The Joe Rogan Experience Podcasts

04-09-2021 9:22pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117847792#Comment_117847792

the article opens talking about prescriptions for Ivermectin which is obviously the human version

Prescriptions for ivermectin have seen a sharp rise in recent weeks, jumping to more than 88,000 per week in mid-August from a prepandemic baseline average of 3,600 per week, according to researchers from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

Some pharmacists are even reporting shortages of the drug. Travis Walthall, a pharmacist in Kuna, Idaho, a town of about 20,000 people, said that this summer alone he had filled more than 20 ivermectin prescriptions, up from two or three in a typical year. For the past week he has not been able to obtain the drug from his suppliers; they were all out.

that's obvously not for the animal product which people are buying also

The biggest risk, he added, comes from people taking the livestock product and ingesting a far higher dose than is appropriate for humans — sometimes 10 to 15 times the amount that a capsule approved for humans might contain.

that's not the issue at the heart of it in any case

the issue is that the trials are not showing evidence of it doing anything to prevent or treat covid using the human version obviously

A recent review of 14 ivermectin studies, with more than 1,600 participants, concluded that none provided evidence of the drug’s ability to prevent Covid, improve patient conditions or reduce mortality. Another 31 studies are still underway to test the drug.

“There is great interest in repurposing well-known inexpensive drugs such as ivermectin that are readily available as an oral tablet,” Maria Popp and Stephanie Weibel, the authors of the review, said in an email to The Times. “Even if these circumstances seem ideal, the results from the available clinical studies carried out so far cannot confirm the widely advertised benefits.”

One of the largest trials studying ivermectin for Covid-19 treatment, called the Together Trial, was halted by the data safety monitoring board on Aug. 6 because the drug had been shown to be no better than a placebo at preventing hospitalization or prolonged stay in the emergency room. Dr. Edward Mills, a professor at McMaster University who led the study, which enrolled more than 1,300 patients, said the team would have discontinued it earlier were it not for the level of public interest in ivermectin.

“The data safety person said, ‘This is now futile and you’re offering no benefit to patients involved in the trial,’” Dr. Mills said.

04-09-2021 9:22pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117847588#Comment_117847588

Ok, though there is also 44 published peer-reviewed studies of ivermectin with 39 showing benefits - https://ivmmeta.com

As stated in the WSJ article based on this ivermectin should be given emergency use authorisation.

Odd that the article you quote mixes both the human and animal version of ivermectin.

04-09-2021 9:26pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117847816#Comment_117847816

the trials are one thing - all using human product of course

people outside trials getting it either through a pharmacy or using vet products is the other thing. not to do with the trials - it's about use in the US

it's very simple to understand

most recent trial information all showing it doesn't work against Covid

A recent review of 14 ivermectin studies, with more than 1,600 participants, concluded that none provided evidence of the drug’s ability to prevent Covid, improve patient conditions or reduce mortality. Another 31 studies are still underway to test the drug.

“There is great interest in repurposing well-known inexpensive drugs such as ivermectin that are readily available as an oral tablet,” Maria Popp and Stephanie Weibel, the authors of the review, said in an email to The Times. “Even if these circumstances seem ideal, the results from the available clinical studies carried out so far cannot confirm the widely advertised benefits.”

One of the largest trials studying ivermectin for Covid-19 treatment, called the Together Trial, was halted by the data safety monitoring board on Aug. 6 because the drug had been shown to be no better than a placebo at preventing hospitalization or prolonged stay in the emergency room. Dr. Edward Mills, a professor at McMaster University who led the study, which enrolled more than 1,300 patients, said the team would have discontinued it earlier were it not for the level of public interest in ivermectin.

“The data safety person said, ‘This is now futile and you’re offering no benefit to patients involved in the trial,’” Dr. Mills said.

Dyr · 04-09-2021 9:58pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117847816#Comment_117847816

Of course it mixes the horsey version, they're following the ~~science~~ narrative maaan!

04-09-2021 11:44pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117847923#Comment_117847923

if you actually read the article it's very clear.

small children could grasp the distinction between the 2 very simple points.

Trials say no worky.
Some people regardless getting it from pharmacies on prescription or if don't have private health insurance 'cos drugs super expensive in the US buying the animal products. And the animal products have higher risk of overdose / sickness

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-58449876

Dr. Greenthumb · 07-09-2021 9:38pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117848222#Comment_117848222

What about the studies quote by Jack_K above, are they flawed? How are one set preferred over another? People say trust the science but here we have studies showing the opposite, which science is right? Is it a case of this supports my position so this version of the science is the correct one?

All this is very ambiguous, I'm sure you're going to come back and say your quoted studies are correct but based on what? Everything you or Jack say about the studies you have chosen as proof of your position can probably be said about the other's studies.

07-09-2021 10:11pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117860711#Comment_117860711

I believe that the review of the 14 studies as quoted in the New York September times is a more recent update of the best data

also the July Wall Street Journal is an opinion piece, not a journalistic article

if you're really interested have a look at this below - dubious authors - interesting background of their work

the big study that was being touted for Ivermectin had to be retracted due to duplication and data manipulation

Also for some reason the WSJ was also big on Hydroxychloroquine working back in the day and it has been shown to do nothing for Covid, in fact it can be dangerous

I honestly would be delighted if Ivermectin was looking like something effective for either preventing or treating Covid but it's looking very much NOT at this point

it can kill Covid in a test tube at high dosages but all the most recent trial output including one with 1,300 people is showing no evidence of helping Covid in human dosage levels

There are other trials ongoing to come through but the trend is the trend and it's not showing helping prevent or treat Covid

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gRFnBITJZoA

Sudden Valley · 10-09-2021 10:24am

I see Joe Rogan has had Bret Weinstein on again. Anyone watched listened to that episode? I find I'm a bit tired of listening to joe talk about Covid.

humberklog · 10-09-2021 10:37am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117871364#Comment_117871364

I popped it on when I heard Jonathan Healy was standing on for PK this morning. Lasted 20 minutes and went back to Jonathan Healy.

Brett Weinstein and Heather Heying mostly talking about their book which is about something. Not for me.

I liked the Tom Segura episode. I find Tom to be calming, it's nice to have him on in the background in the studio or a long flight. I don't know anything about him as an actor/comedian and only hear him on JRE.

12-09-2021 7:13pm

Joe admits in the first minute that never got vaccinated. I'm completely done with him and his stupid bro science.

Potatoeman · 13-09-2021 11:48am

I don’t know why people are taking medical advice from people that aren’t doctors. Rogan could setup a hospital in his house with the money he has, not many people have the cash to do that if things go wrong.

Sudden Valley · 13-09-2021 1:18pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117881838#Comment_117881838

At his age I would think that was taking an unnecessary chance. Sure he recovered quickly when he got it but he did get very expensive treatment

Bobeagleburger · 13-09-2021 1:42pm

Rogan is fairly clueless when talking about medical issues.

Most people will roll their eyes when he rambles about his alternative treatments, but unfortunately you will get people that listen to him and follow him.

He thinks he has Covid sussed now. In reality most people get a mild dose and get over it with little or no treatment.

One thing I'll agree with him on is looking after your immune system. Healthy body weight, and decent enough fitness etc. In reality that helped him a lot mote than worm medicine, iv drips or high doses of vitamin c.

The Nal · 13-09-2021 1:45pm

Do we need Joe Rogan to tell us to be healthier? Still baffled by his popularity. And I like him. But as an MMA guy. Not sure why his opinions on anything else are in any way valid.

Sudden Valley · 13-09-2021 3:40pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117884714#Comment_117884714

His podcasts are entertaining so that is why he is the most popular podcaster out there and politically he is not pigeonholed as being Right or left which also doesn't limit his audience. Unfortunately he is very persuasive when speaking about vaccines and ivermectin so people do think he has done enough research. It doesn't help that he only tends to have one guest on so you only see one side of the arguments generally.

Mic 1972 · 14-09-2021 9:09am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117884602#Comment_117884602

not very expensive actually, vitamin C, steroids, ivermectine and monoclonal antibodies

14-09-2021 12:46pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117888271#Comment_117888271

monoclonal antibodies cost about $2,100 per infusion

and you'd need a qualified nurse or doctor to administer and monitor the IV infusion

so an IV infusion a day over 3 days in the states you'd be looking at up to $10,000 depending on what healtcare provider you use

not exactly chump change

Mic 1972 · 16-09-2021 10:16am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117889307#Comment_117889307

Qualified nurses are required for most treatments

Monoclonal Antibodyes cost $450, 2 infusions are clinically necessary.

source https://www.cms.gov/medicare/covid-19/monoclonal-antibody-covid-19-infusion

Hardly an expensive treatment when compared to ICU

16-09-2021 11:08am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117898410#Comment_117898410

that "price" of $450 that you're quoting from the link is a medicare payment for administration and precisely nothing to do with the price for the the actual drug product at all.

It's the payment rate that Medicare would pay a clinic / institution for ADMINISTRATION (giving) of one dose of COVID-19 monoclonal antibody products

you really should try to read these things carefully.....

So actually nothing to do with the cost of the product which medicare would be paying separately to the drug maker and which is still over $1,000 a go

On May 6, 2021, CMS updated the Medicare payment rates for the administration of COVID-19 monoclonal antibody products. Effective for services furnished on or after May 6, 2021, the new Medicare payment rate for administering COVID-19 monoclonal antibody products, authorized or approved by the FDA, is approximately $450.

https://www.cms.gov/medicare/covid-19/monoclonal-antibody-covid-19-infusion

Besides do you really think that Joe Rogan is on medicare?

Does he really have the US equivalent of a medical card do you think? 😂

He had to pay the full private sector price, which varies from $1,250 to $2,100 per dose of the drug and private sector administration charges for a nurse /doctor on top of that, per dose (which are going to be safely more than $450! each time for sure)

Rogan added that his treatments also included monoclonal antibodies, Z-pack antibiotics and a vitamin drip for "three days in a row.".

https://www.npr.org/2021/09/01/1033485152/joe-rogan-covid-ivermectin

Joe Rogan is not on medicare lmao and monocolonal anitibodies are only on medicare for people over 65 so even if he was on medicare (lmao x 2) he wouldn't have qualified to get monoclonal antibodies

nevermind the chance of actually getting it as supply is limited and demand has gone up due to the unvaccinated

Nation Short On Supply Of Key Covid Treatment—Desperate States Told To Reduce Requests

https://www.forbes.com/sites/jemimamcevoy/2021/09/10/nation-short-on-supply-of-key-covid-treatment-desperate-states-told-to-reduce-requests/?sh=bbcdecc67376

How many people are going to have the money for a course of monoclonal antibodies or top-end health insurance that might cover that if they are not over 65?

It's not cheap and the actual effectiveness rate or link to ICU is not known

But what is known is that a vaccine course costs 40 to 50 dollars, free to everyone, not 5,000 to 10,000 for private sector monoclonal antibodies full course, will keep the vast majority from ever going near a hospital, nevermind icu, but we know that Rogan wasn't vaccinated

But he will go and tell everybody about the full course of stuff that he did get, including Ivermectin as discussed extensively already

superflyninja · 16-09-2021 11:59am

I think many people have lost faith in mainstream media (left and right leaning). Both have been shown to be routinely lying in the past few years. Rogan does come across as fairly unswayed by this carry on, Ive heard him criticise both sides so I guess he can appear relatively more trustworthy.

I would imagine a lot of people notice Joe bring on a doctor banging the drum about Ivermectin. Then see the mainstream media trashing it and think well maybe that doctor is right. Particularly when most of the headlines I see are things like "Joe Rogan takes horse pills for covid". Whatever happened to just being honest? That apparently the studies proving Ivermectin has a positive effect are flawed. Im fully vaccinated, Im not a doctor and Im not about to go running off reading through medical papers to investigate Ivermectin's efficacy so I dont know. And who do I turn to for the straight facts? CNN? Claiming Ivermectin is a de worming medicine for animals? Or Joe "Superbrain" Rogan? Talk about rock and a hard place.

Just to clarify I hold no opinion on Ivermectin either way

16-09-2021 7:24pm

I don't think you should be getting your information from CNN or Joe Rogan

humberklog · 17-09-2021 2:16pm

I listened to the Kyle Dunnigan and Kurtz Mitzger episode and they mention and Instagram account called LibsofTiktok. I looked it up this morning and it's had me laughing through lunchtime. Well worth a look.

Mic 1972 · 17-09-2021 3:12pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117898629#Comment_117898629

Whether Joe Rogan is on medicare or on private care is irrelevant.

What is relevant is that the treatment to cure Covid at the early stages and thus avoiding hospitalization is far from a treatment for millionaires.

Hospital beds and ICU is a much more expensive approach

17-09-2021 3:25pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117904486#Comment_117904486

so it costs $450 does it 🤩 ?

you quoted a medicare article, picked up the information completely incorrectly from it of course in the context of Joe Rogan getting monoclonal antibody infusions so it was relevant to say that Rogan was not on medicare

it's in short supply, not enough to give to everyone and not as effective as vaccines at keeping people out of hospitals

and it costs 100 times the cost of vaccines for a course

#makes sense

98% to 99% of the people dying of covid in the US are unvaccinated people - it would be far more effective if those people got vaccines (before it's too late for them)

https://medicalpartnership.usg.edu/covid-19-staggering-statistic-98-to-99-of-americans-dying-are-unvaccinated/

Dyr · 17-09-2021 5:10pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117904554#Comment_117904554

You might want to revise your use of the present tense there

"The analysis was released in May of 2021 and looks at COVID-19 related deaths in vaccinated versus unvaccinated individuals—only .8% (150) of vaccinated people accounted for the 18,000 COVID-19 deaths in May."

and you're gving out about Rogan 😂

17-09-2021 5:14pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117904975#Comment_117904975

it's not going to be much different now - hit me up with the latest stat if you can find it then - it's the poor unvaccinated idiots needlessly dying of Covid over in the US

1,871 people was the USA Covid death count yesterday - pretty much all of them preventable deaths of unvaccinated people

here's an article from September 15 for the state of Philly using data up to start of September, showing that 98.2% of Covid deaths and 96.5% of Covid hospitalisations for 2021 are unvaccinated people.

Pretty indisputable trend there.

Unvaccinated Make Up Nearly 100% of Philly COVID Deaths in 2021

Of the 1,184 Philadelphians who have died from COVID-19 in 2021, 98.2 % were unvaccinated, Philadelphia's acting health commissioner, Dr. Cheryl Bettigole, said, stressing the importance and efficacy of vaccines.

In addition, the unvaccinated make up 96.5% of coronavirus hospitalizations, as opposed to the only 3.5% of hospitalizations from so-called breakthrough infections among the fully vaccinated, she said.

https://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news/local/unvaccinated-make-up-nearly-100-of-philly-covid-deaths-in-2021/2959156/

Dyr · 17-09-2021 6:09pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117904989#Comment_117904989

Off you go, if you want to back up your claim, I'm not doing it for you

You're quoting a website which is making a big deal that most of the people dying of covid were unvaccinnated at a time when most of the population was,,, unvaccinnated. I assume water is wet is the next shocking result

17-09-2021 6:14pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117905215#Comment_117905215

I have shown you updated figures from Philidelphia that has data from this month.

The people most at risk of dying from Covid have had vaccinations available to them in the US since the start of this year so figures for this year in total are perfectly valid to consider

The USA started vaccinations in December 2020

Nearly everyone dying in the US from Covid are unvaccinated people needlessly dying.

Not a large amount over half the population in the US is fully vaccinated and yet the vast vast majority of the deaths are unvaccinated people

It's a sad story really.

Such a waste of lives.

Dyr · 17-09-2021 6:55pm

"Of the 1,184 Philadelphians who have died from COVID-19 in 2021, 98.2 % were unvaccinated, Philadelphia's acting health commissioner, Dr. Cheryl Bettigole, said, stressing the importance and efficacy of vaccines."

"do occur, they have made up less than 5% of all infections in the city since January, Bettigole said."

Same switch and bait statistic again, just admit you were caught peddling spoofery and move on

17-09-2021 7:03pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117905369#Comment_117905369

you must have trouble reading the point that I made above so I'll repeat it.

The people most at risk of dying from Covid have had vaccinations available to them in the US since the start of this year so figures for this year in total are perfectly valid to consider

The USA started vaccinations in December 2020

The line about breakthrough infections which you couldn't even quote properly so it actually makes no sense at all what you quoted- yes less infections in people who got the vaccine - how exactly does that not make complete sense

Most of the people who got Covid were unvaccinated shocker

The US has had vaccines open to all adults since April but deaths are about the most-at-risk groups so it's valid to consider the full year as the most at-risk from death groups have had vaccines available since the start of the 2021 year

the discussion is about Covid deaths and it's the unvaccinated who are dying

Also follows most people who got hospitalised and died were unvaccinated

It's staggeringly simple stuff that a small child could grasp with clarity.

Before the Delta variant the protection from mRNA vaccines against even infection was 90 to 95%

that has dropped with Delta but protection against severe illness and death is still over 90%

and yes boosters will be required for the most at-risk groups, that's known

Though breakthrough infections – which happen despite someone being fully vaccinated – do occur, they have made up less than 5% of all infections in the city since January, Bettigole said.

And as if it was ancient history or something the current death rate was 98 to 99% for unvaccinated people at the end of May2021 for the entire nation of the USA

there is no evidence that that has decreased to any significant extent

it's the unvaccinated idiots getting killed by Covid in the vast majority of cases in the USA - totally preventable deaths

that's still the case

trying to pick holes in stats about getting infected vs dying for vaccinated vs unvaccinated won't change that

The Joe Rogan Experience Podcasts

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