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Working From Home Megathread

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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,480 ✭✭✭floorpie


    Natural periodic downtime is what I mean. I can't go for a stroll around my neighbourhood outside of my breaks unless I choose to skive, which I don't/wont.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,066 ✭✭✭HerrKuehn


    So you prefer a kind of "enforced skiving" through pointless meetings?



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Have never understood the view that WFH is more intense. Surely its as intense as you want to make it? Can you not go for a walk in between meetings - replicate what you would do in the office?



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,548 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    It's not about "skiving" it's about planning your time and thinking differently.

    Not trying to be a smart-arse here , but as someone who has worked remote for well over a decade planning out your time is very important.

    You need to bake in the time for the school-run or the quick break to stretch your legs etc. It's important to establish those norms in your work environment.

    It's also about communicating that stuff with your colleagues and boss - "I'll be unavailable from 3pm to 3:30pm as I have to collect the kids from school" etc.

    At home , grabbing a coffee probably takes a lot less time than in the office so give yourself back that time by taking the time it would have taken to walk to the cafeteria, queue up and pay etc. for yourself - Take the scenic route back to your desk , do a lap of the garden before coming back ,walk to the corner of the street or whatever works in your set-up.

    You can't see that stuff as "skiving" at all - It's the same as what you are talking about when in the office , you are just managing it differently that's all.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,480 ✭✭✭floorpie


    I don't "prefer" it, this is just my observation about productivity (which is important to me)

    No, can you? I'm expected to be at work during my contracted hours.

    As I say, I believe natural downtime is important for long term productivity. That said, I'm not permitted to do the things you mention, and would never get permission to do these things daily, e.g. taking half hour off from 3pm to 3:30pm. I could do them without asking permission, but this would be skiving and I wont do this



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  • Registered Users Posts: 534 ✭✭✭Young_gunner


    I think you're a troll



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,480 ✭✭✭floorpie


    Your suggestion is to leave work when you're meant to be in work, and I'm a troll? I'm serious.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,066 ✭✭✭HerrKuehn


    Attending meetings just for the sake of it is not productive though. A meeting should only have people attending who need to be there and only last as long as is needed to cover the topics. They should be thought of as a cost, where the hourly rate of all attendees is added up to give the cost of the meeting.

    Given that you are talking about scheduled breaks, it must be PS. In my job I have never had any scheduled breaks, although I have never worked contracted hours either (generally quite a bit over). I suppose it depends on the type of work, in software development there can be times where a lot of thinking through a problem is required. At times like that I would still be thinking through it on weekends. I think with WFH it facilitates this type of work situation where it isn't just trying to get 40hrs a week done or whatever. There can be times when it is going well and I could put in 14 hours, on the flip side I might have days where I stop at 2pm as I am not making much progress. WFH can allow you to tailor your work time to take advantage of when you are most productive.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I’ve just been for a walk around the garden with my coffee between meetings. Exactly the same time spent as me going to the kitchen on the office and making myself a snack. Or spending 5 minutes going up a few floors and to the other end of the office for a meeting. As a result, I will be refreshed and more productive in my next meeting. Your employer sounds terrible if you feel that you can’t do that, and if I were you I’d be looking for another job. It doesn’t have to be like that.



  • Registered Users Posts: 198 ✭✭zebastein


    You sound like you are not accountable of your own life and that you just do what you are told to do. It is written in most of the contracts what kind of breaks you are entitled to, and I am pretty sure most of the contracts have a 60min break for a 8h work day. Now it is up to you to ensure your rights are respected and that you take your breaks. Nobody is going to ask you if you are thirsty or want to pee before each meeting like in a kindergarden.



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  • Posts: 0 Gwen Tall Dart




  • Registered Users Posts: 1,480 ✭✭✭floorpie


    Attending meetings just for the sake of it is not productive though

    Don't get me wrong, I dislike irrelevant meetings and wouldn't put up with them for long. My observation is simply that there's natural downtime baked into a regular day in office, which doesn't translate across to WFH (maybe "irrelevant meetings" was a bad example).

    Given that you are talking about scheduled breaks, it must be PS.

    Yep. Although I've always had scheduled breaks in every job, private and public.

    on the flip side I might have days where I stop at 2pm as I am not making much progress.

    Same, but I find that this is more acceptable in office than from home.

    I'm not arguing against WFH here. My productivity is at times far higher WFH, like others ITT. I just find it more intense and demanding, and for me is less sustainable.



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,843 ✭✭✭Backstreet Moyes


    What kind of place do you work that means you can't step aside for 5 minutes to take a break.

    My boss encourages me to take breaks so I can relax my mind.

    I would certainly be more productive by taking short breaks than working non stop and not giving your brain anytime to relax.

    You must work in a horrible play if you think taking a quick break is skiving.



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,548 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    As I say, I believe natural downtime is important for long term productivity. That said, I'm not permitted to do the things you mention, and would never get permission to do these things daily, e.g. taking half hour off from 3pm to 3:30pm. I could do them without asking permission, but this would be skiving and I wont do this

    But you do some of them in the office today "without permission" per se so replicating that at home shouldn't be any different.

    Obviously I don't know the role you are in - If you are working in a customer facing role (call centre type of thing) then just going for a 5 minute wander or blocking out time for the school run isn't practical , but if you are not locked into a specific "must be available" schedule I'm not seeing the huge issue here.

    You talk of "natural downtime" in the office and of its importance , but can't seem to imagine how that same natural downtime might occur in your home office - Why is that?

    WFH is different and you have to adjust your mindset (as does your employer) accordingly for it to work successfully long term, but it is absolutely achievable with a bit of planning and flexibility on all sides.

    Also - And again really not trying to be awkward here , but what exactly is your definition of "skiving" - Is it just being away from your desk or does it include those moments where you are at your desk but staring into space for a few minutes etc.?

    Managing your mental/physical well-being by taking regular mini-breaks during the day isn't skiving , it's actually making you more productive in the long run.

    Presenteeism and Productivity aren't the same thing at all - That's one of the keys things that employers and indeed employees need to get their heads around when it comes to Remote work.

    Just because I'm at my desk all day doesn't automatically mean I'm more productive or of more value than the person that takes 5 minutes to stretch their legs every hour or whatever.

    The work output is what matters - As long as the work is getting done on time and to the appropriate standards , where I'm sitting at any given moment is meaningless.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,335 ✭✭✭PokeHerKing


    Natural downtime. That's another new buzzy saying to add to urban dictionary that pro office chort seem to be creating.

    In reality it's bollix. What your saying is there's plenty of time in the office to do things other than work but at home its consider skiving. Pull the other one my friend , it honks.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,480 ✭✭✭floorpie


    I said I don't skive, and that high productivity is important to me, whether in office or WFH. It is of course 'skiving' if you're expected to be at your desk but you leave for half an hour, as suggested in comments above.

    I agree with all of this!



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]




  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,548 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    It is of course 'skiving' if you're expected to be at your desk but you leave for half an hour, as suggested in comments above.

    That all comes back to "Presenteeism vs. Productivity" though.

    "Expected to be at your desk" vs. "Expected to complete X amount of work in Y amount of time" **

    Which is more value to both you and your employer?

    ** Within the specific construct of your role of course , for a receptionist answering the phone or something "presenteeism" matters to some extent , but for most other office based roles it really really doesn't.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,635 ✭✭✭✭Frank Bullitt


    What kind of job would take aim at you for takin time to go for a walk, get the shopping done, workout, clean etc? Sounds dire.

    All that matters is that you get your work done, who cares how long it should take. Results are what matters, and you can get them done just as easy at home if you are vigilant with your time.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    How many chats like this are happening across Ireland these days. Quite a few I'd imagine, with a lot more to come



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  • Registered Users Posts: 10,936 ✭✭✭✭martingriff


    You do you its in the law that you have to be given a break after a certain amount of hours so in the morning and evening yes. You seem to try and make issues where there is none. Your looking for problems and not solutions. Each of those "down time" moments you can do at home from getting up to stretch (very important) to flicking on the kettle. I love how in your previous mail you call it down time but if it is at home you must be "wasting time".


    In saying all that I don't think working 100% at home is a good thing either as I feel its important to go into the office meet the people once a week ot two



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,936 ✭✭✭✭martingriff


    There called going on a break look up working time laws they are essential



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,046 ✭✭✭✭Potential-Monke


    Remember, if your WFH job has you staring at a screen all day, you should be taking a 5 min break from looking at the screen every hour. Health and Safety and all that jazz.

    I do like that comic strip that DaCor posted above, sums up my place perfectly, except they wouldn't offer anything else to try and retain you. Starting to see more and more places offer permanent WFH but I'm not sure if I'm ready to join the daywalkers again, so I'll tough it out in my place until they send me back in. Then I shall have a notebook and note every single breach of H&S regulations and I will refuse to come back in if I get sick even once (18 months sick free now!!).



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,335 ✭✭✭PokeHerKing




  • Registered Users Posts: 1,480 ✭✭✭floorpie


    The laws for breaks are far less than what people are describing here. There's no law saying you're allowed a 5 minute trip around the garden every hour, 15 minute trip around the neighbourhood, half hour to go get the kids from school, etc.

    I feel like you all are. You're all working harder from home but are also taking half hour breaks, going on school runs, etc. You in particular seem to have difficulty understanding that a 5 minute walk to a meeting room is natural downtime in an office that you aren't obligated to get at home.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I genuinely don’t know why you are trying to make life so hard on yourself. This is 100% on you



  • Registered Users Posts: 534 ✭✭✭Young_gunner




  • Registered Users Posts: 534 ✭✭✭Young_gunner




  • Registered Users Posts: 11,635 ✭✭✭✭Frank Bullitt


    You are confusing working "harder" with working more efficiently. Big difference.



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  • Posts: 31,118 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Yes, And smarter, just because the "official" working day is 7 hours, does not mean you have to spread it out over the 7 hours.

    You may do that in the office to always look busy for the boss, but not at home. If I get it done in a couple of two hour spurts then great, I have still provided the same productivity as I did in the office just been smarter about it and have given myself a productivity bonus of free time.



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