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Varadkar hits the right note for Landlords

1235

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,367 ✭✭✭JimmyVik


    I know of a couple of cases where people let to the council on the LTL scheme. Council put in anti-social tenants and washed their hands of it.

    So in those places now you have anti-social council tenants ruining the lives of the people living around them. And the council just say "talk to the hand", i mean "gdpr", "gdpr", "the hand" "yeah gdpr" is more what they say.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,367 ✭✭✭JimmyVik


    A long term rent paying tenant used to be considered an asset. And if they turned out not to be so, then they could be evicted quickly.

    Normally they would have been under notice and the new owner would let them stay anyway.

    Or if an owner occupier was buying they could just give notice when they buy and be sure the tenant would move out.

    Things have changed.

    Now everyone is aware that any house sold without vacant possession probably has issues with the tenant who wont leave. And the new buyer cannot get them out either, so more or less garaunteed a crap tim with their new investment. Also an owner occupier will not buy at all now with tenants in situ because they may never get to move into their new house. You would want to be crazy now to buy anything with a tenant in situ, owner occupier or investor, so we know that anything being sold with tenants is 100% a problem tenant nowadays.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,007 ✭✭✭rightmove


    indo hamming it up.

    Tenancies Board vows to go after landlords after rent rises exceed legal caps - Independent.ie

    Where I live a LL stood outside her house with a placard that the tenant had not paid rent in 18 months. It was followed up nowhere ..not even on local FB. Reminds me of a story a friend told me of ringing up a well known afternoon radio show to give the other side on a debate (not housing related). They were told the public are not interested in that side. Seems to be the case with housing also



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,007 ✭✭✭rightmove


    amazing how a small elite decide what the public are interested in.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,503 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    Yep, the council use those long term lease schemes as a way of closing the book on problem clients for a decade


    It also shuts the left wing political local TD s up, squeaky hinge etc



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,976 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    I have no professional qualifications on anything. MM neither your solicitor or Engineer are doing any real checks. The contract and planning are the same any part of any check at an auction. It's about 2-3 hours or less checking on either. No Engineer will do a check on any house for less than 1k and that would only be a really small property. Look at the costs for electrical and Ber certification. I looked at getting an structural survey for one property I was buying it was a small terrace two bed in 2016 for to get mortgage lending on it. The engineer was 7-800 at the time and the bank's solicitor was another grand plus. I took out a personnel loan and did no professional checks

    Slava Ukrainii



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,503 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    I assure you that my solicitor fully reads the contract for sale



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Thats a hell of a risk, not only your own savings, but borrowed money on top, all riding on your “feel” and layman’s opinion. If your solicitor/surveyor didn’t do what they charged for, you at least have some chance of redress.

    You are the buyer auction houses hope for.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,367 ✭✭✭JimmyVik


    I think if they bothered to actually look at their own data a reason that the average rent might be going up might be that all of the ones locked on lower rents might be selling at a rapidly increasing pace.

    You would think they might be interested in investoigating that possibility, but the RTB as we've seen before are not shy about massaging the figures.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,007 ✭✭✭rightmove


    yes another double jeopardy of the new moral hazard housing policies. Those on warm summer happy below market rent rates getting exposed to the cold bitter realities when they finally have to surface onto the market to face the bleak winter rental landscape in their flipflops.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,976 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    It all depends on how you access risk. At auction you be lucky to buy one in 10 properties you are interested in. in the 2015-2020 period there was multiple properties available at discount prices. A solicitor and engineering evaluation of each property would cost in the region of 2K/property. Accross 10 properties that is 20K it changes the price discount. On one property I bought it would have been equivlent to 40% of the property price. People(myself included) take similar risks buying cars. some peoplewouldpay 50% or more on a car in a private sale.

    I did not buy blind I visited and accessed the property myself. To the first couple I went to see I got a buildr friend to come with me and showme what to look out for. As I said it takes 2-3 hours to read a sales contract. The first one isthe hardest to check out and took me 10+ hours to understand the gobbledygook. After you read the contract the main thing is to watch for any changes as thisis unually when they add in sneaky bits.

    On planning nearly all the old files are now online. So you can check the plans and planning of anything online. Its like buying cars privately it not for everyone. Some day you may make a mistake but you hope by that time you will havesaved more than you can lose.

    Slava Ukrainii



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,680 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997



    Unless its in the middle of nowhere, or undesirable, there hasn't been oversupply for a very long time.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,976 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    Neither was it indicated that there was. The debate was about how at an auction lately houses with tenants failed to sell. This was caused by the continual changing of regulation on renting. A few years ago it was an advantage to have a tenant in rural and smaller urban area's

    Post edited by Bass Reeves on

    Slava Ukrainii





  • I’ve just had to fork out €2300 out of pocket on a new boiler for my let, for which I am locked way below market rent. I am seriously considering giving due notice plus more to sell up next year or early following year. The tenants are good, been there a long time, but it’s getting pointless. I can think of better ways to invest.



  • Registered Users Posts: 451 ✭✭MBE220d


    Around my area, there was up until 2 or 3 years ago, but you seem to think you have superior knowledge of how the auctions work and what works and what doesn't,

    What I know about auctions has served me well so don't try and pick holes in everything I post.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,503 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    It's never more desirable to buy with tenants in situ IMO.

    The tenant feels more entitled when their presence predates the buyer , better to select a tenant fresh



  • Registered Users Posts: 451 ✭✭MBE220d


    Depends, everyone has their own way of doing things.

    If I was buying a buy to let locally I would prefer it vacant but if I got it at the right price having tenants wouldn't bother me.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,680 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997



    Its not my opinion.

    There are a litany of significant practical and financial and legal reasons why a sitting tenant most of the time (not always) devalues a property. In simple terms it reduces your pool of buyers. My only quibble with the comments above that this is a recent change. Its been like this forever.

    If the property and location is such that getting a tenant is difficult. Than thats to do with the property and location.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,680 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997



    If you can get a better return, (or less risk and hassle) then perhaps its time to move on.



  • Registered Users Posts: 451 ✭✭MBE220d


    I'll say it once more, up until 2 or 3 years ago a property with a tenant at auctions were selling for more than vacant ones around my area.

    The reason being a glut of section 23 properties that could not be either rented or be sold, so a lot of them were auctioned off, Any investor is not going to buy if they can't rent them so that's why it was more desirable with sitting tenants at the time.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,367 ✭✭✭JimmyVik


    Its seriously hard to get tenants out and paying rent is optional theses days. It hasnt been like that forever, but it is now.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,503 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    Must be a poor location as its a good six years since getting tenants was a problem



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,976 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    TBH most LL have no problems with getting there rent paid at present. The problem for most tenants now is if they do not pay the rent and get kicked out they will not find a place to rent again.

    Slava Ukrainii



  • Registered Users Posts: 451 ✭✭MBE220d


    The location was fine, it was the sheer amount of stuff for rent at the time, mostly section 23 property properties, when they were sold off after serving their purpose thing picked up, before that if you looked at Daft.ie at the time, there was a few hundred for rent at any time. now you have about 15 to 20.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,503 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx




  • Registered Users Posts: 451 ✭✭MBE220d




  • Registered Users Posts: 1,007 ✭✭✭rightmove


    One assumes most LLs will get their rent until err...they dont. My tenants never paid on time and stiffed me couple months in the end. My rent was about 40% below market. Saying that I was renting also and paying about 30% below market which was always paid on time. The current regulation have LL running to the hills as I did and tenants using the pro tenant atmosphere like a shield until eventually they have to find a new place. In my case I knew the LL would sell as I was seeing it from her perspective and as a LL myself.

    When I was kicked out I had to buy (whatever was available) as I could not find anywhere to rent



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,503 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    Bar the Athlone part , nowhere in Roscommon is a good location



  • Registered Users Posts: 451 ✭✭MBE220d


    Tells me all I need to know about what you know about Roscommon then.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,503 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx




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  • Registered Users Posts: 451 ✭✭MBE220d


    If you want a fact, the majority of Athlone is actually in Westmeath. so I think we will leave it at that.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,299 ✭✭✭Claw Hammer


    Most landlords. If you are one of the others not getting rent, it could be 100% of yor rent. It is no comfort that most other landlords are getting their rent.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,503 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    I knew that, Monksland is in Roscommon though, it's a decent location, only good one in the county from an investor POV



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,680 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997


    Bit harsh.

    But looking at the stats, (and I'm open to correction) I'd be asking does a place have some of the lowest rents nationally and high vacancies rates over many, many years, and will bit hit hardest in a recession. If it has high numbers ghost estates.


    There's value anywhere if you know what you are doing...

    But you should ask is it representative of the market in rest of the country. Especially if there's a recession.



    But, if I was starting out now, and in terms of somewhere to live, I would be looking at where can I have a good quality of life/style for the least cost.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,976 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    Even if investing now I would Ber looking at any place where property prices are below build costs. People will make choices to live where they can afford. A lot of Roscommon is commutable to Galway. As well Athlone is a large town. There is no amount of houses going to be build in places like these until house prices reach bud costs.

    Looked at prices on daft, if it was nearer to me I would not be afraid to invest. There is property there that will increase by 50% in the next 3-5 years.

    Heard through a friend about a builder where his plastering contractor increased his costs from 11k to 20k from one house to the next. There would be 9 weeks labour on the houses. That is a labour price only. It's a large town price not a city pric e. Houses prices are going from 250-290k.

    Slava Ukrainii



  • Registered Users Posts: 451 ✭✭MBE220d


    Roscommon is very much overlooked for some reason, the above property in Roscommon town for 80k would rent in the morning for 800/900 per month, is that not a good investment.


    Another good investment property or family home for 120k, less than half the price it would cost build now.

    If rented you would probably get 900pm, or a nice family home. While there is not a lot going on in Strokestown its only 15 min drive to Roscommon town which has everything nowadays, for the commuter Dublin is only 1.5 hours from say Palmerstown.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,976 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    The apartment you quoted has a yield of 12%, as U said the only way the price of that apartment is going is up. Will increase in value by 50+% in the next 2-3 year. The yield for the house might be slightly lower, in rural area 2 beds make nearly as much as 3 beds for renting. However that house will be worth 200+k in 5 years time. As well that house is an owner occupier sale.not an investor sale.

    Slava Ukrainii



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,680 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997



    Google suggests its 1.5 to 2 hrs at commuter times. That's a 3~4 hrs of driving. To get to Palmerston. Then plus wherever you actually work.

    I can't see thats a viable or desirable or life/work balance, or that its going to increase in desirability as you and Bass are suggesting.

    The stats are against you. But who knows what will happen post lockdown.



  • Registered Users Posts: 451 ✭✭MBE220d


    Depends on what you want in life, no stress with a small mortgage, the better quality of life for kids growing up, plus lots can work from home a few days a week now.

    And if you are a tradesperson you wont have to travel very far for work.

    I'm only pointing out the value that can be had, the same property is only going to go one way, in fact, if you never lived or rented it you would make a tidy profit in a few years time.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,503 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    Ive decided against buying anymore property direct, put a six figure sum in both IRES and Hibernia in February, collected dividends and nothing else.

    Don't know if I'm right as capital appreciation might well disapoint, maybe REITS are a waste of time but I've a 4.5% yield between both and that's as good as direct property in terms of income generation in my opinion



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,299 ✭✭✭Claw Hammer


    1.5 hours to Palmerstown and another 1.5 hours to Merrion Square. Strokestown is a remote place and fuel prices are rising. Post offices, banks and small shops are closing in smaller towns and villages.



  • Registered Users Posts: 451 ✭✭MBE220d


    Plenty of people can work from home now and not everyone needs to go to Dublin to work, it all depends on what one wants in life I suppose.

    Crippled with a big mortgage, stuck in traffic for hours, having to bring kids to school, And I'm saying this as someone that lived in cities for the best part of 30 years, I can see more upsides than downsides, but each to their own I suppose.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,299 ✭✭✭Claw Hammer


    For people who can work from home the time to get to Palmerstown is irrelevant. Living in a small village with no banks, clothes shops, convenience stores, local GP means everything is done by car. In cities there is public transport and all kinds of amenities are accessible locally.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,976 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    The public service will probably allow working from home virtually fulltime for lower paid clerical staff. A lot of companies are opting for hybrid with two days a week in the office.

    If you need to go into the office only two days a week a 2 hour commute is doable especially if the days are together and you have the option of overnight accommodation in Dublin from a relative or friend.

    Slava Ukrainii



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,976 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    If population returns to small villages the services will return. Even if not there are few villages that are more than 10 miles from a decent sized town. Even smaller towns now have a Lidl or Aldi along with maybe a Tesco , Dunnes or SuperValu. You will only be buying you milk or the odd item you run out off.

    Just glancing at Strokestown on Google maps, there is a SuperValu and Eurospar in the town, a Garda station( with limited opening I imagine) a Chinese and 2-3 businesses marked on it. Interestingly there was a golf club on the outskirts. There is primary and post primary education as well as a GAa and soccer clubs. There is a medical center.

    This is not the ar5rhole of nowhere, it a urban center admittedly on a smaller scale. I saw 1-2 comments about PO closing, they are now become banking hubs for AIB and BOFI so this will help there survival. I have noticed that as smaller Post Office's have closed the remaining ones are getting busier

    Slava Ukrainii



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,003 ✭✭✭handlemaster


    You will be waiting Along time for strokestown to be come any sort of town where people would choose to live



  • Registered Users Posts: 544 ✭✭✭agoodpunt


    Didnt stroketown stop a well known bank who has exited market now to reprocess a house about 4 years ago



  • Registered Users Posts: 451 ✭✭MBE220d


    No, the same people would rather moan and complain about the price of houses and not being able to get on the property ladder, blame vulture funds, blame the government, nothing new there.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,299 ✭✭✭Claw Hammer


    Some services will not be coming back to smaller villages. Banks are closing everywhere for good. Lidl and Aldi are not interested in smaller towns. The GP retires and another can't be found. What you don't see in Strokestown on Google Maps is a shoe shop, any kind of clothing shop and electrical retailer. The local bank of Ireland branch has just closed. Strokestown is just a dormitory village. People have to drive to other towns constantly.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,976 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    First off it has a medical center. There is a huge move to provide primary care centers in towns. Not only will you have a doctor you will have multiple doctors working from that primary care center.

    As you say banks are closing everywhere...that means everywhere. I seldom go into a bank now, the only issue is actually an ATM, however I can carry out some normal banking transactions at local PO, such as cash withdrawals, cash and cheque lodgements not just in towns like Strokestown but in most villages as well. I lay 10-1 there is a decent sized credit union in the town if not it's the only town in Ireland without one.

    Clothes and shoe shops you can buy both online. However how often do you go clothes shopping. You get away with it monthly. I live in a small village, however I pass through towns at least once a week and I am in Limerick city at least once a month. You are incorrect about Lidl and Aldi they are actually expanding into towns.

    Just to give an example in Limerick, Abbeyfeale has a Tesco and an Aldi, Newcastlewest has a Tesco, Aldi, Lidl and a SuperValu. There is none in Bruff and Kilmallock yet but I bet there will be in 2-5 years. However 5-6 Mrs from Killmallock is Rathluirc, it has a Dunnes, SuperValu, Lidi and Aldi. Like Newcastlewest and Abbeyfeale it has multiple shoe and clothes shops. That about 8-10 minutes away on a normal day The biggest issue Supermarket development now faces is planning and site availability as LA's are pushing more and more for development to be within these town centers.

    In other words your perception is completely false about the reality of lifestyle in Rural Ireland. If you pay in the area if 250k ( in these types of towns) for a dwelling house you can well afford a car. And in fact at present you will buy houses in these area's for sub 200 k

    Slava Ukrainii



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