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Something needs to be done about the conspiracy theories forum

1356725

Comments

  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Gotta say, given how often I'm told that I'm part of a cadre of people trying to stop discussion of conspiracy theories, I find it really funny we've so many conspiracy theorists demanding the forum be closed...



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,430 ✭✭✭✭banie01


    Except that regular poster wasn't the 1st to jump on the CT bandwagon on that thread.

    Definitely 1 poster made a CT link beforehand

    "RIP all those who lost their lives. I remember vividly when a classmate told us "6000 people are dead in America" while waiting for our schoolbus. Thought he was joking and laughed at him.

    Terrible that a country can do such a thing to its own people"

    I'd argue that a few more alluded to it too, without being as forthright.



  • Posts: 13,688 ✭✭✭✭ Mara Howling Saliva


    Conspiracy discussions can be great fun and interesting.

    The 'anti-skeptics' of Boards are a long way off the standard of their contemporaries on other discussion boards though. The 'anti-skeptics' on here are good at dunking on quacky conspiracies but as soon as they're met with a sliver of rational resistance on a sensible topic they're left floundering and end up turning themselves inside out to dodge questions and obfuscate.

    There's no layers on here. If you believe in one conspiracy, you believe in them all.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,045 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    If anyone had alluded to it, the discussion didn't turn in that direction.

    The poster I mentioned previously was actively attempting to bring the topic of conspiracy theories to the fore in the discussion something like three full pages after the post you mentioned was ignored.

    Both sides of the Conspiracy theories forum divide are equally obsessed with the subject matter, if you can't stand back and see that then there's not much else that can be said to you.

    Glazers Out!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,045 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    If anyone ever says that you are attempting to stop discussions on conspiracy theories on this site they obviously aren't familiar with you. You live for discussing conspiracy theories. Without it you'd be lost.

    Glazers Out!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,762 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    I dont like how this thread or the CT forum is going so please close it down!


    That's what you're basically saying, you don't like to be questioned and you want an echo chamber where your opinion is never questioned 🤣



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,762 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr




  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Lol More personal attacks.

    I don't feel particularly strongly either way unfortunately.

    I think that the forum offers a unique place where conspiracy theories actually can be discussed. This being opposed to places where conspiracy theories are protected and places where conspiracy theorists aren't willing to put their theories to questioning.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,430 ✭✭✭✭banie01


    I've given you an example above in the 1st page of the thread, a poster made a definitive claim.

    I mentioned others alluding in addition to that example merely as a matter of course. If one is minded to a conspiratorial bent it was more than alluded to on a few occasions before the poster who sparked your ire stuck his oar in.

    But, I must say well done on ignoring the actual example of CT on page 1 of the thread you brought up. To continue to blame someone else for and I quote you on this,

    "In fact they were the only person bringing to topic up, I said as much and was the recipient of a scathing response from them."

    Are actual facts and accuracy beyond the pale for you? You were wrong on that thread and you are wrong in repeating it.



  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    At least I'm not being called the same person as Dohnjoe again...

    Not sure who should be more insulted by that. :P



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,045 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    How was that a personal attack?

    Edit: is it not accurate to state that you are one of the leading contributors on that forum? Where is the attack exactly? Are you embarrassed that you spend so much time there? Surely not.

    Glazers Out!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,045 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    At that point in the thread they were the only person mentioning conspiracy theories.

    Should I have said" they were the only person mentioning Conspiracy theories at that exact point"?

    What is the cut off point for you? The word conspiracy hadn't been mentioned until they said it.

    If you're going to be both pedantic and condescending you could give some consideration to what you yourself are stating as fact.

    This is a prime example of the type of snarky nonsense the Conspiracy theories forum is renowned for.

    Glazers Out!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,430 ✭✭✭✭banie01


    At that point?

    What you actually mean is that in so far as you had paid attention.

    You made a claim on that thread that was mistaken, and now rather than acknowledge you were wrong?

    It's because you hadn't read the 1st page?😂😂

    What I'm "stating as fact", is both lain out in the thread you brought to the discussion and in your own doubling down on your position here.



  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Lol. Now trying to play ignorant.

    Unfortunalately, your charactisation that "I live for discussing conspiracy theories" is false and insulting. Likewise that I would be somehow adversely affected by the closure of the conspiracy theory forum.


    Perhaps rather than comment on me personally because you don't like me, you could address some of the points I've brought up?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,045 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    Show me where conspiracy theories became the topic of conversation on that thread then.

    One person alluded to it on the first page, but it wasn't being actively discussed.

    It took a regular from the conspiracy theories forum to raise the topic in any overt manner.

    I can understand you being upset that someone on your "side" could be made to look bad but the fact is conspiracy theories weren't on the agenda in that thread.

    Carry on being belligerent by all means any rational person can see that you're being unreasonable.

    Glazers Out!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 975 ✭✭✭Parachutes


    There was one particular thread where a poster repeatedly asked someone “What justification would they have to fake the space program” when the thread wasn’t even about the space program and the guy kept saying over and over again ad nauseam that he believed the space program was real.


    To me this is not in good faith and just a blatant attempt to stifle any discussion.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,045 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    Do you post on that forum regularly? Yes you do.

    It's essentially the entirety of your boards.ie output. If you feel saying you live for posting there is insulting then I'm sorry that I caused you any anguish. The fact is you are very active there. Again how that is a personal attack is beyond me.

    Do I detect a hint of a persecution complex perhaps?

    Glazers Out!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,430 ✭✭✭✭banie01


    One person didn't allude to it.

    They stated it, it's in bold a few posts up. Yet that's ignored, along with the other posts that made allusions all made on the same day.

    What's the cut off point for you?

    Not reading the 1st page? Ignoring facts that don't fit the narrative you want to shape? When does it become ok to ignore one post laying out the CT but then blame someone else who mentions it for bringing it up?

    As for belligerence? There's none on my part.

    But, isn't it interesting that when it's pointed out to you that you're wrong, that an example is provided and that you choose to double down on that? That it's belligerence or some notion of defending my side you run to? I'm not on a side, yes I've often posted on the same side of a discussion as the poster you singled out. But we aren't buddies, we don't interact, there's no Skeptics payroll and my only particular interest in this aspect currently is the gymnastics you engage in.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    That's it..

    It's systematic..

    It's obviously not in good faith..

    It would appear to just be an attempt to stifle discussion..



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  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Lol. Good to know you're monitoring my posting habits.

    So you didn't mean it as an insult. Cool.

    You then agree it's a bit weird for people to accuse me and the other conspiracy theory doubters of "stifling discussion"?

    Specially given how we've so many people here arguing for the forum to either have it's discussion stifled to protect the sensitivities of conspiracy theories or to close it down entirely.

    Also, any chance you'll be commenting on my previous points or...?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,045 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    They stated it and it was ignored. Conspiracy wasn't mentioned for another three full pages and when it was it was a conspiracy skeptic from the CT forum that raised it.

    You're just being obtuse now.

    Glazers Out!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,430 ✭✭✭✭banie01


    It was the same day, the thread wasn't yet 1 day old. What's the cutoff?

    You made a claim that was false, shown to be false and now you are moaning that because noone else discussed the 1st claim it wasn't an active topic? On a less than 1 day old thread...

    Really? Why not just acknowledge you took a swing at a poster, that you were wrong and move on?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,045 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    I don't think you're stifling discussion, I said as much in my first post replying to you.

    I just don't t believe your crusade on that forum is any more valid than the people on the opposing sides.

    Glazers Out!



  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Ok cool. Crusade is a bit of a stretch, but ok.

    No comment on my points I've made on this thread then?

    If not, we don't really have anything to discuss.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,045 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    That poster stated that the conspiracy people would be along any minute.

    The were wrong. They raised the topic in the most overt manner possible and they were told where to go.

    There was no appetite for that discussion, surely they also missed the first page as well then?

    Glazers Out!



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,045 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    What points? That you're the victim of some sort of witch hunt?

    Like I said you're all equally strange in that forum by any objective metric.

    Glazers Out!



  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Sorry, no. This is a misrepresentation.

    That simply isn't what the poster was being asked.

    The poster was repeatedly asked "Can you think of a POSSIBLE reason for why they would fake the space program?". Saying that he personally did not subscribe to the theory is not an answer to that question at all.

    The important point that was being asked was "If you can't think of a possible reason for a conspiracy, does this mean that you are arguing that conspiracies don't exist or governments are unwilling to commit them".

    Did you not read that part of the posts?

    Did you also not read the part where the poster in question accused people of arguing a point they didn't? And where he was constantly demanding a live video debate about ... something?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,430 ✭✭✭✭banie01


    They may have done, I don't know. I wouldn't assume to speak for them, much less use their post as an effort to bemoan the state of the CT forum. But given they were replying to 2nd page post as their own 1st post? I doubt it.

    However the post that your target responded too? Is IMO very much a CT post, its the usual means of introducing remote control or similar as the hijack pilots couldn't possibly have flown with enough skill to hit the building. Indeed if they could, how did they miss the pentagon.

    From just reading back on the thread, even before your own 1st post on the thread question...

    The CT'ers were posting even before your target made his PSA. You seem to have a bee in your bonnet regarding them and a blindness to the other mentions of similar.

    Why is that?



  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Lol. Perhaps you should read the thread then? You seem to have made a habit of rushing into threads to have a go at people without reading them properly.

    That's not the point I was making nor did I ever claim that.

    The points I made are here:

    Any comment?

    From anyone arguing that the forum should be altered or closed?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,045 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    I've already stated that the closure of the CT forum wouldn't be a bad thing. I said it in my first post on this thread.

    Glazers Out!



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,045 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    Saying that the maneuvers used to crash into the targets on 9/11 were difficult to accomplish is a conspiracy theory? That's the crux of your argument?

    Glazers Out!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 975 ✭✭✭Parachutes


    Why would he need to justify a reason when he kept saying over and over he didn’t believe that conspiracy. It’s a bad faith attempt on your own part to muddy the waters and make the guy look like a loon who didn’t believe in the space program.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,430 ✭✭✭✭banie01


    It's never you is it?

    No, it's not the crux. It's an example, like the other ones given to you already from the same thread that demonstrate that CT was already live on the thread before you took a swing at a particular poster l

    Why can't you admit being incorrect, over reacting and then doubling down?

    Also, what's the cut off? Is it same day post? Next day? Do days not matter if the threade passes 2 pages?

    Given you posted on page 2 of that thread? Why did you ignore the original CT guff yet jump on your target?

    Is it personal? Do you not like them?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,045 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    That poster was suggesting that there would be an influx of conspiracy supporting users taking over that thread, as if boards.ie is awash with that sort of stuff, it isn't. The thread didn't go that way (much to their chagrin no doubt) and their assertion was in itself showing a belief in a ridiculous notion with no basis in reality, so. Etching they surely would happily show up for being patently ridiculous themselves.

    They were wrong to say that. Did I miss one post alluding to conspiracy? Yeah, maybe because it was so inconsequential (nobody made much of an issue of it bar one reply saying "we've got a live one here").

    What I don't like is the holier than thou attitude some regular CT forum users have, and the co descending attitude they display along side it.

    Glazers Out!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,645 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    Relax. Typically when 9/11 related threads appear on the After Hours forum, they usually descend into all the conspiracy stuff. I recently read a thread, already noticed a mention of a conspiracy on the first page and preemptively wrote that conspiracy theorists would be along. That didn't happen, good.

    I suspect the real reason you got riled up about it is because of personal spats you've had on the conspiracy forum (if I recall correctly ironically siding with a Holocaust denier), which does lead onto the point that if that forum were to become a safe space, not only will conspiracy believers abuse it, but all the contrarians will also flood in, even those who don't believe what they are saying, just to "stick it to the sceptics" or troll or whatever



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,968 ✭✭✭growleaves


    I disagree with the characterisation of anti-conspiracy posters as simply "challenging views" and I've already said why.

    Swamping threads with lists of questions, treating everywhere as a hostile witness and not allowing discussions to develop naturally makes the forum pointless.

    I have good back-and-forths on the COVID forum where I am challenging "official science" but dealing often in hunches where I don't have a litany of evidence to back up every thought.

    I hope mods can make some kind of change but hey whatever it's just an internet forum.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,430 ✭✭✭✭banie01


    You know what, I agree with you regarding the PSA. It's not what I would've done.

    But my own issue on that tangent is that you took that issue, that you were incorrect in claiming they were 1st to mention on thread addressed it on that thread despite being mistaken and then used it as an example here and doubled down on it.

    I don't know how they felt about the discussion stopping on the topic? I'm glad it did, that thread certainly wasn't the place for it but that said?

    I'd certainly agree with countering it's introduction, both as a reason for the attack or a reason drifting off what was a worthy topic.

    Your own issue with that poster blinded any point you were trying to make when you introduced that thread as a point here tbh. You were blind to others both overtly and subtly linking CT and used that thread as a chance to make an attack on the poster. That you did that, and complain about holier than thou attitudes is more than a touch hypocritical.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,762 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    "not allowing discussions to develop naturally makes the forum pointless."


    How do you have a "discussion" when one side repeatedly refuses to discuss? Again we have a simple issue here of

    A: Makes claim

    B: Asks for A's evidence for said claim

    A then refuses to engage, dodges all questions and repeats claim. That's not a discussion.


    If you think what I am saying is incorrect then you obviously have never read the CT threads.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,645 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe



    Personal gripes and spats and grievances aside. These are public discussion forums, people should be free to post their views and people should be free to challenge them. For example, there's an old thread on vaccinations on After Hours where some individuals are expressing anti-vaccination views, and those views are being challenged. It would of course be ridiculous to "shut down the forum" or create a safe space for one side just because one side doesn't want to engage in normal, honest debate/discussion.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,490 ✭✭✭Fighting Tao


    There you are mentioning discussion again, yet you are one of the people trying to prevent it. That’s a little odd.



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  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Because he ran into the thread arguing that other posts held a position they did not. The questions he was being asked were to highlight the flaw in his argument.

    Did you miss that part or...?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,045 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    I recall that thread where you and Kingmob were beating the holocaust denial drum against a poster who had stated repeatedly they were not a holocaust denier (the argument was that they're inclusion of non Jewish people as victims of the holocaust was not accurate in your and Kingmobs views), in the end I believe there was a climb down by Kingmob if not yourself on that thread.

    But thanks for outlining what my problem with you and your cronies actually is. You are a bunch of condescending people who happily sling mud at anyone.

    Glazers Out!



  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    But this isn't an accurate characterisation.

    You're saying that threads are being swamped with "lists of questions". This isn't true.

    Half the time posts with one or two questions are being characterised as this.

    And we've yet to see anyone explain why the questions "What do you believe?" and "why do you believe" are so taxing and unacceptable.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,968 ✭✭✭growleaves


    No it wouldn't be ridiculous. It would be the honest thing to do or else ban certain posters.

    Neither the anti-vaccine/pro-vaccine thread on After Hours nor the COVID forums are a troll circus. The CT forum is.



  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Highlighting this.

    We keep hearing that conspiracy theorists are only there for discussion.

    Yet none of the people complaining have acknowledged that this stuff outlined above happens.



  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Not really an answer to any of my points. But ok.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,968 ✭✭✭growleaves


    I disagree. There might be two or three posters replying to one post who instead of engaging with a point ask two or three questions each, often of tangential relevance.

    In the Great Reset thread you began patronisingly insulting me when I asked you to narrow your line of inquiry to something manageable - you implied you had to dumb it down for me.

    No one is going to put up with that. I reported your post but you were not warned by a Mod (as far as I'm aware) and I rightly refused to engage any further.

    Of course then you can claim that posters have run away, forgetting that you are not the personal owner of each thread setting the agenda and demanding to be satisfied.



  • Subscribers Posts: 42,312 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    So honest question.

    Do you want a forum where conspiracy theories cannot be questioned?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,645 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    Okay, then report posters if you believe they are trolling. Posters are regularly carded (and banned) on that forum.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,968 ✭✭✭growleaves




This discussion has been closed.
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