Ireland Team Talk XII: Farrell's First Fifteen

More generally, there are socio-economic reasons other than population that mean other provinces simply don't have similar or comparable player numbers.

It's a middle-class, Anglo-Irish sport. Or is seen as such, which mean much the same thing.

We really need to remedy that,but it's not as simple as having better coaches at schools (albeit that would be a start).

I did know it, I added the link as proof, there are other sources also, CJ in his own statement explained that he was available to the end of the international window.

I don’t know how you missed all this because it was talked about a lot and it’s very recent history.

He obviously flew to SA after being advised Ireland would not call him up for the summer series, but it didn’t rule him out for a late call up for the lions, if a gap opened up, and that was also reported at the time the squad was announced.

Gatland pointedly made the comment he wanted ball players with footwork and not just straight runners, so he selected Conan over Stander. So your point is wrong, just admit it and move on, you tried to say Conan was only there because Stander retired which is provably false.

Yeah, the first thing to do is to identify realistic goals for each province as each will have different realities as well as the fact that the IRFU have limited finances and resources plus the interests of the national team in mind. There would be a lot of competing interests throughout. I can only imagine how tricky that all would be.

Doris and Connors didn’t come through for a couple of years after Murphy left and Conan was injured for a lot of that time. None of them were in the 2019 RWC squad and Murphy still missed out there. And that even with Leavy and SOB out too, both of whom would have been in the squad alongside Murphy previously.

Conway may be worth a shout but it still took him 6(?) years to make his mark on the national side. That’s a Iong time in a rugby career. Beirnes move to Scarlets was the making of him rather than his move to Munster.

At best any kind of success story is few and far between. So movement between provinces is most likely a hard sell if you’re talking international ambition. Being second choice at Leinster is often better than being first choice elsewhere. Maybe we’ll see that change over the next while if we do see more movement due to the reduction in games.

“It’s not exactly ideal either tho”

Agree, but for the IRFU, as long as that system doesn’t block a potential international then it will satisfy their needs.

the provinces themselves do have to be careful to make sure their fan base doesn’t lose interest, or probably more importantly that local talent is treated with respect and backed as much as possible.

the problem with Leinster is having two players that could be Ireland 1 and 2 in one position that aren’t both getting sufficient opportunity to develop or keep in form.

Healy and McGrath probably should have meant McGrath going to another province sooner

Ross Byrne and Harry Byrne, probably one of them should move to Connacht,

Kelleher and Sheehan, the other provinces are stocked at hooker so maybe not the same push to move, tricky one.

Furlong and Porter was the same but obviously that’s resolved now.

Deegan is another that with Conan, Doris, and Ruddock. from the IRFU’s point of view, would Deegan be better off at Connacht rather than Papali’i? Obviously Deegan probably would prefer to stay but at 25 he’s probably in dodgy territory if he stays, come the bigger matches if he doesn’t feature.

Ciarán Frawley might be a shout to move to Munster when De Allende moves on.

At least with prop there is a lot of rotation, but is Porter moving to loose head because of furlong or because Healy is ageing? If he was at another province would he be staying at tighthead, and it’s debatable whether he is more valuable to the IRFU as a tighthead or loose head.

there definitely were times where McGrath wasn’t happy and wasn’t getting enough game time though, it’s not entirely correct that there were no issues, but it was left alone as it wasn’t causing a significant issue perhaps.

McGrath and Healy were often injured at different times, but I’m sure there were occasions where one or the other were missing out on big games for Leinster due to being second choice.

You would most definitely know this better so I’ll have to defer to your better knowledge of Leinster’s recent history, rather than go trawling through match day squads now.

How many have moved between provinces and enhanced their prospects with Ireland, though? I'd say Conway and Carberry because they both get more game time at Munster than they might at Leinster, and both have gotten caps consistently, injury permitting. Obviously Henshaw was already well established by the time he came to Leinster. Are there others? None of the guys who went to Ulster seem to haver succeeded in maintaining or building on their Irish potential. I wonder if this is a big influence on players when they're considering a move, particularly away from Leinster?

Cronin to Leinster probably didn't do himself any harm, was a sub for his whole career but won 70+ caps.

Will pressure come on sheehan or kelleher now to potentially move provinces..

After this weekend Leinster should have about 4 hookers on the books who have played international rugby.

Cronin may be coming to an end of his career but I doubt treacy will be moving any where in a hurry.

The "something on the internet" being words written by Stander himself, for the record.

Is it too much of a leap for you to figure maybe he was told he wasn't going to be used and therefore could move back home?

Similarly, why did Gatland go into detail about why he didn't select him for the Lions squad if he was unavailable? Spite?

Im well are of what happened, not a quote from a press conference months before. If you didnt notice over the last 2 years things were pretty changeable.

But you go with what your read and it doesnt change the original fact that Conan was kept out of the squad by CJ.