Home heating automation

Just as an aside, when Tado appears as a device in Google Home, IFTTT, or accessed through Alexa, I had always assumed that these devices are reaching the Tado devices via your router and through the Bridge, and not by direct mesh wireless connectivity. Having said that the V3 bridge is capable of visibility to Apple Homekit, which allows direct Apple control of the stat even in the event of an Internet ISP outage. I haven't bothered to investigate if this is by peer to peer lan via your router, or direct connection to the Bridge. I've read a case where the user shifted his bridge centrally using a powering adapter. No reason it shouldn't work, unless the powering carrier interferes with the bridge 6lowpan.

I currently have two heating zones, controlled by programmable thermostats. I have daily schedules, with four 'On' timeslots per day. I would like to replicate this approach on a per room basis, using smart radiator heads. I'd be happy if I could have automated schedules similar to what I have.

My question is whether I can still have a schedule with Tado heads, if the Internet is down? I'd be happy to use Home Assistant, or similar, if necessary. The installation site has very unreliable internet and I don't want everything to fall over, if it's down.

If I can't do this with Tado, which is my preference, can anyone recommend an alternative product?

Thanks in advance

It's interesting to see what the inside temperatures are at the moment. Tado is showing 26.8° for my main stat in the centre, and 25.4° on the TRV in the kitchen. They peaked at 27.1 and 26.1 yesterday at about 6.00 pm. We could be in the market for A/C in this country at rate global warming is going.

Also it's notable that Tado now allows 0.5° granularity setting on TRVs, both on app manual or schedule, though actual temperature is displayed on the app to 0.1°. The main stat still allows schedules to be set by 0.1° increments, but manual boosts are in 0.5° steps only.

A new build wouldn't qualify for the grants the utility companies claim, but there may be a promotion by an energy company for switching. My youngest just moved into an A3 new build, 2 wall stats are wired basic mechanical, HW is controlled by a three zone timer, and all rooms other than those hosting the wall stats have TRVs, so a house like this is model for either a Hive, Drayton kit 3 wireless conversion, or just two Tado or Netatmo wired stats, with the HW remaining on the 3 zone timer IF the HW is via a traditional cylinder, and not direct from the gas boiler.

Existing mechanical TRVs will cap their rooms' temperatures, in these new houses it's unlikely that great savings will be made by having Smart TRV schedules in these rooms, as the insulation and draught/ventilation control is so high, you would see little heating activity in the unused rooms, and only minor reduction in that room temperature while adjacent rooms are calling for heat.

A couple of wired smart stats would be your first move, wired can be a simple DIY replacement. WIreless will require a little more knowledge to connect at the zone controller. Its unlikely any energy supplier promotion would sub more than a single stat, and would want full price for a second. One energy company was installing electronic stats with a modicum of predictive control, but no smart features. They were putting this one stat in place of existing 2 zoned mechanical stat installations, and claiming it was more efficient due to the stat's magical powers. So beware of this one, its just a grant levering exercise, but a new build wouldn't qualify, so they won't be interested in you.

If getting a tado smart thermostat v3, do I also need an extension kit?

I've an oil boiler with a 2 zone controller fro rads and HW

Deezell, Clareman, Thanks again for your earlier help in understanding smart heating compatibility :) the missing piece for me was to understand how the internet bridge would connect to my router, which I now know I can solve by using a wifi extender from netgear which has an ethernet port. I'll place this netgear device in a central location of the house from where I hope the RF signals can reach the boiler shed in the back garden plus the 11 radiators across 3 floors.

Follow-up question on "what to buy"

My boiler has 2 zones, one for house, one for hot water. The currently EPH Ember seems to have some temperature sensing device connected to the hot water tank and another wireless thermostat that is in the house somewhere.

When I go for Tado, I understand I will need the Wireless starter Kit (https://www.tado.com/gb-en/wireless-smart-thermostat-specifications-overview), where the

1. wireless receiver will connect to the gas heater boiler
2. the wireless temperature sensor will sit in the house
3. the internet bridge will connect via ethernet to LAN.

i also understand I can buy the smart TRVs.

1) What I don't understand is what do I need to connect to the hot water tank?

2) Do you know whether tado can do modulated heating vs just on-off heating? I noticed that Netatmo has the option of Modulating Thermostat but Tado is not clear.

1. Your wireless ext kit also has a relay to control the HW zone valve, and the app will have a timer schedule panel separately for this. HW temperature will still be controlled by a manual stat on the cylinder. The ember does have app control of temperature, you could leave this as is.

2. The Tado does have an output for digital control of boilers equipped with OpenTherm digital input. The Tado stat can be connected thus, but you will not have the on off switching to the Zone valve for CH afaik, as this is muted if the control method is set to OT. This may have changed. Even then, the boiler will only fire for CH events, as HW control via OT is limited to combi boilers which have direct pumped hot water to the tap, with no HW cylinder.

The good news is that even with a straight on off connection to the boiler, Tado implements its own modulation scheme as target temperature is approached.

Sonoff wifi relays can easily handle the load of a boiler, 5a or less, but their single pole wall switch is too light at 2a. There are 5a versions from TCP, or this heater version at 20a which is designed for an immersion element.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/FreeLeben-Switches-Controller-Compatible-Assistant/dp/B07T7N9LFJ/ref=asc_df_B07T7N9LFJ/?tag=googshopuk-21&linkCode=df0&hvadid=375456255828&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=5698037010043134927&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=m&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=20481&hvtargid=pla-813539069506&psc=1&tag=&ref=&adgrpid=77211061152&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvadid=375456255828&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=5698037010043134927&hvqmt=&hvdev=m&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=20481&hvtargid=pla-813539069506

Very easy to fit a wireless stat in a central location, then just fit it's receiver in place of your switch. Nest, Tado, Drayton, Hive and others will all support a wireless stat. With Tado, Drayton, Netatmo, you can change some of the radiator stats for app integrated smart wireless TRV's further down the road.

hi all. so finally installed my 2 motorised valves, one on CH, and one on HW . (will need to get a hw stat in future , but for now 1/2 hour in the morning is enough )

now have heating in an S-plan , running a drayton wiser controller . next is wiring . do i need to rewire everything through a control box ? looks like its the way to go .

looks straight forward enough , although location is going to be tough .. any recommendations .

yea was looking at the lwc1 for drayton , (thats the one in the pic above )