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Michael D Higgins insists he is President of Ireland, refuses to commemorate partition

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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,667 ✭✭✭Impetus


    Northern Ireland is not a country and does not have a president. It does not have a country code under ISO or UN regulations (like IRL or IE) - ie ISO 3166 2 and 3 character codes for Ireland.

    Higgins is not saying that he is 'President of Northern Ireland' - there is no such office.

    Many British companies make up their own abbreviation for IRL, due to some agenda in their culture. The motto seems to use anything but IRL or IE, as are used by every other country in Europe to refer to Ireland.

    Phrases such as 'Southern Ireland', Éire (usually mis-spelt without a fada) to refer to the '26 counties' have no basis in law be it Irish or European or international law.

    Similarly there is no such country code as 'ROI' (as often used by entities who should know better - eg AIB Bank etc, the soon to be defunct (in Ireland, due to Brexit etc) Marks and Spencer etc). In banking terms, 'ROI' is an abbreviation for return on investment.

    The reference to Higgins as the President of the Republic of Ireland seems to me to have been contrived by either little Englanders and/or little so called 'unionists' to provoke bad international relations. It shows up the inventors of the phrase for the obnoxious people many of them are.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,623 ✭✭✭✭downcow


    This is interesting and scuppers the slant being given by some on here that it’s all the dup doing.

    this is straight of my local alliance party councillors Facebook page. He is also a major promoter of Irish language signage etc. Maybe you will hear it from him Everything below is from his post

    “”Nail. On. Head.

    A disquieting glimpse of what lies ahead https://www.e-pages.dk/sundayindependent/288/article/1448138/28/2/render/?token=ce4eb640cb98a3ad34612b3a8595e18e&vl_platform=ios&vl_app_id=ie.belfasttelegraphnewsstand.ereader&vl_app_version=3.0.5

    “”



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,324 ✭✭✭Shebean


    Thing is you have to respect other peoples beliefs and culture. Higgins is President of Ireland as far as our constitution is concerned. While not everybody agrees with the queen being queen of the U.K. and Northern Ireland, we don't send her invites marking 'queen of the U.K.' and leave out any reference to N.I. because it would be disrespectful. You could call yourself Irish and I'd respect that. I respect you consider yourself British, you are. However your status of British wasn't arrived at in a democratic and fair manner, which is why some recognise it and respect it even if they'd like to change it. It's called mutual respect. We don't expect those in authority to behave like petty bigots. Michael D. was right.



  • Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Good for you, on this discussion board however you appear to be a troll and only out for arguments. I posted on a different thread you frequent, a long time ago, I was in fact 'on your side' if that's a thing, but you couldn't accept it and kept going till you found something to argue with me about.

    So, I did ask earlier, I'll ask again, if this was not a political event and was purely an event organised by churches, then why did the DUP make it political?



  • Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    People born in northern Ireland have the right to identify As whichever nationality they wish.

    Why would you argue about something we all agreed on back in the 90s?



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  • Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Being born and raised in Ireland does not make you Irish, legally.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,624 ✭✭✭votecounts


    you're a paddy to most of them, deluded to think differently



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,300 ✭✭✭✭jm08


    According to the Heads of the Church today on RTE1 lunchtime, the event had unfortunately been included in some sort of list of centenary celebration events. They said that the Irish Gov. were not happy about that, so they took it out and they thought that everything was ok then. They seemed to have ignored that Michael D. told them that he had a problem with the title of the event and at that stage told them if unchanged, he would have to just wish them well.

    Politicisation happened at that stage and thats why Higgins backed out (as he did from similar event in 2016 because DUP were not attending).

    Can you answer me, why are the DUP complaining about him not attending? When Arlene Foster refused to attend any 1916 commemorations, Martin McGuinness said that it was understandable as to why she should not want to attend.



  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Of course not, but you can't fail to see the results of polls over the last 5 years that show the British people overwhelmingly don't regard NI as important or worthy.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,958 ✭✭✭circadian




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  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 10,286 Mod ✭✭✭✭Jim2007


    Look at there they are not and where we are.......

    It is all very convenient to blame the church while at that same time ignoring the fact that these are the same people accepted excommunication as the price of taking part in the war of independence and of course the reports to Rome by the Dublin bishop at the time. I don't agree at all that these people were lead into doing anything they did not want to do.



  • Registered Users Posts: 26,050 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    Well also cause it's not a real language and most Ulster Scots people know that and any non nationalists I've met from NI think it's a joke

    It's just English spelt with an accent and was designed cause if one side had something the other had to



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,668 ✭✭✭ittakestwo


    Gerry Adams is a British citizen whether he likes it or not. You don't adopt citizenship of a country where you are born. Anybody from the North is a British citizenship. He is much a British citizen as you. He is from Ireland as are you. You have much right to call yourself Irish as he does.



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,614 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump


    As Ali G said to Sammy Wilson

    AG: So is you Irish?

    SW: No, I'm British

    AG: So is you 'ere on 'oliday?




  • Registered Users Posts: 26,050 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    You can renounce citizenship too.

    Not sure if Adams legally has but it can be done



  • Registered Users Posts: 7 PresumingEd


    It's mad, you have Scots living in Ireland pretending to be English.

    Where else would ya get it?!



  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    You should apply for your Irish passport, it gives a whole different perspective.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,609 ✭✭✭Fionn1952


    The smug overconfidence with which you approach many of these conversations really belies the level of knowledge you think you have.

    You're a walking paragon of the statement that a little bit of knowledge is a dangerous thing.



  • Registered Users Posts: 26,050 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    Your dead right hear on Queen Elizabeth II but sadly there is a weird mix of smug yuppie "new Irelanders" and self hating Irish who are trying who are trying to tell us we need to keep making gestures and walk on eggshells for the DUP with 0 respiration required



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,115 ✭✭✭Shoog


    The truly Ironic thing is that many Ulster-Scots were originally Catholic and only became Protestant because that was a requirement of been part of the plantation.

    In my case I am Irish by dint of my Scottish Catholic ancestors 🤣



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  • Registered Users Posts: 18,774 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm


    Attacking the poster is the lowest form of debate.

    I was taught in the Irish education system as was Michael D. Although he would be of a generation where the proclamation would be plastered on classroom walls. And ‘pending the reintegration of the national territory’ was viewed not just as an aspiration, but a right.

    In fairness to Michael D , on many other issues he has played it correctly IMO. But on this one to use parlance of his beloved Galway United. I think he has scored an OG. And it has resulted in a propaganda coup for the DUP and hardline Unionists. By Michael D not going he has given the DUP a moral victory.

    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,774 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm


    Well given that following the GFA people can identify as British or Irish in NI, it is not that simple.

    Plus not all in NI view it as an apartheid that is you transferring your emotions on the issue. Look at Rory Mcllroy’s generation. Here is a guy who has said ‘ I’ve always felt more British than Irish.’ But yet was proud to represent Ireland in the recent Olympics. Like his youth GUI days. You can’t pigeonhole people to a nationality, because it suits your own personal political narrative. It is up to the people themselves to chose that was the fundamental point of the GFA.

    As for those who use deliberately antagonistic Phrases such as ‘President of the ROI’ (they could have got away with Eire) or people who use the phrase ‘The 6 counties’ it is deliberately insulting.

    Both sides who do such things are as bad as each other IMO. And Michael D should have risen above it and all bar ‘the usual’ would have given him great credit for doing so IMO.

    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



  • Registered Users Posts: 254 ✭✭lurleen lumpkin


    Moral victory. By the DUP. That's an interesting take.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,237 ✭✭✭hawley


    Michael's father was a hardline anti-Treaty. He fought in the civil war and was quite bitter about shape the Free State took. When you saw previous governments endeavor to keep communication open in the wake of bombings and other disgusting practices, this seems really petty by MH. Just as a matter of interest, what would have been an appropriate title for the event?

    https://twitter.com/peterlynas/status/1439124011213070337?s=20



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,774 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm


    I think leaving out the word ‘partition’ would have made it a bit easier to take for some. But IMO people need to get over themselves and stop pretending a two state Ireland never happened. If people can’t get over that there is no hope for the future IMO. It is ‘head in the sand’ stuff.

    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 39,746 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    As our President said, he did not want to attend because of the politicisation of the event. Which is what your councillor is doing and what you have been doing in recent days! Through your posts, you are proving that MDH made the correct decision.



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 39,746 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    As the GFA and the subsequent case taken by Emma de Souza showed, you can be 100% Irish and living your entire life in NI.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,213 ✭✭✭✭Furze99


    At the beginning and end of the day, this is church service. A f**king church service that yous are all getting your knickers in a twist over, including Michael D.

    One that has been put together by the the main faith denominations on the island. Many people here and including our President should be ashamed of themselves for politicising such a benign and non threatening meeting of minds. It's pathetic.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,300 ✭✭✭✭jm08


    Michael D. is 80 years old, so would be a lot closer to the affects of partition on this country. In an interview with Mike Murphy for Irish Times Senior Times he spoke of his family's part in the War of Independence. His father and his uncle having fought in the War of Independence together, took opposite sides about the Treaty and never spoke to each other again. His father was anti-Treaty and was refused a pension by the Pro Treaty parties!

    Its amazing that Michael D. wasn't brainwashed into joining Fianna Fail rather than Labour bearing in mind his brainwashing early education by Fianna Fail and the poor treatment of his father by Fine Gael when in Government. Really interesting interview about his early life and well worth a listen.

    https://soundcloud.com/user-682413562-561358898/senior-times-podcast-episode-1



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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,189 ✭✭✭Brucie Bonus


    You just gave the reason he decided to give it a miss.

    Also imo, the church are as murderous as any terrorist group including the BA.



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