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The wondrous adventures of Sinn Fein (part 3) Mod Notes and Threadbanned List in OP

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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,760 ✭✭✭dudley72


    It's great to see the people really want a United Ireland

    This is what comes from the hate that the likes of SF are pushing



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,073 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    so 4 capital projects, 1 which is crazily over budget and costs are rising, 1 which was contributed in half if not more by the french, 1 should have been a much bigger scheme but they refused to fund it.

    woop de do.

    nothing compared to the amount of viable projects they refused to fund.

    we got plenty of capital projects done, they were motor ways granted, but we got them done.

    the tories have destroyed britain, they have and are continuing to dismantle the functions and systems of the country, they are a dangerous party.

    ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,189 ✭✭✭Brucie Bonus



    I can't change the opinion of someone who just follows a party PR line. Your comments on this are fresh from the pages of the Indo. It's pointless to try. You've a hate on for SF regardless.

    I gave you my opinion which you seem to dismiss as a FG rant for some reason. I mentioned Enda Kenny in my closing line. Anyway, keep on trucking.



  • Administrators Posts: 53,800 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    SF's talk of getting rid of LPT is not that baffling, it's just politics and giving their base what they want to hear. A significant portion of their vote base is inner city types living in houses that are worth an absolute fortune. These people are very wealthy on paper, but may not have massive incomes. You will also have those who purchased former social housing at a fraction of the true value who are also very well off on paper.

    I don't believe for a second the LPT will go anywhere in the end. They won't be able to afford to cut it with their proposed shopping list.



  • Registered Users Posts: 27,888 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Please provide me with links to the Indo discussions about:

    (1) Capital expenditure but no current expenditure for the Embassy in Palestine

    (2) J.P. McManus being given a €0.5m tax rebate through SF's abolition of LPT.

    Otherwise you are just spouting personalised rubbish again, and failing to engage with a substantive discussion on the lack of merit in Sinn Fein's budget proposals. It leaves me with an impression that you don't understand them.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,189 ✭✭✭Brucie Bonus


    We can think of wealthy people such as JP McManus.. 


    I claimed your use of JP was from the Indo.

    I'm of the opinion that you hate SF regardless of their policies. That's as personal as I got.

    I gave you my opinion that chasing the wealthy for more tax was more fair than going after people in expensive homes via LPT as some people would be in an expensive home over and above their income. You've ignored that.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,189 ✭✭✭Brucie Bonus


    I believe keeping the lights on is poor planning on the part of government re data farms.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,760 ✭✭✭dudley72




  • Registered Users Posts: 27,888 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Can't read that article, it is behind a paywall, and have never read it. I have long spoken of the failures of Sinn Fein's wealth tax ideas, certainly for more than a number of years.

    You also don't understand the concept of wealth versus the concept of income. Someone who earns €200k for the first time ever this year and is renting an apartment is not wealthy. Someone who owns a €500k house outright but only earns €40k is wealthy.

    You are not interested in chasing the wealthy for more tax, you are interested in chasing high earners for more tax. Use the concepts better.

    I am interested in chasing the wealthy for more tax, that is why I support the LPT. The least wealthy in this country are those who are homeless or who only rent rather than own their own house. The LPT therefore is a tax on wealth and anyone who claims to want to chase the wealthy for more tax, but opposes LPT is a hypocrite. If you think I hate SF because they are a shower of hypocrites on this as on so many other issues, so be it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,189 ✭✭✭Brucie Bonus


    You made this up:

    You are not interested in chasing the wealthy for more tax, you are interested in chasing high earners for more tax. Use the concepts better.

    You support a government that thrives on supporting wealthy investment funds while the working tax payer struggles.

    As we cancel PUP, they are announcing extending subsidised wages for businesses.

    We need a change and it looks like SF are it.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 27,888 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Get it right, the fake propaganda in your posts is tedious. As we cancel PUP they are extending subsidised wages for those people who continued to work.



  • Registered Users Posts: 27,888 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Now to address the tax bit once again.

    If SF increase the tax rate for those earning over 100k or 140k, not a single penny extra will be paid by J.P. McManus, Denis O'Brien (your favourite) or Michael Smurfit.

    If SF introduce a wealth tax, not a single penny extra will be paid by J.P. McManus, Denis O'Brien or Michael Smurfit.

    If SF abolish the LPT, all three will pay less tax.

    That is what you support, that is what you call for, own it. You are not interested in taxing the wealthy, you are interested in taxing those who work hard for a living. There is a huge difference.

    In my view, it is time to increase the LPT rates.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,760 ✭✭✭dudley72


    It is all buzz words. getting rid of the LPT will take money direct out of county councils, talk to any local town/village and they don't want a reduced tax they want more local amenities for themselves and their families. This is he exact opposite of what SF are going to do. So you will end up with county council having no money, play ground etc already created will turn to ruin again with no money to repair. Who's fault will it be then?

    As Blanch points out everyone has to pay LPT, it covers all people with houses. It proves again Pearse and the rest of SF haven't a clue, they are all talk and behind it all they will end up screwing every person in Ireland apart from the millionaires who will be laughing if they get rid of it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,189 ✭✭✭Brucie Bonus


    If you are a pensioner who got the family home off your parents and your neighbourhood is now trendy, you should be paying as much lpt as a person on a hundred grand or more a year? Doesn't seem fair.

    Also I don't like the idea of property value being set by the gouging friends of FF/FG in the property business.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,760 ✭✭✭dudley72


    FF/FG don't set the valuation. You do the valuation yourself.

    Local Property Tax (LPT) is a self-assessed tax based on your own valuation of your property. 


    The makey uppey story makes no sense. Also as a retired person you can apply for exemptions

    Post edited by dudley72 on


  • Registered Users Posts: 901 ✭✭✭usernamegoes


    If your income is low you can defer payments until after you die and they will be paid for out of the wealth that you leave behind.



  • Registered Users Posts: 218 ✭✭CDarby


    FF/FG don't set the valuation. You do the valuation yourself.

    Local Property Tax (LPT) is a self-assessed tax based on your own valuation of your property. 


    What is this nonsense? "You" as in a homeowner can't just "do" the valuation itself, you self declare alright, but if the home is worth a certain value, then that's what it's worth. Most people will know roughly what their home is valued at, and for one off builds, they are told to get their homes professionally valued.


    Intentionally and purposely undervaluing a home comes with a stark warning from revenue, you probably already know this, if you don't, you shouldn't really be commenting and giving out information on things you aren't "au fait" with in my opinion.



    Also as a retired person you can apply for exemptions

    An exemption from LPT because one is retired? This is interesting, and will have thousands of retiree's living across the country in a state of bewilderment, and joy I suspect at reading more of dudley72 taxation advice and musings..

    Can you provide a source for this useful nugget of information dudley72?

    Course you can't. Why post such complete and utter nonsense on a public forum can I ask?



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    As you say, most people know the value of their houses. The bands are pretty broad, so unless someone puts a value of under €200,000 for a house worth over €500,000, they’re ok. Anyone foolish enough to grossly undervalue their house will leave their heirs with an unexpected bill.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,760 ✭✭✭dudley72


    It's a self valuation and I already provided the link

    Sorry wrong word, it is a deferral rather than an exemption , Which you can apply for. https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/money_and_tax/tax/housing_taxes_and_reliefs/deferring_local_property_tax.html



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,760 ✭✭✭dudley72


    Exactly

    FF/FG as claimed have nothing to do with the valuation as claimed. If someone want to under value they are just building themselves up a nice big debt



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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,189 ✭✭✭Brucie Bonus


    The often false exaggerated values driven up by FF/FG friends in the biz set the pricing. If you live in a generational family home it could be worth 700,000 or more and you on minimum wage. For me taxing based on wealth or income is better. How ever much your house is worth you don't have that money in your pocket.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,760 ✭✭✭dudley72


    The valuation is a self valuation. Nothing is exaggerated by FF/FG. Read the links already provided.

    Why are you complaining about LPT when it is clear you have no idea what the tax is and how it works?



  • Administrators Posts: 53,800 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    Property tax IS a wealth tax, and a very effective one at that. Pretty much nobody can avoid it, there's no way to hide from it. You can't offshore a house. Something like 80% of Irish wealth is property assets, which will include people's homes. Property is a way of separating the haves from the have nots.

    SF's opposition to it is fairly incoherent as far as leftist politics go, but the reason is they instead want a tax on wealth that their vote base won't have to pay. Their alternative suggestion is nonsense, it's just lip service and they know it, so for all intents and purposes SF are a leftist party opposed to taxing wealth.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,189 ✭✭✭Brucie Bonus


    I don't agree with taxing a person's home. We should hammer tax on second or holiday homes.

    Are you suggesting FF/FG's base is wealthy? I think they'd disagree. Wealthy foreign investors don't vote.

    All parties think they serve a section of society and play to that base. Thats how political parties work.

    For me income is the way to go unless taxing property speculation heavily.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,189 ✭✭✭Brucie Bonus


    No good sir, tis you. You I say who's dumbing it down to suit your team.

    Property value is based on the market. You can't pull a figure out of your arse. The property market is artificial. Its currently inflated by FF/FG and their friends in the property biz driving up pricing.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,760 ✭✭✭dudley72


    This is what you posted

    Also I don't like the idea of property value being set by the gouging friends of FF/FG in the property business

    Nobody sets the value but the owner of the property. As per the link provided

    The market can be inflated, that makes no difference. If the person is sitting in a house and reckons it is worth 250k but the market says it is 500k they can pay the LPT for 250k. If they go to sell and get 500k then they have to top up the difference on all the property tax. But if they hold out and the market reduces and they sell at 250k then no issue.

    The warning you get is if you know the property is and always will be worth 500k and you low ball it, then you are just building up a huge debt that at some stage will have to be paid off.

    You clearly have no idea about LPT.



  • Registered Users Posts: 163 ✭✭BackOfMyBag


    how can anyone know there gaffe is and always will be worth anything

    i seem to remember ireland having a celtic tiger a while ago , were people were flipping gaffes without even looking at them , people buying and selling all over the show , but of course some poor sods were left holding the " parcels " when the music stopped , and got burnt with mortgages the gaffes weren't worth the half of !

    same thing applies for people livin in modest gaffes and next thing you know a luas line opens beside it and the value goes tru the roof , of a not so nice area becomes cool and trendy all of a sudden and your gaff increases by huge amounts !

    no one knows the true value of there property from one year to the next never mind try and claim it is and always will be worth something , dudley better not have notions of getting into property , for the own sake 😂



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,760 ✭✭✭dudley72


    Tracking property value is fairly easy and you will find most people know the real value and inflated value for their house.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,324 ✭✭✭Shebean


    Based on what? The market. Who sets the market, normally the customer. Not so with the Irish housing market. They set a price and if the public can't afford it the coalition of attrition lease it for 25 years with no option to buy or rent it or supply the funds to the buyer. It can't last. We can't function by taking from Peter to pay paul.

    Any party not doing that might get my vote. Happens SF are the best hope we have currently.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,760 ✭✭✭dudley72


    Well that made zero sense. Anyone I know that owns a house can tell me the value now v the actual value when the market levels out. It’s normal the most expensive thing you own so you do the research.



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