Any other women here vote NO for the 8th?

Oh I understand perfectly.

But it didn't answer the question - what is the difference between a foetus conceived through rape, and one that was not? (Hint, there isn't one).

But your reply does go to show that this is never really about the foetus at all, and reveals what it is about. You dress it up as "making moral decisions" but what it really is about, is controlling womens' decisions. You said it yourself. But you call it balancing some "moral equation". And that's what its always been about.

Well, its not anyone else's moral decision to make or "moral equation" to balance, as far as I'm concerned.

I just wish these so-called pro-lifers would spare us the "every life is precious" or "life begins at conception" spiel if they're then going to turn around and say its okay to abort in circumstances where the woman "didn't have a choice in avoiding the risk of becoming pregnant".

Be honest. Call it what it truly is. Controlling women.

I've no idea where to find mods anymore - but can someone just ban this OP WUM account?

At the very least, make them make another one with a female name if they're going to pretend to be female.

A cursory glance at their threads should be enough.

Reported, anyway.

You could try, I guess.

But you just sound ridiculous.

It is ridiculous.

Because I do have autonomy in this matter. Abortion is legal. If I found out today I was pregnant, I can decide to abort that pregnancy.

I don't have to consult any one in "the society I live in" for their permission or opinion, and my decision has NO impact on them.

They wouldn't even know.

Because it is legal.

You keep waffling on about morality, (i.e. your morality) and society - well, "the society I live in" voted to Repeal the Eighth Amendment, knowing that would allow for legislation to be passed to allow safe and legal abortions in Ireland.

So it seems "the society I live in" weighed up the arguments, and decided they were okay with it. And those who voted against, well, they'll just have to deal with it. "Society" has spoken on this issue.

I wonder what the outcome would be, if society were asked to vote on should theft be made legal? Your analogy is, once again, is ridiculous.

At the risk of stating the obvious, death is a quite effective way to bring an end to someone's concerns about their right to privacy (though in many places it doesn't bring an end to privacy rights). You seem to be taking a view of this which is centred around the process. I'm taking a view which is centred around the patient. People have rights to bodily integrity, and to privacy, and the rights of person A to their bodily integrity and privacy are not subject to the rights of person B to theirs.

Of course theft shouldn't be legal. You have property rights to your own property, but you don't have rights to expropriate the property of others. On the other hand, you do have rights to bodily integrity and personal privacy that are not subject to the rights of others to theirs.

Then there is no point to the argument against abortion. I know I've already explained that more than once, but I'll try again. If what's in your post quoted above is to be held up as a point of the argument to prevent terminating pregnancies, it should also be used to insist that people must be forced by law to give blood, bone marrow, or organ donations where those would save the life of someone else. Otherwise, the people making the argument are being logically inconsistent, and are also creating a moral hazard whereby the rights of people to bodily autonomy and integrity can be interfered with by the rights of other people on an arbitrary, unequal and discriminatory basis.

At the risk of being pedantic, I wouldn't say that. I'd prefer there were no abortions, but it is not right that I (or society) should interfere with the rights of people to decide to terminate their pregnancies.

I wasn't telling you that what you said was pointless and illogical by way of discussion. I was doing it by way of description. Counter points are a tricky thing to handle when describing something.

Its also not a crime!