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Govt to replace Direct Provision with protection system

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  • Registered Users Posts: 500 ✭✭✭Marcos


    Oh, they're not thick. They know exactly what is going to happen, this is is most definitely planned.

    When most of us say "social justice" we mean equality under the law opposition to prejudice, discrimination and equal opportunities for all. When Social Justice Activists say "social justice" they mean an emphasis on group identity over the rights of the individual, a rejection of social liberalism, and the assumption that unequal outcomes are always evidence of structural inequalities.

    Andrew Doyle, The New Puritans.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    So this is all supposed to be operational by Dec '24 and according to this they haven't even identified sites for their reception centres (let alone started designing, tendering and getting planning permission) and the housing department doesn't want to give them LDA lands to do so. Also the costings for 6 centres in urban areas to be built to me seem so far off the mark, it says in that article that the 6 centres will cost €220m, if they're not getting land without a direct cost to them off the LDA surely its going to be multiples of that. Maybe they're planning on buying existing buildings and retrofitting them to be these centres but I don't see how you get those unless you chose smaller towns like how they are using the student accomodation in Letterkenny, I would doubt they're buying the land and building anywhere in an Irish city on that budget.

    Shows just what an absolute shambles this plan was if O'Gormans department was emailing the Dept of housing 10 days before the plan was due to be published saying that not having access to State lands will undermine it.

    https://www.thejournal.ie/housing-direct-provision-white-paper-5520893-Aug2021/


    "The LDA was one of a number of options for delivering housing for asylum seekers explored as part of Minister Roderic O’Gorman’s plan to end Direct Provision, documents show. 

    Ten days before the White Paper was published an official at O’Gorman’s Department emailed officials at the Department of Housing. 

    The official acknowledged that using LDA lands as part of its plan was “problematic” for Housing officials. 

    However, they said there was a “genuine fear” that without access to State lands to provide housing for asylum seekers the White Paper and its targets would be “undermined.” 

    “Our genuine fear is that the model proposed runs the risk of failing to achieve its targets without access in some form to suitable State-owned land,” they said. 

    “Without addressing this issue in [the White Paper] the model is undermined,” they added. 

    The White Paper lays out a number of options for ending privately-run centres including accessing housing through Approved Housing Bodies and Local Authorities with assistance from the Housing Agency.

    Under the plan, six State-run reception centres would be built. Applicants would spend no more than four months in one of these centres before being moved into their own accommodation. However, no sites for these State-owned centres have been identified. 

    It is estimated it will cost €220 million to build these centres, and between €235 million and €450 million to provide accomodation in local communities.

    But Nick Henderson, Irish Refugee Council CEO, has said that without a commitment to accessing State-owned lands, it could delay new accommodation coming on stream. 

    Henderson had called for the LDA’s function to be expanded to include provision of asylum accommodation as part of a Government commitment to ending congregated settings. "



  • Registered Users Posts: 82,818 ✭✭✭✭Atlantic Dawn
    M


    ...

    Post edited by Atlantic Dawn on


  • Registered Users Posts: 25,484 ✭✭✭✭Strumms


    Say Sean and Kate own / have a three bedroom house in Castleknock... no kids though, but planned... would the government / city council be of the ability to Compulsory Purchase Order / take the premises to house a family of 5 from Burundi or wherever ? And fûck Sean and Kate into a two bedroom apartment in Santry ? and give them the leftover cash ? Because what’s getting suggested is somewhere on the road to ending up at that scenario...

    • cant edit bold back to normal grr




  • Registered Users Posts: 2,824 ✭✭✭irishproduce


    Govt confirms that the incoming Afghan refugees we have agreed to take will not have to go to direct provision. Rightly so too.

    Independent.ie: Up to 150 Afghan refugees will avoid direct provision upon arrival into Ireland.


    If ever there was a subtle confirmation that the direct provision system is used to weed out blackguards then there you have it.

    There's no doubt the Afghans are genuine refugees, meanwhile the messers in DP can stay there.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 451 ✭✭MBE220d


    Let's hope that the 150 Afghan refugees are women and kids, not the fit young men that were trying to get on the plane today, not much hope in getting the women and kids out when you have that mob around, no addition to any country that lot.



  • Registered Users Posts: 481 ✭✭mariab21




  • Registered Users Posts: 3,639 ✭✭✭Montage of Feck




  • Registered Users Posts: 481 ✭✭mariab21


    So the poster thinks everyone in DP (His/Her words) is upto no good.

    I better tell the local food bank as a few residents of the local DP centre help out every Sat at the food bank.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,507 ✭✭✭✭Geuze


    The vast majority of AS are bogus.

    They may well be lovely people, and they may well help out as you describe, but they are still bogus asylum-seekers.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 451 ✭✭MBE220d


    For anyone that thinks that the asylum seekers in direct provision for years are genuine.

    Just ask yourself the question, why are they still there years later. Simple really.



  • Registered Users Posts: 583 ✭✭✭crooked cockney villain


    The come one come all crowd know this full well. Sorcha Pollak has at least twice run articles with people who blatantly state they are there for economic convenience. They just don't care. These people will say "we can help both" yet given the choice of the state buying a specially adapted flat for a disabled child and their family, or a one bed flat for Abdul the 35 year old child refugee, every last one of this mob would spit in the child's face.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,177 ✭✭✭Fandymo


    Handy for the bleeding heart backstory when they are told to leave. "He was such a help to the community". 🙄



  • Registered Users Posts: 583 ✭✭✭crooked cockney villain


    Given the numbers of Afghans we are to take seems to double by the day, perhaps some of the femininsts banking on about it would take a look at this.



    January, Feb and March of 2018. All of the reports backed with links to mainstream media that reported them.


    The word "Afghan" appears TWENTY FOUR times in the article. And that is only where an attacker was apprehended and his identity therefore could be confirmed. Some attacks involved multiple assailants

    There are 250,000 Afghans in Germany as per Wikipedia. 20 times less than the population of the Republic of Ireland.

    Extrapolated, if the Irish population had the same offending rate, we would see in the region of 480 stranger on stranger sex attacks in the first three months of 2018 in this country.

    Would we normally see that many in a decade?


    .



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,929 ✭✭✭enricoh


    We are now taking in 300 afghans, various charities/ quangos calling for 1000 absolute minimum. No doubt it'll be 1000.

    There's 3 properties to rent in limerick city at the minute on daft, 3! New blood required , we gotta keep the 'housing crisis' going!

    https://www.daft.ie/property-for-rent/limerick-city



  • Registered Users Posts: 583 ✭✭✭crooked cockney villain


    I'm fairly sure Simon Coveney wanted 20,000 Syrians at one stage.

    Irish politics is full of chancers, crooks, sleevens, snakes, but I'm not sure there are any as sinister as dyed in the wool Pan European Globalists like Leo, Harris and most glaringly the Bilderberger himself Coveney. FF's raison d'etre is often confined so county level pay offs- FG are more into selling our bodies on an international market.


    Maybe it's recency bias but I honestly don't think "European/ Global citizen before my birth one" types like Macron, Tredeau, Merkel, Starmer and the aforementioned three were really a thing before this century.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,283 ✭✭✭Patrick2010


    Matt Cooper had his usual balanced guests on his show this evening, Brid Smith and Colm O Gorman both in agreement that we should be taking in far more refugees .

    when Matt read out texts from people that we can’t house our own population the two of them insisted we could do both.

    According to Brid the country is full of empty houses.



  • Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    She's dead right, it is full of empty houses.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,824 ✭✭✭irishproduce


    We really should be taking in more of these Afghan refugees. They're genuine and they're deserving of help security and safety.

    The big problem is, we've thousands clogging up the system who shouldn't be here and aren't deserving so what we've got is a situation where because of the bleeding hearts pushing bogus lads from around the world on us, there now is an actual discussion on whether we can take in real refugees. We shouldn't even have to consider it. They should be welcomed in asap. It's crazy but it's where we find ourselves. Hope those that insisted we take more bogus migrants are happy.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,921 ✭✭✭John Doe1


    I have no doubt certain elements within goverment and lobby groups will use the legitimate need to provide asylum to Afghans to open the doors even further to every Tom, Dick and Mohammed chancher who want a few more bob in their back pocket while hating our values.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,399 ✭✭✭archfi


    If the authorities had any sense at all or even the brain to use this as a PR exercise that would assuage very legitimate concerns that many in the public have, they would match the legitimate Afghan asylum seeker/refugee intake with enforcing the actual deportation of those wandering the country with...deportation orders. Within possible weeks, our citizenship will be doled out without question to up to 20,000 non-legitimate asylum seekers and fraudulent chancers by the weakest of political parties both in power and out that I have seen in decades.

    1,000 legitimate in - 1,000 frauds out.

    They need to face down the likes of O'Gorman and the myriad 'not-for-profit' setups and think about the good of Ireland for once.

    The issue is never the issue; the issue is always the revolution.

    The Entryism process: 1) Demand access; 2) Demand accommodation; 3) Demand a seat at the table; 4) Demand to run the table; 5) Demand to run the institution; 6) Run the institution to produce more activists and policy until they run it into the ground.



  • Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    What about the Afghan asylum seekers who are already here?

    Are they bogus or genuine?



  • Registered Users Posts: 34,322 ✭✭✭✭The_Kew_Tour


    More then welcome to see Ireland help out people who are fleeing basically being killed.

    The sad thing is that because of the bogus claims here we won't be able to help out as many as we should. People will try and blame this and that but reality will be the main reason being people who are here who should not be.

    Let's hope we can still help a good chunk of families.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    O'Gorman and the Greens are a tiny party. The simple fact is FF/FG are quite happy with the current system. It's FG who are currently handing out tens of thousands of Irish citizenships to people who have broken our laws.

    There is no party in Ireland who wants to end the abuses of our system.

    SF will be even worse, a party who want to overturn our birth laws etc etc.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Some are bogus, as can be seen throughout Europe, where Germany, Spain , Netherlands etc were in the process of deporting them up until last week.

    Why do you consistently ask ridiculous open ended questions?



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,283 ✭✭✭Patrick2010


    If Ireland is full of empty houses why have such long waiting lists?, are you including half built ghost estates in the back of beyonds?



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Will Brid ever put a number on it? Should we bring in 20,000,000, 1 billion etc. How many?



  • Registered Users Posts: 583 ✭✭✭crooked cockney villain


    The concept of "we can do both" is routinely used by these people to justify this type of thing. It deserves examining.

    • Can the Irish state provide an adaquate amount of affordable and social housing for its own citizens, plus similar for refugees? Absolutely it can. Housing is already ridiculously affordable in most of the BMW (border, midlands, West region), it is only people living within easy driving distance of Dublin, and in the immediate vicinity of Cork city, probably Galway city, who struggle to find an affordable home- to alleviate the housing crisis the government only needs to build a few thousand cost price/ social homes per year in our urban areas, which in turn will lead to a fall in the cost of existing homes
    • Should they? IMO no, even if the governent did pull the finger out and deliver affordable 3 bed homes at 160k a go (the cost price of building a 3 bed terrace on council owned land in Dublin is circa 160K), refugees and asylum seekers have done nothing to deserve them.

    But let's ignore my opinion- can the government deliver affordable/ social housing, plus house a few thousand refugees per year?

    Yes. It can. It, however, refuses to, but puts up its hand at every given opportunity to fast track these services to whatever refugee crisis is flavour of the month.

    This is where it gets interesting.


    PBP "It doesn't need to be a contest, we can do both!"

    FG "Well maybe we can do both, but the EU wants a dig out so we will only do one- we will give a few thousand essentially free homes to refugees while working people sweat blood to get deposits or never get one because they're stuck in 1600 per month rentals"

    PBP "Fair enough so"


    What sort of opposition is this? We can do both, but we won't do both, and nobody in our political system has a problem with which of the two vying groups will end up getting the assistance. It's insane.

    I'd somewhat agree with a small number of Afghan programme refugees being put in some sort of communal establishment for a few years, get a job, work towards their own deposit.

    Instead the plan here seems to be come in, here's a house after three months, whether you want to bother working is your own prerogative.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,929 ✭✭✭enricoh


    No chance of a number! Just tax the rich, the bankers, landlords, the fat cats etc etc



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  • Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Because the waiting lists are people waiting on houses from the council. Beside their mammies. Nothing else will do.



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