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Night of the Big Wind

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Comments

  • Posts: 3,801 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Nobody needs grandstanding. Listen to yourself bud.



  • Registered Users Posts: 408 ✭✭Orion402


    I am not here to impress anyone (hence no grandstanding) so that leaves the proper use of modelling to further planetary dynamics and traits by using planetary comparisons which begin with daily rotation, extend on to the seasons and from there to what determines planetary climate proper. Whether people find the issue enjoyable is another matter.


    An inclination such as Jupiter's would give the Earth benign atmospheric conditions across an orbit while the inclination of Uranus would see enormous swings in atmospheric conditions across latitudes with each circuit of the Sun. This spillover is into oceanic temperatures, which fluctuate North and South using the Equator as a baseline-



    Should the Earth have an inclination similar to Jupiter, a North/South fluctuation would be minimal and almost homogenous whereas an inclination similar to Uranus would see incredible swings with the temperature fluctuations moving from red to blue across hemispheres. The polar inputs are blue while the equatorial signatures are red indicating Earth's largely Equatorial climate with a less dominant polar input. In a polar climate like Uranus, the influences are polar so that while we would receive the same degree of solar radiation, the distribution of temperature fluctuations across latitudes would be entirely different.

    This is where modelling would be superb insofar as it is in judging observations using planetary dynamics to define climate within a spectrum depending on the relationship of daily rotation inclination to the orbital plane. Of course, it all relies on the annual motion of the North/South poles as a beacon for the entire surface of the planet which turns parallel to the orbital plane as a function of the Earth's orbital motion.

    The conditions for the Big Wind are similar to hurricane season as certain conditions come together to great those magnificent storms irrespective of the damage they do to society. In the productive perspectives, using these storms to promote future speculative conclusions falls by the wayside and opens up a productive area of research which restrict modelling to predicting short term weather events and leaves modelling to deal with planetary climate using planetary comparisons.

    Any obligations are simply presenting the material so whether people choose to move it forward or not is the limit of what I do. What I will say it is not for the talentless or the petty even if it is unfamiliar.



  • Registered Users Posts: 408 ✭✭Orion402


    " What it means in practical terms when the obliquity reaches a maximum (above 24 deg) what he calls the circle of illumination covers a slightly larger portion of the northern hemisphere in summer." MT

    This is the last time I would object to putting words in my mouth, an all too common occurrence among those who fall short of what is necessary to consider the ever expanding issues.

    In the past, I did use terms like the 'terminator' or 'circle of illumination' to satisfy contemporary uses of those terms, however, it is now more proper to use the light and dark hemispheres of the Earth to signify its constant orientation at right angles to the orbital plane. In the Northern summer, the Northern polar points turns midway to the dark hemisphere on the June Solstice-



    The maximum circumference where the Sun remains constantly in view (Arctic circle) is reached on the June Solstice and then diminishes afterwards as the North pole turns closer to the dark hemisphere until it crosses into the dark hemisphere on the September Equinox-



    I genuinely do not appeal to anyone in particular here and it isn't a concern beyond that observations are available to determine current conditions using physical considerations of planetary dynamics. You can use conditions to determine anomalous events like the Big Wind without referring the 1839 event to planetary dynamics, however, it is not possible to use individual weather events to define planetary climate.



  • Registered Users Posts: 408 ✭✭Orion402


    I am a Christian in the sense that it is as much that creation loves the individual as much as the individual loves creation and how it makes research into all topics possible. Some researchers understood this intimately so that any resonance of a particular topic with the reader, observer or listener lets us know what we put our values in-

    " When a natural discourse paints a passion or an effect, one feels within oneself the truth of what one reads, which was there before, although one did not know it. Hence, one is inclined to love him who makes us feel it, for he has not shown us his own riches, but ours. And thus this benefit renders him pleasing to us, besides that such community of intellect as we have with him necessarily inclines the heart to love. 

    Eloquence, which persuades by sweetness, not by authority; as a tyrant, not as a king.  

    Eloquence is an art of saying things in such a way—(1) that those to whom we speak may listen to them with-out pain and with pleasure; (2) that they feel themselves interested, so that self-love leads them more willingly to reflection upon it.   It consists, then, in a correspondence which we seek to establish between the head and the heart of those to whom we speak on the one hand, and, on the other, between the thoughts and the expressions which we employ. This assumes that we have studied well the heart of man so as to know all its powers, and then to find the just proportions of the discourse which we wish to adapt to them. We must put ourselves in the place of those who are to hear us, and make trial on our own heart of the turn which we give to our discourse in order to see whether one is made for the other, and whether we can assure ourselves that the hearer will be, as it were, forced to surrender. We ought to restrict ourselves, so far as possible, to the simple and natural, and not to magnify that which is little, or belittle that which is great. It is not enough that a thing be beautiful; it must be suitable to the subject, and there must be in it nothing of excess or defect. " Pascal


    [I have to add that self-love is the opposite of what is needed to move a topic forward while enjoying the insight itself so I diverge from Pascal at this juncture.]

    There are no concentric rings of influence to struggle with, a noisy mob protecting henchmen who are in turn protecting a smaller group of academics, who are in turn protecting a modelling subculture that doesn't know the limits of experimentation and predictions. In the end it comes down to talent, a mixture of competence and confidence to deal with all the challenges involved and for that alone I am a Christian-

    " And now, brother, listen to the conclusion. Above all the graces and all the gifts of the Holy Spirit which Christ grants to his friends, is the grace of overcoming oneself, and accepting willingly, out of love for Christ, all suffering, injury, discomfort and contempt; for in all other gifts of God we cannot glory, seeing they proceed not from ourselves but from God" St Francis of Assisi

    That being said, it comes down to historical and technical details when discussing material, including why the people on this island knew they were encountering a significant event on that January night in 1839.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,219 ✭✭✭Gaoth Laidir


    This forum has gone to the gods dogs



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,204 ✭✭✭✭o1s1n
    Master of the Universe




  • Registered Users Posts: 408 ✭✭Orion402


    You would be one of the noisy people who are least likely to take into account physical consideration and, along with the henchmen, circle the wagons around those you imagine having some special status in a public forum. It's so predictable and childish, but the price of doing business in this forum involves encountering those who have some interest in the topic under discussion like a few contributors even if others have their own subculture going.


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PyGsysGOf9s

    The 'perfect storm' of 1991 involved the merging of different systems and I imagine something similar happened with the 1839 event however that plays out in January this far North. Nobody was asked to discern long term conditions involved in future Atlantic storms yet should people venture into that area, then they are going to come up against the dynamics of the planet which create the background for the hurricane season, Atlantic storms, Arctic sea ice evolution on an annual basis or any large scale event of this nature.


    I suspect that more than a few people feel they are missing out on large parts of meteorology and planetary climate due to the confining nature of empirical doctrines which exclude the relationship between our home planet's motions and Earth sciences. The specific attempt to build up a narrative of climate using individual weather events or datasets is a distant second to observations which put cyclical variations in proper context, whether it is the 24 hour cycle, the seasonal cycle or the rate of change in surface conditions across latitudes (planetary climate).

    Much like anomalous storms, the ingredients which go into distinguishing weather from climate are diverse in range and depth so that while I may appreciate individual weather events like the Halloween storm of 1991 using satellite data, it is left to people to extrapolate the details of the 1839 event without having to appeal to the motions of the planet.

    Post edited by Orion402 on


  • Registered Users Posts: 408 ✭✭Orion402


    The emergence of 'bomb cyclones' may entertain those prone to hysterics, however, more measured and balanced people find anomalous weather events to be fascinating without sending them in the direction of 'climate change modelling' as is the custom nowadays-


    Living in Montauk, NY at the time, we knew it was a different type of storm 30 years ago in 1991 or the Halloween storm/ Perfect storm as it became known.


    Anomalous storms are part of the complex world of geographical climate where ingredients surface to create havoc in local areas while planetary climate is a more definite topic and, in some ways, much simpler to identify conditions. Whether ice ages or warm periods represent a crossover between geographical and planetary climates is difficult to assess without a clear explanation for the seasons.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,625 ✭✭✭Dazler97


    Yes this storm was thought to be a catagory 3 storm and a lot of people died



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