no cogent reason given for the overturning of the decision save for " t'would be an awful pity if he had to miss the final". The explanation now viz the linesman is new, and in light of that I can at least see how there was a stateable appeal. Still not sure it should have succeeded and should have supplanted the ref's decision - but again who knows what else was said / proved at the appeal, what was in ref's report, etc.

Just to make it clear though, no one, including you, made this argument for the appeal up to now. Had you done, a different discussion may well have ensued.

Admins could we stop people asking for tickets on this forum. It's bad enough that Facebook is full of these requests.

Firstly you can always find examples of a time a team beat the odds, you can do it for any team but it doesnt meat that the majority of times the odds were not right and the team lost

Secondly the current Cork team plyed in none of the games you listed so it means sweet FA in regards to Sunday. Its just more BS about how some teams have hereditary traits passed down through generations

You say history matters but then say Limerick have never beaten a "traditional power" in the final.

Well if history matters yes we have beaten Kilkenny in a final and have never met Tipp or Cork in an All Ireland final so you could equally say Cork have never beaten Limerick in a final.

Not sure what you think my narrative is as I don't have one

I have never dismissed Cork. I just believe if they do win which is possible although the less likely outcome it will happen because Cork are a good side and played better than Limerick on the day. It will not be because Cork won matches back in the 20th century or because of some magic Corkness.

This Cork team are good enough to win but they are the underdog and nothing any mystical Cork team in the past will change than.

And I don't have a narrative or agenda because I am not egotistical enough to believe anything I say on Boards will affect the outcome

There's a whiff of 2006 about some of the analysis I've been reading. That year, Cork going for three in a row were widely hailed as the most professional set-up of all time, having dragged hurling out of the dark ages with an innovative running game, and training methods that had made them fitter than any team in history. While it seems ridiculous now, KK were basically seen as a good bunch of players sponsored by the local creamery sent up to give the juggernaut a game. People kind of forget just how one-sided the analysis was in favour of Cork at the time, but reading the papers the weekend of the match, I remember only ONE player, journalist, or analyst going for Kilkenny (Damien Fitzhenry, for the record).

Cork aren't being written off to the same extent, but there is a distinct sense that Limerick FEEL unbeatable, and there's definitely a belief that they have a style of play and level of conditioning that no other team can really compete with consistently.

The thing is, I agree with that analysis: on any rational breakdown of the teams' strengths and weaknesses, Limerick are better. To me they play a fantastic, smart, physical, disciplined style of hurling and have a team built around some magnificent hurlers like Hayes, Gillane, etc. They should be fine in this. Cork got over the line against a Kilkenny team that won the softest Leinster championship in nearly a decade; it was a heroic performance, but KK got so much wrong tactically, allowing Downey to look like a hero, for instance, after he was roasted for 5 points early on.

But still...I don't think Cork came out of that match looking like that was their All Ireland. I'm also really not a believer in this notion that a team with underage success can "expect" anything in future years (Limerick know this better than most, Clare more recently were expected to dominate and it didn't happen). All Irelands are there for winning, I really disagree with this idea that losing one is part of the process or whatever (sure just ask Cork). I think they should learn a LOT from what they did wrong against Kilkenny, and they have a style of play that doesn't play into Limerick's hands.

I'm really hoping for a Limerick win because I think they're a fantastic team who should establish a legacy, and I think Cork probably will win more in the next few years. I also find that when Cork win their fans become insufferable (I mean...every set of fans does but ye know what I mean here), and winning this, against the odds, after such a massive drought, they will, quite deservedly and rightly, be out to annoy the hell out of all of us for the winter. But I'm starting to lean towards a Cork win, if Limerick are starting to be thought of as some kind of well-oiled machine. Can't get away from the 2006 comparison, Limerick are often compared with the KK team of that era but I think they are usually analysed in ways that remind me of Cork. That doesn't bode well for them.

I can't find anything online with the odds for that All Ireland, but if you have a link do send it on! I'll take your word for it otherwise, and fair enough...but I also can't find a single article from the build up, in any of the national papers, where someone thinks Kilkenny would go on to win, and reading the articles the journalists making the case for KK doing have a tone that suggests it is incredibly unlikely and would require everything to go right on the day. They were, in the literal sense, being written off, as are Cork now. Successful teams can look invincible at moments like these and then they are dismissed the next day as yesterday's men. The response to Dublin losing their first championship match in seven years or whatever at the weekend is the same thing.

I'm thinking Cork will win, that's all.

Are journalists actually writing Cork off I havnt seen much in the way of build up from the press yet. If so though thats nuts given the games these 2 have played over the last few years.

I know a lot of people are saying they think Limerick will win but "written off" means something very different