Field Security

redroisin · 15-08-2021 5:23am #1

Hi, I've had problems with people climbing over the gate to the land I rent for my horses and leaving fishing wire, empty wine bottles on the rocks by the river... breaking down fences to get in, using the entrance as a public toilet and a rubbish dump... even vandalising my field shelter. I have a sign on the gates to say no entry but that gets ignored, so I recently wrapped barbed wire on the top bar of the gates as a deterrent but have been told if someone cuts the self climbing over they can sue... is this true?? 😩

24-10-2021 10:35pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118068943#Comment_118068943

As far as I know yes. as someone said above if someone hurts themselves on the barbed wire they may be able to sue, I do not know for sure. Some people put occupier's liability warning signs warning people they are on private land etc. To my knowledge they do not stop you being sued . see https://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/1995/act/10/section/5/enacted/en/html This is not legal advice. i may be wrong.

Furze99 · 28-10-2021 9:27am

Occupiers Liability Act would apply. Which essentially means you or land owner don't have a duty of care to uninvited 'recreational' visitors to the land. If someone trips near the river and hurts themselves or has some other accident, that's on them. But be careful, if you deliberately endanger uninvited 'recreational' visitors, then you may have a case to answer. In other words you can't recklessly endanger the public. e.g. building a pit trap would obviously be a no-no. Barbed wire over a gate?? That'd be for a court probably.

seamus · 28-10-2021 12:45pm

The main risk of being sued comes from leaving a booby trap for someone to injure themselves on if they trespass or attempt to trespass. For example, wire across a trail used by bikers, or broken glass on the top of a high wall.

Barbed wire is more of a grey area since its primary purpose is to visibly deter animals (and people) from crossing it, rather than to cause any serious injury. Nevertheless, one can always be sued for injury.

Also consider that if someone is willing to break fences to get onto the land, they won't think twice about just snipping and removing the barbed wire.

One suggestion I didn't see is a sign saying "CCTV in operation". A cheap and simple thing that may make the trespassers think twice about it.

If that doesn't work, then invest in a trail cam. This is a battery powered-camera that activates and records when it detects movement. You can get ones that will alert you when activated. Hide the camera near the usual spots that are being used, and then you'll have video evidence to go to the Gardai with. It's private land, which means you have no obligation to inform trespassers that they are being recorded or to make the camera obvious.

GoogleBot · 18-10-2021 11:56am

Nothing will stop people for having good time 😀

Looks like your place is hotspot. Use that to your own advantage and build campsite ?

redroisin · 20-10-2021 8:52am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118035889#Comment_118035889

I rent the land, it doesn't belong to me, but the horses do.

GoogleBot · 20-10-2021 8:59am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118046513#Comment_118046513

Talk to the land owner obviously happens before you rent.

redroisin · 21-10-2021 10:52pm

Not helpful at all as I already stated I rent, have done for years. People going onto the land have put my animals at risk

Jim_Hodge · 22-10-2021 8:38pm

Is there a right of access to the river for fishing? There usually is where clubs have the fishing rights

redroisin · 24-10-2021 5:39pm

No, there's a fish farm further up the river but many don't like paying, my field is private as it that part of the river.

ZX7R · 24-10-2021 5:59pm

If a person injures themselves with the barbed wire you will be liable.

Does the land owner own the land both sides of the river.

redroisin · 24-10-2021 6:29pm

No, but the land is also privately owned. Me or the land owners?

24-10-2021 8:44pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118068214#Comment_118068214

you, occupiers liability, as far as i know

redroisin · 24-10-2021 9:23pm

Thanks. The whole field is fenced in barbed wire by the owner, so does that still apply?

spaceHopper · 28-10-2021 9:02am

Not sure if would be safe around horses but how about this

https://www.screwfix.ie/p/blackfriar-anti-climb-paint-black-1ltr/5810p#product_additional_details_container

redroisin · 28-10-2021 10:27am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118084079#Comment_118084079

What if there was a notice of non liability on the gate as well? Also, can I ask, as the renter, if someone was there with me, say for a picnic, and they had an accident, would that come back on the owners?

redroisin · 28-10-2021 10:32am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118083979#Comment_118083979

I like the idea, It would make it awkward for me to use the gates too though.

Furze99 · 28-10-2021 12:29pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118084395#Comment_118084395

As far as I know it's the land owner who has principal responsibility under the Occupiers Liability Act but this may extend to whoever is leasing. You'd want to check it yourself. The important thing is that the legislation differentiates markedly between invited and uninvited visitors. You have a far greater duty of care to invited visitors. Whereas uninvited visitors have to take responsibility for themselves. But you can't recklessly and knowingly endanger latter.

AndrewJRenko · 28-10-2021 4:32pm

Aren't all such matters the responsibility of the landowner? I know SFA about leasing land, but if it is anything like renting property, tenants really shouldn't be making changes like this on security matters. This is the landlord's problem to solve, afaik. Have you spoken to the land owner?

redroisin · 28-10-2021 4:35pm

Yes, they just don't care, and what if it was a house being rented, are tenants not allowed to safe guard their home and themselves if the landlord won't? Bear in mind too, the whole field was fenced by them with barbed wire before I even rented it

AndrewJRenko · 28-10-2021 5:09pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118086506#Comment_118086506

Maybe you need to find a different bit of land and a different landowner so.

spaceHopper · 29-10-2021 10:31am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118084420#Comment_118084420

What about an electric fence would be karma and fun

01-11-2021 2:02pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118084986#Comment_118084986

As far as I know it's the land owner who has principal responsibility under the Occupiers Liability Act but this may extend to whoever is leasing

it is the occupier who has principal responsibility. The occupier is the person who has control over the land

01-11-2021 2:22pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118086506#Comment_118086506

Tenants come under occupiers liability. They can protect their land but owe duty of care to invited visitors and less of a duty of care to trespassers. They also have to consider if the trespasser is a child who may not be able to read a warning notice. There is also the issue of what an occuoier knew, should know, or could have anticipated. If you put barbed wire around your house in an estate don't be surprised if someone claims their child was too young to read the warning sign and was injured trying to retrieve a ball.

Field Security

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