Finding a HAP landlord

You really don't have a clue do you, Property lying empty if they stopped paying HAP.

And for the record, I never read a book on economics but worked my ass off for the past 35+ years for what I have today.

Maybe try working instead of reading nonsense from clowns that change their minds with the wind.

Yes I have a suggestion, not sure if it will work but maybe worth a try.

If you have an area in mind where you’d like to rent.

You could phone up the CC overseeing that particular area and explain you’re a prospective HAP tenant etc.

And ask them if there’s anything they would recommend you look out for when viewing units in the area.

The first response will likely be that all their HAP inspectors follow guidelines so once the property meets regulations it should be fine.

But let’s say…. In the case of the HAP inspector that took exception to the cooker hoods.

I’d bet a pound to a penny it’s not the first time he failed a property over that.

He may have submitted to his superiors multiple other failure reports about the same thing.

So if I were you, I’d play the innocent, say that yes you’ve read the regs, but you’re just wondering if they have noticed any particular repetitive issue with apartments in particular or houses built before x date in their area etc.

Of course you’re not gonna say, hey I’ve heard your inspector is a finicky bugger with an aversion to cooker hoods lol.

Just be as sweet as you can and pretend your totally new to this and if you get someone wanting to help you.

They might say… well we see a lot of failures over x issue or y.

Again, not sure if it would work for you, just an idea.

All the very best with your search.

The way this should be done in a proper run department.

The landlord agrees on a lease with the tenant subject to HAP inspection.

HAP inspector calls out and does the inspection before the tenant moves in.

Checks fire certs and tax clearance certs from the landlord

Get your report from inspection, then both landlord and tenant know where they stand then.

If it's a few minor things let the tenant know it will be sorted in a few days, if it's major then it's back to the drawing board.

This is just an example of the way things should be done, but will it be done, will it fook, they would rather find some other ways to screw the small landlords while their buddies in the big REIT's do what like and screw the taxpayers for 100's of millions every year.

If a tenant comes to me within the first few months saying they want to switch to HAP after convincing me they're stable, I'll serve notice before this spills into part 4. If they're lying about this, who knows what else they'll do as time goes by!

I'm a landlord, and my tenant is an immigrant with a fairly stable job, so I haven't been through the HAP thing myself. But, when I started looking into renting my home out, I took a fair bit of advice from other landlords, just to understand the pitfalls and red flags to watch out for. HAP was one of the biggies, everyone advised me to steer clear, but be very careful to not say anything about it.

Reasons:

1. If the tenant stops paying the council, they stop paying you - I see this as a risk with any tenant who defaults on rent.

2. Almost impossible to evict - probably true for any tenant anyway...

3. The inspection. There could be a list of changes needed running into tens of thousands of euros to fix. One example - the extractor fan and light have to be on separate switches in the bathroom. How it could possibly make the tenants life worse if they're both on the same switch is something I will never understand, but whatever. There are many such unreasonable expectations a property is expected to meet, which a 30 year old house will never meet.

Another bit of advice was to keep 1 room for your use, never rent out the whole house. Make it a licensee situation instead of a lease agreement, so there is no part 4. In the 4 bed house, only 3 bedrooms are rented. The rest is deemed "common area" and one bedroom is reserved for my use. I don't really use it, and just let the tenant get on with their lives unless there's a problem that needs fixing, but having this there gave me some control over the house if things hadn't worked out.

I was also told its better to rent to immigrants (especially indians) because they usually come over with secure/sponsored jobs which by definition, have to meet a minimum income level. They're also generally well educated, so less likely to be antisocial, would keep a low profile, take good care of the house and be considerate neighbours. All great points in tenants.

All of the above is unfortunate, but with the laws skewed against landlords the way it is, threshold advising non paying renters to overshold, and evictions taking years in some cases, I'd advise any other landlord the same way too!

Yes, but I could move into the room for a few months, making it my full time residence, if it turned out that the tenant wasn't what he claimed to be during the viewing process. They can't stop me from moving into a room reserved for my use, or kick me out when the signed agreement clearly states that they only have the use of their bedrooms/ bathrooms and the remaining part is to be shared with me, and that I would be staying there from time to time. It can't be enforceable that by staying away from my home for a few months and living elsewhere, I forfeit the right to enter it?!

And once I move there, I can serve notice if it turns out they tried to trick or deceive me into getting HAP when its clear that my house wouldn't pass the inspection. I'm not going to spend hard-earned money trying to make my 1990s house meet the 2020s standards - its a ridiculous expectation from the government. If they (the government) want us to meet these standards, let them pay for it. They certainly take 45% of my earnings every month, and I don't see too much return!

Anyway, thankfully it didn't come to that.

Yes they can and they will if the RTB and revenue find out about it lol.

The property has to be your primary residence at the time you signed the agreement in order to claim licencee agreement.

You’re within your rights to reserve a room for yourself in a rented property, but your tenants will still have full tenancy protections.

You can only avail of the licencee agreement from your primary residence, you can’t just decide to switch residence once they’re in. In order to do that you’d need to scrap the current contract and start over as licencees.

I can see where you’re coming from but I’d still caution you not to underestimate the Revenue Commissioners and RTB.

They are well wide to every trick in the book. (No matter how valid the reasoning behind it)

They can find out your primary residence via Census data for one.

You can’t claim two different properties as your primary residence on the census form.

And which property are your bank accounts attached to?

driving licence, passport etc?

Its not just as simple as moving in to the rental property for a few weeks before taking in new tenants.

Truth be known, it’s probably better off for a small time LL with just one property, not to let it out at all.

And instead legitimately take licencees into their own home to rent rooms.

Tax free up to 14K, versus being taxed 50%+ on renting a whole property.

No problem removing a non paying licencee, versus battling for up to 2 years to get a non paying tenant out of a whole rental unit.

And if a licencee smashes up the place, you just call the Gardaí and have them turfed out there and then.

versus having to go through the RTB to have them removed and then they walk away free and easy to do the same thing to someone else.

I have no gripe whatsoever about your reasoning, every small LL in Ireland is in the same unprotected boat trying to find some way to protect ourselves.

But the plain fact is, the laws are against us maintaining any kind of protection.

The deck is stacked in favour of the tenants.

Hence small LL’s are getting out.

There are these licensee agreements which call out which part of the house is available and which is off limits, and like you said, detailed rules about whatever you'd like to specify. To be honest, like @YipeeDee said, multiple licensees is more straightforward than dealing with tenants who hold all tge rights!