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US and Nato withdrawal from Afghanistan...- threadbanned users in OP

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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,301 ✭✭✭Snickers Man


    Coffee through the nose moment!!

    "We should think hard and long if we are ever asked to join in one of America's military adventures, because you just wonder: 'Is that how they are going to treat us again?'"

    Too late, boys. You have pulled out of the EU, a different organisation to NATO certainly but one where a lot of pan-European decisions are taken. If there is going to be any discussion about a more independent European military effort, it is going to take place at those meetings of teh European Council or even the European parliament, corridors of power from which you have voluntarily removed yourselves.

    And anyway, wasn't the fear of a European Army one of Farage's big bogey men during the referendum?

    I think this interview is the greatest load of spin and blether!



  • Registered Users Posts: 23,246 ✭✭✭✭Dyr



    Deluded stuff

    There's only one true Military power in the EU now: France, and the French will dance to their own tune. The real players in this area will be the G7 and NATO. The EU is a bystander. Like it was during the migrant crisis and so forth.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,935 ✭✭✭fly_agaric


    Yeah that is so stupid it would make you want to scream.

    (As you say) EU is likely the forum where alot of these decisions about European collective security & defense cooperation will be made if the US is pulling back from its "global policeman" role (or even if it will just reduce presence in Europe/Middle East to concentrate on China).

    Ignoring the EU completely + trying to operate bilaterally with the member states can't make the EU cease to exist however much Brexiters wish that were the case.

    Yes the UK can "Brexit", but it doesn't have the power to make the EU collapse or become irrelevant to the UKs dealings with the members post Brexit. That outcome would be fairly disatrous for increasing military cooperation between countries in Europe in any case.

    We can all see the damage Brexit has done to relations and the mistrust it has created between the UK and the remaining members incl. ourselves (i.e. not just between the UK and the EU institutions). You can't increase military cooperation in a climate of mistrust and suspicion.



  • Registered Users Posts: 23,760 ✭✭✭✭Kermit.de.frog


    Reuters reporting the US is considering airstrikes on equipment left behind by US troops for the Afghan army in Afghanistan.



  • Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Different tools for different jobs ,the humvee was never meant to carry heavy armour ,they are supposed to be light high mobility vehicles not multi ton armoured fighting vehicles ,you only get something like 6/7 miles to the gallon too ,they are thirsty cars ,

    Slap that amount of wrap around armour on a hilux with standard suspension and transmission and you would face similar issues , special forces preferred the custom built landrovers for transportation in warzones ,

    But one thing that has been proven all over Afghanistan once you leave paved roads in your armoured Humvees or mraps you better have some way of recovering them from dense mud



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  • Registered Users Posts: 26,427 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985




  • Posts: 1,263 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Was thinking about the excuses they use. Russia seems to appeal to national interests as its excuse. Pretty blunt. And not even really pretending to be an excuse.

    As communist regimes do, China uses carefully selected elements of 19th Century German power philosophy Marxism as cover. Paper thin. No one with any cop on believes them.



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,340 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    Russia is using the same excuse that America has always used. As for China, whatever it is, is certainly isn't Communist these days. But her excuse is also one of "national interests" when they want to interfere in another country's business.

    When you are a large country and can unilaterally act on matters outside your own nation, realpolitik becomes the order of the day.



  • Posts: 1,263 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Ideologies aside, given that China borders Afghanistan and Russia is only separated from it by the Stans IIRC, both countries have more 'right' to be there, in geographical terms, than the likes of the Australians, for example.

    Anyway, I agree that unfortunately in these situations 'might is right'.



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,340 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    Russia is as far away from Afghanistan as we are from the Ukraine. So their "right" to be there is pretty minimal. But they do have historical fallout to consider. China's border length is minimal AFAIR.

    However, every country surrounding Afghanistan will be watching very closely how this situation develops. America handing Afghanistan back to The Taliban is just about the most bizarre thing that anybody in and out of the region could have imagined, including The Taliban themselves.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 7,703 ✭✭✭Dr. Bre


    How come we not seeing many images from outside Kabul ? It’s a big country ! What’s happening in other cities ?



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,538 ✭✭✭jmreire


    Normally, we would use minimum 4 Vehs for a field trip, all Toyota Landcruiser's. 2 for passengers, and 2 loaded to the roof with spare wheels, springs, suspensions, towing gear, winches, oil and water. + 2 mechanics. And this was for the Summer, and all vehs would be fully serviced pre trip. For the winter / spring, in some areas, it was a physical impossibility, but in areas where you could go, you took extra survival gear, portable gas cookers, extra food and water, snow chains etc. and allowed a lot more time. 6 -8 mths from brand new, and with very small mileage, the LC's started to show signs of metal fatigue, with cracks appearing first in the roof pillers, and gradually spreading. Mechanically, they suffered too. Cleaning the engine air filters was something that needed to be done every day, and like wise fuel filters needed changing much oftener than normal. If there was a design fault in the Veh, any veh, Afghanistan will quickly show it up. Ironically, the Russian MAZ trucks ( which were military design) were maybe the best suited for the terrain, especially in the mountains......was nothing to see one parked by the road side, gearbox out on the ground, with the whole family siting around drinking Tea, while the menfolk fixed the box,,,,,and when you passed back that way a few days later, the truck would be gone....they could not do these kind of repairs with more modern complicated trucks.. So for all the fanfare about massive quantities of ammunition, weapons and vehicles being " gifted" to the Taliban,even with good and proper maintenance, there will be problems. And as for any kind of missiles, did they need special codes before they could be fired?



  • Registered Users Posts: 83,458 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    ha ha ha its fun to laugh about dead children /s



  • Registered Users Posts: 26,427 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    Sorry that was supposed to be a sarcastic dig at the US and their disregard for "collateral damage"



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,560 ✭✭✭political analyst


    Many Poles stood and fought when their country was invaded in 1939 and those who fled when the country was overrun continued the fight in Western Europe. So why did so many soldiers who are indigenous to Afghanistan and Iraq (and Saudi Arabia in the case of the conflict with the Houthis in Yemen) run away from insurgents instead of fighting?



  • Registered Users Posts: 83,458 ✭✭✭✭Overheal




  • Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Look at Syria at least 100 hospitals and medical clinics and schools were destroyed by ground and air attacks along with markets and other civilian places ........

    For no reason other than to punish a population for not wanting an autocratic dictatorship and his best mate in Moscow .



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,340 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    The Poles were invaded by Germany. A completely foreign country. As far as Afghanistan is concerned this is the Taliban we're talking about and they have many Afghans amongst them. They're led by Afghans. Afghans that kicked out the Russian invaders in 1989 and who are now, no doubt, making claims of kicking out the American invaders too. They're the people that ruled Afghanistan in the 90's and they never left it. So it's not the same a Germany invading Poland.

    Perhaps, when the Americans started talking with The Taliban about returning to power last year and locked out the Afghan government - you know the guys they actually set up - maybe a lot of Afghans just went "fuck it, why should we even bother. Maybe we'll just roll with this instead."

    There's never been any real love for the US puppet Afghan governments from Hamid Karzai onwards. They've always been seen as the invaders leaders, corrupt and caring only about themselves, especially outside of the urban areas where extreme poverty leads to a bitterness against those in the "big smoke". There's also a history of heavy handedness from the Afghan Army in the rural areas of the county. There are accounts of them rocking up to a village at night and harassing locals on the basis that they were aiding Al Qaeda or The Taliban, with people getting killed in the process and/or taken away. That kind of thing tends to breed a resentment easily.

    Also, this kinda crap didn't help...




  • Registered Users Posts: 8,184 ✭✭✭riclad


    In country's like Africa old Toyota are very popular, easy to fix maintain, very reliable, not full of highly complex computer chips, so of course the taliban love them . Of course they have now 100s of humvees courtesy of the us army yes of course in a few years time they will break down and need new parts,

    It's well known the Toyota truck is very popular with terrorist groups all round the world right now theres over 10,000 American citizens waiting to leave the country I read the American army would like bomb

    The area where humvees and trucks are parked but they can't do this since the need to Cooperate with the taliban to get

    Americans safely out of the country I think Pakistan could easily defeat the taliban if they wanted since they have 1000 troops that are well trained

    There's an article on www.

    techdirt.com re the taliban have acess to large amounts of biometric data on American army allies including fingerprints which they can use to track them down since no one thought to delete sensitive military data before the army left



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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,194 ✭✭✭scotchy


    So, I've been following the whole Afghanistan thing on the news for the past week, and something was niggling at me. I've just realized that the Taliban seem to be wearing eye makeup/ eyeliner. what's the craic with this. Is it ok under sharia law for the lads to get dolled up, but the gals have to be hidden away. Am I the last person to realise this?



    💙 💛 💙 💛 💙 💛



  • Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    @riclad  I think Pakistan could easily defeat the taliban if they wanted since they have 1000 troops that are well trained...


    The same Pakistan who train and equip the Taliban and were almost over run by the Taliban a few years back ,to the point the Americans had to go in to protect the Pakistan nuclear arsenal

    Pakistan not a hope .....



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,265 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997




  • Registered Users Posts: 83,458 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    In Islam, Prophet Muhammad used kohl and recommended others to use it because he believed that it was beneficial for the eyes[17] based on the following saying by him: "One of the best kinds of kohl that you use is Ithmid (antimony); it brightens the vision and makes the hair (eye-lashes) grow"[18] and he "used to apply kohl to his right eye three times, and to his left eye twice."[17] It is used by many Muslim men today during Ramadan as a sign of devotion.[19][20][21]



  • Registered Users Posts: 33,990 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    Balls it is.


    It's to look absolutely fabulous. And he does.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,194 ✭✭✭scotchy


    Maybe it's Maybelline

    💙 💛 💙 💛 💙 💛



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,538 ✭✭✭jmreire


    The difference between the Countrys you mention Poland etc. is that they had something to fight for, but who were the Afghani's fighting for? Their corrupt government? Who had failed them at every turn? And who's to say that those who left will not fight back later on?



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,538 ✭✭✭jmreire


    And if ingested ( Antimony, used in Kohl) it is poisonous. Ingested in large amounts, it causes kidney and liver damage and death. Wonder what effect it has on the eyes????



  • Registered Users Posts: 16,574 ✭✭✭✭Loafing Oaf


    A Taliban fighter was quoted as saying of the government soldiers: "Their only ideology is fleecing the Americans."



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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,538 ✭✭✭jmreire


    In 2007, the Taliban controlled the Swat valley, and ruled it the same as they had ruled Afghanistan....with brutality. In 2009, they marched on Islamabad and got to within about 20 klms of it, before the Pakistani Govt started a major push back. There was hundreds of thousands of people who fled during the fighting. But the PK army pushed them not only back but out if the area entirely, and its controlled now by PK forces. But if it were to happen today? and armed as they now are? Pakistan is riding the tiger.



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