Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Hi there,
There is an issue with role permissions that is being worked on at the moment.
If you are having trouble with access or permissions on regional forums please post here to get access: https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058365403/you-do-not-have-permission-for-that#latest

General Emulation Discussion

1141517192023

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,765 ✭✭✭Inviere


    Aye that'd annoy me too. I know there's a way to get it in retail mode, but not sure how safe it is.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 52,003 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    Logged on to steam to see that retroarch is now on there. Did not expect that.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,765 ✭✭✭Inviere


    Honestly I don't get the whole point. Sure it'll auto update, but you've to manually manage your cores so it's swings and roundabouts. Cloud saves I suppose is the big thing people are buying into, but ultimately you're using a frontend to launch a frontend to launch a core to launch a game.....

    Standalone RA remains the way to go imo.

    Post edited by Inviere on


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 52,003 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    I think it's a steam deck thing but not having auto updates is ridiculous but understandable.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 52,003 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    Messing around with Dreamcast emulation at the weekend. Can't get flycast to run in retroarch. It defaults to OpenGL which carshes on RDNA2 architecture so I can't get into the core to change it.

    Got it to boot with a standalone emulator.

    Visually it's really nice, the Dreamcast had hardware close ot PC but did have it's own renderer's and API but they are actually quite modern so translate well to PC API.

    Direct X looks awful but Vulkan looks great. Again I can't try Open GL. Had one graphical glitch with polygons going insane in Maken X but it was a once off and it hasn't happened again.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,765 ✭✭✭Inviere


    @Retr0gamer run the flycast core, change the backend to vulcan, and save a core override. Exit Retroarch gracefully, and try again then to run the core/game



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 52,003 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    I'll give it a try but at least I have an option outside of retroarch.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 52,003 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    Emulation horror stories #139:

    Wanted to play some horror games this october and thought it would be a good chance to play through Enemy Zero on saturn.

    It works perfect but.... mednafen and any emulators built off it have an issue with disc swapping games. If you eject the disc it kicks you back to the bios menu.

    Now this is fine if you can save at the disc swap like FF7 or Panzer Dragoon Saga. Not so much when you can't save at the disc swap.

    Looks like there's no work around until they fix it.

    I'm going to try the PC version of the game but very much doubt I'll have much luck with a 1998 game on windows 10.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,765 ✭✭✭Inviere


    Sounds like a few things wrong here:

    1) Best practice with multi disc games is to ALWAYS create and use *.m3u files to manage disc swapping. Very very easy, very simple to do.

    Eg:

    virtua cop (disc 1).bin

    virtua cop (disc 2).bin

    virtua cop (disc 3).bin

    virtua cop.m3u

    Inside the m3u file (which is just a text file with its extension renamed), are the full names of each disc, all on separate lines.

    You then load the m3u file in Retroarch instead of any disc, and the first disc will be loaded. To change disc, enter the Retroarch menu, go to disc swapping, eject the current disc, append the next disc, close the virtual disc tray, and continue on your merry way. The m3u file tells Retroarch exactly what discs are available and where to find them.

    Even better is to convert those bin/cue files into chd files, and just replace the extensions in the m3u file from bin to chd. Not necessary but saves space, and much cleaner to manage files this way. It's archival quality compression, non lossy.

    2) depending on what name you give your m3u file, you'll have to rename your save file to match it. This only happens because you've got a save file existing before the m3u was created, normally the save file would be created with a matching name and this wouldn't be an issue.

    3) I've read you might need to change the default browsing location for Retroarch, to anything but it's default. This is something I've done anyway, to the root of where my games are stored....if anything it just saved scrolling through directory after directory just to find games. Not sure if this step is needed if you follow the above, but it's worth doing anyway.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/RetroArch/comments/eeuapv/how_to_switch_cds_on_sega_saturn_beetle_core/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share



  • Advertisement
  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 52,003 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    Yep I've tried all that.

    It works perfect for ps1 emulation.

    The issue is with mednafen which beetle is based on. If you hit eject it will boot to the bios menu which I think the Saturn would do but some multi disk games over wrote this at the disc swap screen.

    It's fine for games that let you save at the disk change but some like enemy zero don't so the game boots you to the menu and when you start with the new disk the save is still for disc 1.

    No way around it until its fixed.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,765 ✭✭✭Inviere


    @Retr0gamer I'll take a look on my end and see. I've read standalone mednafen doesn't give this issue, so maybe there's a bug in the libretro saturn core?



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 52,003 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    I gave standalone mednafen a go as well and it dumps you to the bios.

    I've got the PC version working and it doesn't seem to be an issue with any other games. The issue with Enemy Zero is there's no save at the disc swap. In most games there is a save so being booted to the bios just means you load the new disc from there no issues. Enemy Zero doesn't have those disc change saves because the game as a feature actually limits the amount of times you can save so probably didn't want to force it on players.

    There's very few multi disc saturn games really and any I've read allow disc changes.

    At least disc changes work on PS1. I know from personal experience Koudelka is the same. I tried playing a pirated copy and there was no disc change save but when you changed the disc it would do a piracy test which ended my game at disc 1! I had to..... buy a legit copy of the game 😱

    That shouldn't be an issue with PS1 emulation now. But I'd also recommend not to play Koudelka because it's not good!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,765 ✭✭✭Inviere


    @Retr0gamer how far is it between the save point and the disc swap prompt?



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 52,003 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    Easiest and quickest way to check is to boot up disc 0 which is just a cinematic disc with a training mode. You can skip the opening cinematic and when you select start it will go to the disc prompt.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,765 ✭✭✭Inviere


    @Retr0gamer nevermind, I've been able to reproduce it with that game. If you boot from Disc 0, and choose to start the game, it'll ask for Disc 1. Upon swapping it, I can see the system resetting to the bios. I'm able to just start disc 1 then, but any progress presumably won't follow over due to the reset. It happens in Beetle Saturn, Yabause, and Kronos. To be fair, what they're doing is what actual hardware would do upon opening of a disc tray lid....this game in particular must be using some type of voodoo to halt the Saturn and not cause that reset somehow. Still, shame.



  • Advertisement
  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 52,003 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    Yeah disc swap games can override that behaviour but it's just not implemented yet. Still I think enemy zero is the only game affected but the PC version works really well so there's that at least.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,765 ✭✭✭Inviere




  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 52,003 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    I'm near the end. It's more interesting than good. It's kind of a mix of D and a horror fps.

    The adventure sections are decent but a bit slow but it's a game that relies on the player activating triggers to progress and it can be frustrating when you are stuck.

    The fps parts are a lot better. Basically you have a gun with maybe 2 or 3 shots and are being hunted by invisible enemies. You can only tell their position from the sounds from a proximity locator you have. Also the gun isn't effective unless you are at point blank range. It's genuinely tense and terrifying. Also you can save and load your game only a set number of times but I found even on normal mode you have plenty saves.

    The story is really dated. It's kind of trying to be cinematic but it's badly written and just rips off the aliens games. The cgi is really good, probably the best at the time until ff7 came out a month later.

    The soundtrack is gorgeous. Kenji Eno managed to get Michael nymen to do the soundtrack by locking him in is own hotel room and not letting him leave until he agreed to do it. It's a pity the soundtrack isnt attached to a better game.

    Anyway it's interesting enough to give it a try and have a walkthrough handy for when you get stuck. It's short enough.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,765 ✭✭✭Inviere


    Someone from GBATemp discovered that the recent "Cotton Guardian Force Saturn Tribute" release on the Switch, isn't using some custom/tailored Saturn emulator that only applies to these games...but instead seems to be a VERY functional global Saturn emulator.....complete now with 4MB Expansion support. You seemingly need to just inject your Saturn game into the emulator and boom, fantastic Saturn emulation on Switch (Switch running cfw of course.)

    HOWEVER - input lag seems to be an issue, with some users reporting a whopping 11 frames of lag. Seemingly (according to one of the Mame dev's on that Reddit thread, Saturn games on real hardware do exhibit some input lag natively....but 11 seems excessive.) Maybe it can be improved upon? The Switch hardware is seriously outdated, which isn't helping the case here, so whatever they've achieved is impressive regardless.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,765 ✭✭✭Inviere


    Some nice info on souping up Gran Turismo 2 to look pretty shiny and smooooooth




  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,765 ✭✭✭Inviere


    Showcase of where things are at currently with OG Xbox emulation - an even at that, it's missing some info like the newer multiplayer features etc



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 52,003 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    Just a follow up on this, it's been found that the saturn emulator for these games is just SSF. This also explains the excessive input lag as it's a big issue with at that emulator.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,765 ✭✭✭Inviere




  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 52,003 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    Well the author pulled a branch from github recently, the first time in ages so they were probably working with him. They say they are trying to fix the lag issue but since it seems to be inherent to SSF it might not happen. I think SSF is the only decent fast saturn emulator with open source so maybe why mednafen was a no go.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,765 ✭✭✭Inviere


    Would the open source license there not prohibit packaging the compiled emulator as a retail product?



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 52,003 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    Yep but as I said it looked like they were working with the SSF author for this one so it would have been above board.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,726 ✭✭✭The Last Bandit


    Really depends on which open source license was originally used - there are loads of different types. Some are very restrictive and prohibit commercial use and others are have no restrictions at all.

    For example Sony has being using FreeBSD in its consoles for years as the licensing doesn't require them to publish their code, whereas with Linux they may need to make their source code available.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,765 ✭✭✭Inviere


    Had some spare time this morning so went and had a look at my PS1 and N64 Retroarch setups. They had dated in so far as I just had the internal resolution cranked on them, and that was it. This means no shaders, because shaders are designed for native resolution only, and increasing that messes with the shader.

    So switched both cores to Vulkan, left the resolutions turned up a few notches, turn on pgxp for PS1, and configured them for supersampling....thats the real magic. This renders the output back down to native, while retaining the additional detail revealed by the higher resolutions. Then because I'm back at native resolution, I turned on a shader, and tested.....good lord they look class. Way more authentic than just resolutions cranked, but so much improved over native output too....best of both worlds situation.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 52,003 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    I just play N64 and PS1 at native with a good shader. It looks phenomenal. The 'pixel art' look that lots of indie games use just looks awful now in comparison.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 52,003 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    Preaching to the choir but here's another good example I saw on twitter:




  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,765 ✭✭✭Inviere


    I know it's subjective, but how people prefer raw pixel output on lcd's over actual crts, or crt shaders is beyond me. I find it so damn harsh to look at.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,765 ✭✭✭Inviere


    If that bottom pic is a shader and not a crt, it has to be crt-royale is it? A stunning shader, but one that unfortunately is built for 1440p+ displays, and gets a bit mushed at 1080p.

    All said though, that's a good comparison. Look at the raw dithered shadows in the top pic, and the smoothness then in the shader applied pic.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 52,003 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    I'm amazed at how bad the scanline and crt effects are in commercial games. I mean there must be open source shaders they can use or just pay a pittance for a good home brew one.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,765 ✭✭✭Inviere


    Those arm devices just get choked trying to run a multipass shaders. Crt-royale has something like 10+ passes on every frame, it takes a decent bit of power to run.

    But yeah, like everything with emulation, the shittest/cheapest solutions are the ones that are most prevalent.

    EDIT - oh you mean commercial releases, sorry thought you were talking about the likes of the Snes Mini etc. Yeah the commercial game thing is odd, maybe they're using lightweight scan lines to ensure the experience is the same regardless of hardware?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,894 ✭✭✭Steve X2


    I always think the shader defaults go a bit too on the blurry side. I usually prefer close to the PVM/BVM look, but with a little less blur.

    The below are 4k screenshots from retroarch(12 passes), so probably don't look that great when posted here. But in person and when moving they look great on a 4k screen. If I stick to defaults its way to blurry and I find my eyes trying to focus on the unfocusable 🙂


    Crop:


    Super crop:




  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 52,003 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer




  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 52,003 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    Yep I mean commercial retro compilation releases. They usually have a disgusting composite filter or else bare minimum scanlines that look awful and just darken the image. Even M2 get it wrong a lot of the time.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,894 ✭✭✭Steve X2


    If you want the code feel free to grab it below. Will probably need a bit of tweaking for your display, but should look decent on 4k as is.

    https://www.codepile.net/pile/NydoPjVb



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,765 ✭✭✭Inviere


    @Steve X2 damn, that needs to be NSFW man....



  • Advertisement
  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 34,645 CMod ✭✭✭✭CiDeRmAn


    Steady on everyone, keep the cacks on and your wits about ye!



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 52,003 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    *zips up fly just before making love to a PVM*



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,093 ✭✭✭Doge


    Any links to the source of the candid photography, I mean the shader presets? 😁



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,093 ✭✭✭Doge




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,894 ✭✭✭Steve X2


    It's been a while since I looked into the Retroarch cores. Is there a general consensus on what the best cores are for the main systems? As in PC Engine, Megadrive, SNES, NES, PS1, Saturn etc.

    I've got redream setup for the Dreamcast as i paid for the license a year or two ago. It runs great but I understand there's some compatibility issues with a lot of the DC library.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 52,003 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    BSNES for SNES

    MESEN for NES

    The Beetle cores for PS1 and Saturn

    Beetle for PC as well I think

    I had trouble with Dreamcast but it was an issue with RDNA2 and the renderer. Flycast I think is supposedly the best and I've been using it standalone until I get around to fixing the compatibility issues.

    I'm not sure about megadrive. I think it's Genesis Plus GX



  • Advertisement
  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 34,645 CMod ✭✭✭✭CiDeRmAn


    The Pi Hut have a emulation ready and complete for only €75, including a decent case, official PSU and two SNES controllers.

    Not too bad, especially compared to the utter nonsense prices on Adverts




  • Moderators, Arts Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 10,793 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hellrazer


    Anyone using a Wii U for emulation?

    Have a chance at one really cheap (nearly free) and was thinking of modding it - videos on youtube look impressive.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 52,003 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    I say if you are only using it for emulation then a raspberry pi solution will be cheaper and easier to use. I don't imagine the WiiU emulators are anything better than the less accurate high level ones you'd run on a Pi.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,765 ✭✭✭Inviere


    PC Engine - Beetle - beetle_pce

    Megadrive - Blastem is cycle accurate, but Genesis Plus GX is probably the most common. You won't notice the difference outside of some obscure tech demos.

    Snes - Bsnes is cycle accurate, but again, Snes9x is not noticeably any different. Bsnes however has the newish HD Mode 7 feature, which is pretty damn cool for the handful of games it can apply it to. From memory, Bsnes doesn't place nice with shaders but that could be ancient history. Snes9x also runs MSU1 content very very easily these days. Check out the true widescreen patches for SMW and Super Metroid, amazing stuff.

    NES - Nestopia, Mesen, etc....most of them are all trading blows nowadays. The Mesen HD Packs are an interesting thing to explore too, like the HD-Mode7 stuff.

    PS1 - I use Beetle HW for this. I'll post my settings shortly for a quick gander if anyone fancies it. Internal resolution boost, pxgp, super sampled back down to native, and a shader applied....absolutely beautiful looking.

    Saturn - Beetle Saturn, based on mednafen (leads the pack re Saturn emulation.)

    Dreamcast - Flycast (though I paid for the ReDream license also, Flycast has passed it now imo.) No issues this end with an Nvidia GPU. It also runs Naomi stuff too.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,765 ✭✭✭Inviere


    RetroArch - Beetle PSX HW Settings:

    Video Options:

    Internal GPU Resolution x8

    Dithering Patten - Internal Resolution

    Texture UV Offset - ON

    Texture Filtering - SABR

    Adaptive Smoothing - ON

    SuperSampling - ON

    Multi Sampled Anti Aliasing - 2X

    MDEC YUV Chroma Filter - ON

    Software Framebuffer - ON


    PGXP Settings:

    PGXP Operation Mode - Memory Only

    PGXP Perspective Correct Texturing - ON


    Video output - Vulkan

    Set all of the above, set your shader of choice & save it, save a core options content directory file, save a config over-ride, enjoy, and don't have to touch again!



  • Advertisement
Advertisement