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The Irish protocol.

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,742 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Yeh, my cousin knows one of the lads at the back.

    Just on the band thing. Maybe downcow could confirm.

    A fella here who played in a brass band was telling me that at 13 or 14 years of age he could play approx 20 tunes on the trumpet. But they never actually learned to play the instrument. It is a kind of rote note-learning system they use. The main issue he said was keeping everyone in tune. He's in his 40's now and couldn't play a note on the trumpet and has forgotten how to play all the tunes he knew. I am sure there are some genuine musicians in there too.

    Never knew that.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,629 ✭✭✭✭downcow


    Any thoughts on how this meeting will go. Either the atmosphere or outcome? What are the chances that ireland will get to a place where it decides to help its neighbour through this and find appropriate changes to propose to EU for their mutual benifit

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-58348119



  • Posts: 17,378 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    What does Northern Ireland need help with? Great Britain is the one with problems.



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 40,212 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    So you want to know how a meeting will go where one side arrive in having again blamed to other side for their own actions? Jeffrey would want to wise up as this nonsense isn't getting him very far!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,629 ✭✭✭Fionn1952


    I think it's entirely dependent on how Donaldson approaches the meeting. If he shows up making demands and pulling the woe is me blame game, I don't think he'll achieve much. If he shows up and acts like a statesman, recognising that Ireland has been looking out for NI (while protecting itself) all along, he could well have an ally in the EU when it comes to seeking easements for NI.


    Ultimately though, your problem still lies with the UK government.


    What did you think of Jamie's sh*t show of a protest in Enniskillen and what it says about how much support the anti-Protocol crowd has at large?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,564 ✭✭✭✭steddyeddy


    Why would we change it? Trade between North and south has risen massively this year. I also don't think it's our responsibility to fix the mess created by the British PM and unionist politicians in Northern Ireland.

    One upshot of Brexit Johnson didn’t foresee: bringing the Irish closer

    Trade between Northern Ireland and the Republic has soared this year, while life for British exporters looks set to get grimmer. It was supposed to be a deal no UK prime minister could ever agree to, an Irish sea border between Great Britain and Northern Ireland. Half a year on from Boris Johnson doing exactly that, while denying the fact, the economic consequences are becoming clearer.




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,564 ✭✭✭✭steddyeddy


    During his Dublin trip Macron reiterated that the EU will insist that the British government stick to the deal it negotiated on behalf of Northern Ireland.

    EU will force UK to stick to Northern Ireland protocol

    By EUOBSERVER

    TODAY, 09:19

    The European Union will force Britain to stick to the Northern Ireland customs protocol and never abandon Dublin during tough talks over the Irish Sea border, Emmanuel Macron, the French president, warned, The Telegraph writes. On a visit to Dublin, Macron said the EU would stay united over the Northern Ireland protocol, which the UK wants to renegotiate, as well as post-Brexit fishing rights.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,742 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    BBC is telling fibs, it's quite clear that only a tiny number of Unionists 'strongly oppose' the protocol.

    And I think that fact will massively humble Mr Donaldson in today's meeting.

    How can he demonstrate 'massive Unionist opposition' to Micheál Martin?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,564 ✭✭✭✭steddyeddy


    You see that's it. There's simply no real appetite in Northern Ireland to change the NI protocol. I suspect the DUP are just campaigning against it so that they don't lose the support of their voter base. There's two unionists on this thread. One the states he/she is happy with the increasing closeness between the North and South and another who states that the protocol must go ect. The problem is the latter of the two has been caught out in pretending they don't know who Irish politicians are, hosting pretend polls and overhearing literally everything in a pub which coincidently backs up what goes on in his mind. If there was actual opposition to the NI protocol people wouldn't have to make up stuff to back up their point, nor would we see pathetic little protests organised by loyalist groups with terror connections.



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 40,212 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    If the unionists felt that the Irish government were really interfereing in NI and creating a negative impact on the NI economy and its people, you would hear a lot more about it. The unionists politicians have scaled th rhetoric right back because they know only too well that NI is doing quite well currently, despite their attempts to scupper the economy. If they got what they they claim to want, the unionist politicains would be in deep trouble come the next election - and they know that. Hence, I believe that they are pretending to object to the NIP but in reality are thankful as it is saving their political asses.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,742 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Jeffery and the Unionists will have to get over the fact that the Irish government under the aegis of an internationally binding agreement with their government have every right to 'have a say'.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 274 ✭✭mehico


    Doubtful Micheál Martin would be this forthright with Jeffery. More likely MM will agree that there are problems with the protocol but that he will work with all concerned to address any issues.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,742 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    I doubt Jeffery will raise the matter mehico. Jeffery knows the score. He'll run with the hare and hunt with the hound. Lots of mithering to his own audience but he will work the Agreement and the Protocol because he knows there is no choice in the matter.



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,117 ✭✭✭✭Junkyard Tom


    Wee Jeffery should be told that if the DUP doesn't behave itself then the only discussion to be had will be joint London/Dublin governance of the north and a border poll.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,742 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady




  • Registered Users Posts: 11,629 ✭✭✭✭downcow


    Sounds like it was a little bit more tetchy than that.

    I don’t trust Donaldson as far as I’d throw him but seems he stuck to the script today

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-58348119



  • Registered Users Posts: 254 ✭✭lurleen lumpkin




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,742 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    His comment came after he met Taoiseach (Irish Prime Minister) Micheál Martin.

    'After' is the operative word. I'd say it was a case of

    Micheál - 'well Jeffery, what's the craic'

    Jeff - 'Ah could be worse Micheál'



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,711 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    Whatever the DUP are doing, it ain't working cos the latest LucidTalk poll shows them losing ground (and relevance). One swallow doesn't make a summer but you'd increasingly wonder how they can be in a position to speak for the unionist population at all. A community now definitively split, while republicanism coalesces. Surprised by the drop in Alliance support though.




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,629 ✭✭✭Fionn1952


    Depending on how the seats fall, those numbers could still see a Unionist majority of seats, unless they go back to election pacts to avoid vote splitting and giving the shinners a clean run in a lot of places.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,742 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Alliance dropping 3 is a surprise at this stage.

    Still not convinced their rise represents the change some think it does.

    Interesting what is happening between the DUP and TUV and what it will mean.

    Does the DUP go more TUV or does it try and hold and build from there. If the TUV have risen to that level why only 40 or 50 turning out to see their leader at protests.

    Interesting times.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,742 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Would you agree with the assessment on one of Sam McBride's tweets Fionn and downcow that those figures mean the DUP will orchestrate the collapse of Stormont before long?



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,711 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    This was the one that made me curious. Assuming there's only a 1, 2 point margin of error none of these numbers may mean anything ultimately, but a 3 point drop for Alliance is odd. Is it just a hardening of views with the Unionist community? The nationalist numbers didn't move, suggesting that community is happy eough with things.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,742 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    I've always said the Alliance growth was just votes looking for a temporary home. I think there is a way to go yet before the vote settles down. I'd be amazed if the TUV finish on that % in an actual election and I think there is a good % of lent votes there too.

    Where does Allister get the candidates? If he runs the calibre of Jamie Bryson/Jolene Bunting will he turn support into seats?

    Fascinating tbh.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,711 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    It's always the ultimate flaw with Alliance is the two sides it tries to distance itself from have clear, distinct paths away from each other. Alliance can only play both sides for so long until it has to choose - at which point it loses the hardcore nationalists (for instance) who would find Alliance's preference for the status quo unpalatable.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,629 ✭✭✭Fionn1952


    I've been of the opinion that the second the FM position wasn't going to go to them, DUP would make their excuses to collapse Stormont even if they didn't seem to be suffering the level of voter abandonment they appear to be right now.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,742 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    I'd be surprised if Alliance ever attracted 'hardcore Nationalists' pixel.

    I think Alliance are the bellwether party to be honest. They reflect how much division still remains and how failed the state is.

    A vote that will constantly ebb and flow depending on which side is in crisis



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,742 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Yeh, I knew that was your opinion, I just cannot for the life of me see it as a wise strategy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,629 ✭✭✭Fionn1952


    I didn't say it was a wise strategy....one doesn't tend to analyse the strategy of children with toys in prams.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 11,629 ✭✭✭✭downcow


    Great news and certainly not unexpected. Anyone who has been suggesting there is no opposition to the protocol should take note of this. This DUP meltdown is quite simply because they have navigated is to the Irish Sea border

    https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/revealed-dup-support-plunges-behind-tuv-and-uup-in-shock-new-poll-40796153.html



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