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The Curse of Defective Concrete (Mica, Pyrrhotite, etc.) in Donegal homes - Read Mod warning Post 1

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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Who said anything about 70k?

    Suggesting market value is a ridiculous strategy, anyway. What do you think offerering market value would achieve?

    There aren't 5000 houses for sale in Donegal, people are already paying mortgages in many cases, and certainly aren't in a position to pay a second mortgage to meet the additional cost of repair that your "market value" suggestion would incur, hence your aggressive line of questioning is absolutely pointless....



  • Posts: 61 ✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I wonder how accurate the rebuild costs are as they seem to be using the SCSI rates but the actual rates would differ in reality if a 100% full rebuild scheme was implemented as rates will go up in times of high demand and there is currently a spike in material costs.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,191 ✭✭✭RandomViewer


    I think the materials issue will level out in the next few months, a lot of timber being felled, Covid ,Brexit and that stupid boat in the Suez canal sort of created the perfect storm



  • Registered Users Posts: 23,353 ✭✭✭✭mickdw


    I think 100 percent is too much of a free for all as it will put people in a better position than they were prior.

    I think they should set a figure at about 80 percent of current average sqm rate and apply that to sqm of current accommodation. Leave the homeowner then free to build smaller or larger or just buy somewhere else, handing over property to state where they opt to buy elsewhere.

    State could look at doing rural resettlement with some of these vacated sites.

    State could also put in place guaranteed mortgage to cover shortfall for remaining 20 percent for those who want to put back same size. This would be fair because the new build would be an improved version of the original in terms of fitout and energy demand.

    I don't know why the Minister has not brought in a planning exemption to cover much of these rebuilds. They are also taking about reusing stuff like windows. Under current building regs, that's not even possible.

    I also believe that basic bungalows could be repaired when built off raft foundations.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,583 ✭✭✭Penfailed


    The current scheme doesn't allow for betterment. You have to reuse as much as possible from the old dwelling including doors and windows. If you want to upgrade, you pay the difference. That seems fair to me.

    Gigs '24 - Ben Ottewell and Ian Ball (Gomez), The Jesus & Mary Chain, The Smashing Pumpkins/Weezer, Pearl Jam, Green Day, Stendhal Festival, Forest Fest, Electric Picnic, Ride, PJ Harvey, Pixies, Public Service Broadcasting, Therapy?, IDLES(x2)



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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    A lady I know in Buncrana, rebuilt the outer leaf of their house in 2015 when there was no word of any government support. Unfortunately the new outer leaf is now cracking and they are facing having to rebuild again.

    It will be only a matter of time when some of these houses start to collapse. This scandal could easily bring down the government.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,387 ✭✭✭MrMusician18


    The government won't collapse over a highly regionalised issue - more chance of it falling over the Zappone affair tbh.

    The ask is too big here for the State and the protesters have boxed themselves in over 100%. This was never a realistic ask and they've left themselves with no route to a compromise.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]




  • Registered Users Posts: 4,801 ✭✭✭jj880


    So it's come to light that complaints were made to Donegal County Council in 2009 and they allowed the quarry in question to continue producing mica infested AND low cement blocks up until August of last year.

    Do you stand by your stance that the government is in no way responsible?



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,387 ✭✭✭MrMusician18


    Yes. If there was a case to be taken, it would've happened by now. It's quite obvious that the reason no one has sued the state is because they wouldn't win.

    The State has not and never will be legally liable for the behaviour of third parties.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,801 ✭✭✭jj880


    There is a case coming to the high court soon primarily about regulation. They may bring in IS 465. Hopefully they do. We shall see.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,387 ✭✭✭MrMusician18


    IS 465 is a standard protocol for determination of mica contamination and damage. It isn't law.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,801 ✭✭✭jj880


    Deary me - this is what you take from my post?

    Well at least we will see if it is "quite obvious that the reason no one has sued the state is because they wouldn't win" soon enough.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,583 ✭✭✭Penfailed


    Hoping for a big turnout in Dublin on Friday. Hopefully there'll be more feet on the street than the last one...and that was an impressive crowd.

    Gigs '24 - Ben Ottewell and Ian Ball (Gomez), The Jesus & Mary Chain, The Smashing Pumpkins/Weezer, Pearl Jam, Green Day, Stendhal Festival, Forest Fest, Electric Picnic, Ride, PJ Harvey, Pixies, Public Service Broadcasting, Therapy?, IDLES(x2)



  • Registered Users Posts: 33,931 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    You think the government will collapse over this ? Genuinely interested in how .



  • Registered Users Posts: 33,931 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    This type of story needs details. How has a repaired outter leaf self destructed in 5 years? Did they use faulty materials again ? Was it poorly built? It sounds like something went wrong here but it's not clear what.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,583 ✭✭✭Penfailed


    I'd imagine they made the mistake of buying blocks from the faulty supplier. They were continuing to supply faulty blocks as recently as 2020.

    Gigs '24 - Ben Ottewell and Ian Ball (Gomez), The Jesus & Mary Chain, The Smashing Pumpkins/Weezer, Pearl Jam, Green Day, Stendhal Festival, Forest Fest, Electric Picnic, Ride, PJ Harvey, Pixies, Public Service Broadcasting, Therapy?, IDLES(x2)



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,742 ✭✭✭Wanderer2010


    I wonder is that company based in Donegal suffering because of all the Boycott and Close them Down signage literally all over Donegal? Its hard to see how they could weather the animosity against them in the face of such overwhelming bad feeling against them. Or they could have their money made and they dont care what people think..



  • Registered Users Posts: 33,931 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    Perhaps! But if I was rebuilding a house that suffered from Mica. Would I not be sure the blocks are sourced from elsewhere.

    So there's clarity required around this story as it sounds like it could be used / construed as an advocate for total destruction. But without a cause identified it's not a fair example.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,287 ✭✭✭givyjoe


    I heard someone quote that there's about a dozen TDs in the Dail from constituencies affected by this, the point was made how many of these would be willing to back the government over their own constituents, with the risk being they'll lose their seat if they do. Obviously a big if, but still.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 46,081 ✭✭✭✭muffler


    Post edited by muffler on


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Apologies, my mistake. I went back and double checked their Facebook status. I follow this person on Facebook.

    She had mentioned in her post, that they had to rebuild the outer leaf of their home with a credit union loan a few years back, and now new cracks were appearing and they would have to turn around and do the same process all over again. I googled her story and I hadn't realised she meant the inner leaf was now crumbling, the outer leaf is ok. So in effect the whole house should have come down.

    I wont post any names here, but her story is well documented, she appears in one of the mica documentaries on youtube.

    I can DM the news article if anyone wants.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Please note I did not state the Government would collapse, I asked for a source for a definitive statement that it would not collapse.

    There's a significant difference between the two.

    I also note that the person who stayed so confidently that the Government would not collapse has failed to provide any source for such a confident assertion.

    To my knowledge, no surveys have been carried out on the matter - yet...



  • Registered Users Posts: 33,589 ✭✭✭✭NIMAN


    What happened in some cases is that the supplier gave people free blocks to replace their outer leaf, to appease them.

    People probably rightly assumed the supplier wouldn't dare supply bad blocks again, considering the amount of bad press they were getting locally. Unfortunately it might appear that they were again supplying bad blocks and as a result these repairs won't last very long again.



  • Registered Users Posts: 33,589 ✭✭✭✭NIMAN


    Yes they are suffering pretty badly as far as I have heard.

    Their main quarry has been closed for maybe a couple of months now.

    However they also own a few more quarries under different names, which afaik are still operating. I have also heard reports that their vehicles have been spotted on the roads delivering.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,742 ✭✭✭Wanderer2010


    Im sure places like that will always have hardcore customers who will stick with them but the sheer breath of the posters and anti-company feeling throughout Donegal makes it impossible for their reputation not to destroyed. And it being a family business i cant imagine any of the family were ever unemployed or worked anywhere else so they will have to stand on their own two feet if they go bust.



  • Registered Users Posts: 33,589 ✭✭✭✭NIMAN


    I don't think they'll get much sympathy!

    Good riddance to them. But I think they will be around as a business simply due to the fact that they are the biggest quarry in the north West (open to correction on this).



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    To be honest, I'd find it very hard to have any sympathy for them.

    I'll reserve the sympathy for the poor people whose lives are a living nightmare because of those blocks.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Do you really think the business will survive?

    Personally, I don't think I'd accept anything they produced if I got it for free. I'd just find it really hard to trust any company whose reputation has been shredded to that extent.

    Maybe that's just me - but I'm very inclined to believe that a lot of people will only deal with businesses they trust...



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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,205 ✭✭✭cruizer101


    There is 15 TD's from Donegal, Sligo-Letirem and Mayo which I think more than covers the effected area.

    Of that I think just 7 are in government, only 2 from Donegal.

    Definite risk of losing seats but enough to topple government I doubt.



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