What are your views on Multiculturalism in Ireland? - Threadbanned User List in OP

If you are not interested in backing up your claims then don't make them in the first place. This thread contains enough unsubstantiated allegations as it is. Claiming that The Journals article of Most Irish people want the government to take in more than 230 Afghan refugees is "stretching beyond what the poll represents" is complete nonsense when the literal title and results of the poll say "Most want more Afghan refugees".

Pointing to the sampling method used by the pollster as evidence of wrongdoing is incorrect. Yes, the sample size of 1,000 consisted of responses of a listed of invited respondents of 5,000 panellists. What you left out was that the 1000 were selected according to their gender, age, region, political interest, past voting behaviour, religious adherence and educational attainment- Their responses were weighted according to these variables in line with the CSO and exit polls. This is done so that sample of 1000 is more representative of the general population than the original 5000. This sampling method is common. It was used extensively in the last Irish election, for example: https://anthonybmasters.medium.com/a-methodological-summary-of-2020-irish-election-polling-387a9eeb497d

If you cannot defend your comment that the "inputs were manipulated to produce the output that those commissioning the survey wanted", then don't expect us to take your posts seriously. Similarly, we can dismiss your comment that the poll was "selection bias in action".

I think the result would be different in a referendum making decisions on such a small number in a poll is not good policy .

It’s as though you imagine you’re talking to a child. I gave my opinion on the poll, I didn’t expect you would take my opinion seriously when it doesn’t agree with your own. I’m fine with that.

The logic behind it is fairly simple -

One specific type of permission to live in Ireland is known as permission to remain. This is a status that is granted at the discretion of the Minister for Justice and Equality. Leave to remain may be granted to people who have been refused a refugee or subsidiary protection declaration but who are not returned home for humanitarian or other compelling reasons.

Le Pen isn’t going to waltz into power at all, Macron is just as handy with the rhetoric about French national identity, similar to the example of Denmark given earlier in the thread and the emphasis they place on a Danish identity -

Theres no ignorance of any perceived “economic fallout” from growing numbers of asylum seekers or refugees though. It’s true that there isn’t a bottomless pit of public money, but it doesn’t work the way you’re trying to suggest either as though providing funding for supports for one group of people means taking funding from another group of people, and you’re presenting it as a false dilemma between increasing taxes or cutting someone’s benefits. By that logic one could argue that the Government being expected to fund the Mica Redress Scheme means cutting someone else’s benefits (I have a suspicion you don’t care all that much about either tbh) -

They could take that estimated figure and double it and still it wouldn’t come close to the final cost, much like the rising cost of the children’s hospital.

It is fair to say alright that providing for asylum seekers and refugees does place an enormous financial burden on the State, but it’s done by way of fulfilling the State’s human rights obligations. The cost of direct provision for example last time I checked costs the State about €1.3m per month, just checked again there, it’s likely to have only increased since 2019 -

I have no idea of the financial breakdown for individual asylum seekers or refugees but I can say with a fair degree of confidence that analysing the cost of any group of refugees or asylum seekers will have been only guesswork and exaggeration, so I’d take those calculations with a grain of salt. The figures in the article above aren’t even necessary to refute your claim that they receive more than a normal unemployed person, it’s just yet another false dilemma you’re presenting with the whole idea of funding an asylum seeker or refugee means we can’t fund benefits for someone else. It’s ridiculous to suggest anything is being ignored by anyone because they don’t share your perspective or don’t see things the way you do, and certainly I have no interest in whether you’re either racist or bigoted, I’m definitely not interested in turning you into a martyr.

As it happens though, people who are providing their services to the State are entitled to be paid for their services. They pay taxes too, and that makes them taxpayers, same as plenty of immigrants who are also taxpayers, and all you’re doing is trying to pit one group in Irish society against each other, ignoring the reality that people know better. They may not know everything there is to know about taxation, immigration, employment, welfare and all the rest of it, but they’re not stupid either.

A €1200 fine is pathetic. Over 9 employees, he probably saves €1200 every week in the wages they are willing to accept vs the wages Irish workers would demand for the same work. The court is just ticking a box here. The clear message to other business owners is to give them a green light to take the chance they will never get caught. Because even if they are, the punishment is next to nothing.

That terrorists of all ilks and shades have infiltrated their host countrys, is beyond a shadow of doubt, and their infiltration was with one and only one aim and plan, IE:- Terrorism.

A massive payment by the EU etc,in return for a general amnesty for all those men of fighting age etc. would be a very good solution, will be very acceptable to the regime.....for sure!!! But realistically, once the regime receives the much needed cash, what do you think wlil happen?

Not too sure will it be acceptable to the "beneficiaries" though...and genuinely, I could not see too many accepting it...my opinion, based on my own experienced while there. Had there been regime change, then OK, it might stand a chance. But not now as things stand, its not the kind of "Forgive and forget " society. Anyone who left, has crossed a line. And your remark about Loyalists is proof of that. This does not take from the fact that there are reports that some have returned to certain areas, but I have no first hand knowledge or proof of that as of yet.

The comment about becoming as German as the Germans thenselves is true of any Muslim moving from an Islamic Country to a non Islamic one, and not confined to Syria. ( but this is a different issue , even if it is true and reinforces your view )

The point about them not being willing to fight or work for their own country, why would they fight for their host country.....well first and foremost, is the fact that there was a large % of the population wanted change, and with good reason. So why would this % be prepared to fight and die for the regime??? The opposite is what happened, civil war. So now theres a choice: One to fight for the regime, or two, fight against it. ( you can add isis into the mix also) Its not a question, or even close, to people refusing to fight for their Country. The ones who left did the right thing, absolutely 100%, and if I had been in their position, I'd do the same thing. And remember, lots of them did fight and die for their Country. This story still has a long way to go IMHO.

think of all the money he’s saved by employing them, at minimum wage or under... 1,200 euros is fûck all, he’s saved multiples of that cash, it’s in fact probably a days takings for one establishment ... no sort of deterrent whatsoever.... it will have cost the state multiples more to investigate, charge, prosecute / convict him... fines of 133 euros per person..Jesus.. he’s still up on the deal...

Well, I wouldn't write the regime a black cheque for a lump sum up front! It would be staggered payments linked to targets met: ultimately how many Syrians returned home, with funds released as those targets are met. Both the regime and the "refugees" would require payments. I agree that the instinct will be for the regime to reward loyalists, rather than forgive traitors, but that is why the EU needs to present some different incentives. The status quo of disaffected fighting age Syrian males residing in EU states is no benefit to the EU. A foreign based enclave of Syrians funding dissent, unrest and instability in Syria is of no benefit to the Syrian regime. The Syrian regime has won - diplomatic recognition and economic backing/bribes should allow for both groups (Syrian regime & EU) to achieve their aims after the end of out and out violence.

I can see the argument for why they would not be conscripted to fight for the Syrian regime they disagree with. But why then did these men not fight for one of the factions fighting to overthrow the regime, if their country and its future was so dear to them? If they were pacifists, why don't they return to rebuild their beloved homeland after the end of violence? Is there any evidence these men would risk more for Germany than they were prepared to risk for Syria?

Absolutely 100%...

All able bodied Syrian males, who deliberately left Syria to avoid being conscripted or otherwise being caught up in the war, are for the most part unable to return,,For their families, women kids etc. Its different,,they have very strong family and clan system, so these returnees will be looked after. And what would the regime gain by harming them? No, the last thing they want now is the backlash ( and worse ) that harming these families would generate, and thats on the home ground, Imagine the international outrage?? Syria is still a "hot" country, and in many areas, there has been outbreaks of fighting, especially where the regime has not lived up to its agreements. But for the able bodied menfolk its a far different story.....I have friends who tell me that its possible, upon payment of quite large amount's of cash, but none of them are prepared to take the chance. They know only too well what the regime are capable of.

Well the result would be interesting !!

Yes, this is shocking.

Not alone do we often let bogus AS stay here, by giving them leave-to-remain, after their application has failed, but now we intend to reward them.

You couldn't make it up!!

What'll it cost if Roderick gets his way and all asylum seekers get the keys to their own pad within 4 months of arriving?!! As more and more countries in Europe say thanks but no thanks, paddy is rolling out the red carpet!