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Relaxation of Restrictions, Part XII *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

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  • Registered Users Posts: 26,977 ✭✭✭✭Dempo1


    Just in relation to Vaccine waning, Professor Kingston Mills spoke about this, he also had some interesting comments about the situation in the UK

    I've just grabbed the 24 minute segment he was on.


    Is maith an scáthán súil charad.




  • Registered Users Posts: 15,508 ✭✭✭✭Beechwoodspark


    Regardless of his comments I very much doubt he would have the power to veto antigen testing



  • Registered Users Posts: 16,615 ✭✭✭✭astrofool


    What are you accusing Chris_5339762 of? His post was quite factual and based on real world data.



  • Registered Users Posts: 26,977 ✭✭✭✭Dempo1


    Agreed , this is being Driven by the CMO and HSE stalwarts, Government seem to think they have a part to play and that's about as far as it's gone 😏

    Is maith an scáthán súil charad.




  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    So is bank manager statement.

    And I love how he use term “naturally” fading. If something is “natural” it must be good, no ?



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  • Registered Users Posts: 16,615 ✭✭✭✭astrofool


    Point out the factual errors rather than hurling from the ditch.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Everyone understands that antibodies fading = vaccine fading.

    Only you, Chris, O’Brien from 1984 and other members of brotherhood can convince themselves that it is not so.



  • Registered Users Posts: 16,615 ✭✭✭✭astrofool


    That was literally addressed in the first post you responded to, but it's clear you're unable to address it factually.



  • Registered Users Posts: 544 ✭✭✭agoodpunt


    not opening the summer meant restrictions to carry through winter HSE busest season bar and entertainment all over UK and europe open, know a group organising xmas parties in UK venues in dec.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Hahaha, so funny, so clever, so original. I really wish I knew you, such an amazing person



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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    So you don't know why it isn't part of the national strategy either. Thanks.


    Seems dumb that it isn't doesn't it?


    I mean, NPHET said they were snake oil. Was NPHET correct to say that?



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I take it back. The cluelessness is laid bare for all to see



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    No. But to suggest one state agency is deliver ripping off another for personal gain is ridiculous



  • Registered Users Posts: 38,294 ✭✭✭✭PTH2009


    3Arena may be Cert only for entry

    Id take that if it meant it can open fully and have events



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,760 ✭✭✭Deeper Blue


    I'm afraid the "looking foolish" ship sailed for Nolan a long time ago due to his useless models



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,335 ✭✭✭landofthetree


    Good luck with that. No way Nphet will allow us all to be flying around Europe from Nov to March for fun.



  • Registered Users Posts: 933 ✭✭✭darconio


    Not sure it counts because you seem to only to see vaccination = life / no vaccination = death, but looks like the effect is waning alright.

    https://www.hpsc.ie/a-z/respiratory/coronavirus/novelcoronavirus/surveillance/vaccinationstatusweeklyreports/Death%20and%20Vaccination%20Report.pdf

    Between April 1st and October 9th 2021

    • 369 persons with a laboratory confirmed COVID-19 infection, were notified to the Health Protection Surveillance Centre (HPSC) as having died due to COVID-19.

    • 169/369 (45.8%) deaths were notified in persons who were not vaccinated or not registered as vaccinated on Ireland’s national COVID-19 immunisation system (COVAX).

    • 200/369 (54.2%) deaths were notified in persons who had received at least one dose of COVID-19 vaccine prior to death.

    • 155/369 (42.0%) of the notified deaths had an epidemiological date1 14 days or more after receiving all recommended doses of vaccine and are considered as vaccine breakthrough infections


    Also between the 11th of September and the 9th of October

    118 Deaths, 20 unvaccinated, 98 received at least 1 dose, 94 were fully vaccinated: that's nearly 80% of death being double jabbed

    Of course you can dismiss the above with your usual "it's just whataboutery" or "you are living in some kind of 1984 fever dream": don't worry man it's the unvaccinated, the vaccine is the cure of all evil, ah but if you compare the number of death against the vaccinated it's an irrelevant number and so on



  • Registered Users Posts: 900 ✭✭✭Get Real


    This profit in 2020 was due to the fact they didn't spend money acquiring rights for Euro 2020,Tokyo Olympics etc. Global events.

    Our little country, is a rural parish in world terms. I don't think RTÉ has the tentacles and global dominance to be influencing lock downs across the globe in fairness.

    They can't influence what Europe and the world do. They'd still have to have paid for Euro 2020 and Tokyo etc if they went ahead that year.

    But those things didn't go ahead, because other governments were doing the same.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Yeah, maybe, maybe not. That kind of thing happens all over the world. Ireland is not immune (LOL).


    But anyway that's a side show. The question is, why are we not availing of antigen testing. It's clearly a hugely effective tool in fighting the pandemic. Our lads said it was snake oil, and that's been the end of it over here.

    Given the absence of any reasonable explanation for this decision, and the ongoing failure to reconsider their position would you not think this calls into question their competence? A huge call like this, badly mistaken, and they won't revisit the issue.

    All a bit unsatisfactory isn't it?



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,651 ✭✭✭US2


    It's because irish people are stupid and might stick it in a tub of butter instead of their nose. Do you remember that demonstration



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  • Registered Users Posts: 16,615 ✭✭✭✭astrofool


    What has that got to do with Chris's post?

    if anything, you've just posted lots of proof that those vaccinated (90% of adults) are much less likely to have severe disease or die. Anytime your number is less than 90%, that's an indication that vaccines are working and every number you posted is less than 90% (way less mostly, more impressive given that vaccinated trend towards older and underlying condition groups).

    You do understand that, don't you?



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    This perfect Astro. We will continue ;-)

    So you say (and assuming all of pro-vaccine community) that vaccine is not fading. So vaccine can never fade no matter what. Even after person is dead (not from Covid, that would be impossible) vaccine is still alive and doing its job. Correct ?



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]




  • Registered Users Posts: 8,029 ✭✭✭SusieBlue


    It’s both infuriating and yet unsurprising that the government would do this. It’s just another carrot on a stick.

    It’s one thing to hear and read about how things are in other countries, but it’s another thing entirely to actually experience it. I have taken two trips to the UK in recent weeks and I have been restless since I came home.

    No masks, no vaccine certs. You can dance. You can speak to people. You can go to another bar if you feel like a change of scenery instead of being forced to stay put at your table of 6 because you don’t have a booking for anywhere else.

    No rummaging in your bag/pocket to whip out a crumpled piece of cloth to cover your face with before going into a shop. No trying to decide if you’d like to go for a coffee two weeks in advance so you can make a booking in time.

    Its honestly like another world. No one even talks about covid over there. It’s spontaneous and fun and it felt like I was living my pre-covid life again.

    Completely different to the sterile, forced experience here of remaining seated and getting roared at by a bouncer for daring to say hello to someone you know at another table on the way to the bathroom.

    From my own perspective, I have lost the last few years of my 20’s to these lockdowns and restrictions and I am not prepared to do that any longer.

    I did what was asked of me, although I was hyper critical of the government response from day 1 I followed the rules and got my vaccine at the earliest opportunity possible.

    I have held up my end of the bargain and then some.

    If the health service is in such a dire state of affairs that it still cannot cope with a surge in numbers, despite having had 18+ months notice to plan and prepare for this, then that is the fault of the government. It is absolutely outrageous that they could expect to restrict the general public as a solution to this. We are among the most vaccinated countries in the world yet it STILL isn’t enough to open up fully?

    Why is no one in the media questioning that? Why are the public pointing fingers at each other when the fault, responsibility and blame for this lies with the historic mismanagement of the HSE?

    I love this country but there is nothing here for me any more. The housing situation for someone my age is hopeless and those in charge couldn’t give two hoots about the well-being of the young and healthy adults they have confined to a life of social restriction and isolation for the last year and a half. What they are doing is mental torture at this point.

    They are expecting sacrifice after sacrifice from those of us who are at little to no risk from this virus, and they are giving nothing in return except more of the same.

    I am currently applying for jobs in the UK and as soon as I get one, I am out of here. There is nothing for me here. The government response has been an absolute shambles to date and I have zero faith that there will be any improvement in the future. My only regret is not looking into moving abroad sooner.

    It would be easier to swallow if I could believe this was being done out of genuine concern but as usual with our politicians, this has been nothing but an arse covering exercise since day one and it’s our children and grandchildren who will pay the price for this appalling and cowardly leadership.



  • Registered Users Posts: 16,615 ✭✭✭✭astrofool


    Here is Chris's post, begin your takedown, remember to address all points with scientific data:

    Again

    Vaccines are not WANING. They are still just as effective at preventing hospitalisation and death than before.

    Antibodies are naturally fading, but TCell / Memory cells are robust.

    If antibodies are present, then any deltas coming in will be immediately attacked

    If antibodies have faded, it takes a few hours/days for TCells to churn out the antibodies it knows will defeat any Deltas. So you get symptoms for a few days while the body catches up - because Delta is so virulent and replicates so quickly.

    (If you are unvaccinated, it takes the body weeks to catch up)

    A booster dose will get the antibodies to high levels again.

    Thats it in a nutshell. The vaccines aren't waning. The GOOD news about this is that evolutionary pressure for new variants, I believe, is reduced.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Won’t happen, it involves engaging with reality



  • Registered Users Posts: 16,615 ✭✭✭✭astrofool


    So you've conceded all points and are trying to let a meme talk for you.

    I for one am truly shocked at this turn of events.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,886 ✭✭✭Chris_5339762



    Well the dog is right.

    The fact that the entire house is on fire is meaningless to this.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,537 ✭✭✭brickster69


    What the poster has done is shown people that in the last month 80% of deaths in the last month in Ireland were people who were fully vaxed. If the poster never pointed this out 99% of the viewers would not of had a clue, it is quite important to know.

    Now if you read the below, how many people would understand that from the document HSE released. Just look at how it is worded, how is the average person in Ireland supposed to understand that in the last months 80% of people who died were fully vaccinated.


    “The earth is littered with the ruins of empires that believed they were eternal.”

    - Camille Paglia



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