TFI Fare Revisions from 28th November 2022 Including New 90 Minute Fare.

devnull · 15-11-2021 1:20pm #1

TFI 90 Minute Fare

The new TFI 90 Minute Fare will allow free transfer between different public transport services in the Dublin area within 90 minutes of your first trip. The new fare will replace existing fares from 28th of November. It will apply to Dublin city bus services operated by Dublin Bus and Go Ahead Ireland, Luas, and most DART and commuter rail services in the Dublin area.

The new fare structure includes a short distance fare for single trips less than 3KM and the TFI 90 Minute Fare. The TFI 90 Minute Fare will apply to trips that are greater than 3KM and also trips that use any combination of applicable transport services within 90 minutes. These transport services include Dublin city bus and Luas services as well as DART and commuter rail services in zones 1 to 4 in the Short Hop Zone.

Main Changes - Dublin city bus services operated by Dublin Bus and Go Ahead Ireland

Introduction of a new short adult fare of €1.60, to replace the 1-3 stage fare, enabling passengers to travel slightly further.
The TFI 90 Minute Fare, priced at €2.30 during an introductory period until early 2022, will combine the existing 4-13 and 13+ stage fares with the added benefit of free transfer on additional services when touching on within 90 minutes of the first journey. At the end of the promotional period the fare will be €2.50.
A new child fare will be introduced for all journeys, priced at €0.80. This fare will allow all children to travel anywhere on the Dublin city bus network, with the additional benefit of a free transfer to any additional applicable service when touching on within 90 minutes of the first journey.
Xpresso fares will remain the same for both adults and children, with the added benefit of free transfer within 90 minutes.
Nitelink fares will remain the same for both adults and children, with the added benefit of free transfer within 90 minutes.

Main Changes - Luas

Introduction of a new short adult fare of €1.60, to replace 1 zone fare
The TFI 90 Minute Fare, priced at €2.30 during an introductory period until early 2022, will combine the existing 2 – 8 zone fares with the added benefit of free transfer on additional services when touching on within 90 minutes of the first journey. At the end of the promotional period the fare will be set at €2.50.
A new child fare will be introduced for all journeys, priced at €0.80. This fare will allow all children to travel anywhere on the Luas network, with the additional benefit of a free transfer to any additional services when touching on within 90 minutes of the first journey.

Main Changes - Rail Services operated by Iarnród Éireann

Introduction of a new short adult fare of €1.60, to replace the existing 1 zone fare, enabling passengers to travel slightly further.
The TFI 90 Minute Fare, priced at €2.30 during an introductory period until early 2022, will combine the existing 2-4 zone fares with the added benefit of free transfer on additional services when touching on within 90 minutes of the first journey. At the end of the promotional period the fare will be set at €2.50.
The new 90 minute boundary includes the original zones 1 to 4, covering stations as far as Rush & Lusk to the north of Dublin city, Bray to the south, Hazelhatch to the southwest, Maynooth to the west and M3 Parkway to the northwest.
Existing 5 & 6 zone fares will remain the same, with the added benefit of free transfer within 90 minutes.
A new child fare will be introduced for all journeys, priced at €0.80. This fare will allow all children to travel anywhere within the Short Hop Zone, with the additional benefit of a free transfer to any additional services when touching on within 90 minutes of the first journey.

Leap Capping rates set to be unchanged.

All Leap caps in Dublin, both daily and weekly including multi-Operator caps, will remain at current levels.

Leap 90 to be withdrawn following introduction of the TFI 90 minute fare.

The Leap 90 travel discount will be discontinued from 28th November, once then new fares go live.

bg07 · 15-11-2021 1:43pm

Full determination here:

https://www.nationaltransport.ie/wp-content/uploads/2021/11/211115-Fares-Determination-2021-V1.0-FINAL.pdf

devnull · 15-11-2021 1:49pm

Really a big disincentive to use cash now for non short fares, not only is the premium over leap €1, but also the cash fares obviously don't have the transfer potential.

Leonard Hofstadter · 15-11-2021 3:06pm

Seems like a very welcome set of improvements.

devnull · 15-11-2021 3:07pm

Press release from NTA

https://www.transportforireland.ie/news/tfi-90-minute-fare-to-support-seamless-travel-across-the-public-transport-network-in-dublin/

TFI 90 Minute fare to support seamless travel across the Public Transport Network in Dublin

New 80 cent flat fare for children up to and including 18 years with the option of a free transfer within 90 minutes

The National Transport Authority (NTA) has today announced the introduction of the TFI 90 Minute fare across Transport for Ireland services in the Dublin area from the 28th November 2021. The revamping of the fare system will allow passengers free transfer between Dublin Bus, Luas and most DART, commuter rail and Go-Ahead Ireland services in Dublin within 90 minutes of initial touch on.

A simplified fares structure is one of the key components of the BusConnects programme which is designed to provide a better, more reliable and more efficient bus service for everyone.

The TFI 90 Minute fare will be just €2.30 for adults and students when using their TFI Leap Card during a promotional period to remain in place until the end of March 2022.

A new flat child Leap fare will be only 80 cent, allowing children to travel anywhere on Dublin city bus, Luas and commuter rail and Dart services within the Short Hop Zone, with a free transfer to any mode within 90 minutes of initial touch on. This is a 20% discount for children using the bus out of school hours, with bigger decreases on other services.

The introduction of TFI 90 will make interchange between Bus, Dart and Luas seamless, resulting in a more affordable, efficient and integrated public transport system.

The new short adult leap fare of €1.60 for single trips up to 3km, will enable 40% more passengers to travel slightly further in the new structure. Any journeys beyond this distance or involving transfers between services that take place within 90 minutes of the start, will be charged at the TFI 90 Minute fare.

NTA Chief Executive Officer Anne Graham said:

“Today is a significant day as it marks the implementation of another key component of BusConnects programme in Dublin. The introduction of the new structure will incentivise a return to public transport across the TFI network.

It provides an opportunity to create simplicity and consistency across the network regardless of the route or mode taken. It also means a significant saving for people who need to transfer between services.”

Minister for Transport Eamon Ryan said:

“It is essential that we provide the incentives that make public transport a viable and attractive choice for employees, students, shoppers and visitors. The introduction of the TFI 90 Minute fare is central to achieving this objective and encouraging more people to get back on-board.

In moving more people from their car to public transport we can help to achieve Ireland’s carbon reduction targets as set out in the Programme for Government. This is another great step in making the city a more liveable and easily accessible environment.”

AngryLips · 15-11-2021 3:19pm

Public information for the Irish Rail short hop zone is going to be as clear as dishwater once this change is implemented unless the presentation of it changes in the meantime. I didn't even know there was short hop 'zones' until this press release.

If someone has a taxsaver ticket for one mode of transport, say Dublin Bus, I'm assuming that there's not going to be any preferential fare for transfers to another mode of transport not covered by their taxsaver ticket? The cynical side of me says that the NTA will sit on their hands with restructuring taxsaver to reflect this multimodal ticketing. Taxsaver tickets for 2022 are still split by operator, even though the new fares are operator agnostic.

davetherave · 15-11-2021 4:09pm

Yeah will be curious to see how that would work. With an Annual Dublin City Bus Ticket I'm only validating it, I'm not buying a ticket, or deducting a cash balance from the e-purse so we'll have to wait and see what happens with those.

They do say this in the report:

It is envisaged that a further determination will be necessary in 2022 in respect of other adjustments necessary to fully align Leap with cash and prepaid fares, and in addition, to address all monthly and annual tickets, including Taxsaver as well as the changes required to bring into effect the Government’s decision to reduce fares on all public transport services to 50% of the adult fare for all young persons under the age of 24.

Tomrota · 15-11-2021 6:32pm

So all PSO bus services within the short hop zone will avail of the ability to transfer within 90 minutes?

LXFlyer · 15-11-2021 6:48pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118171146#Comment_118171146

It applies to the city bus services operated by Dublin Bus or Go Ahead Ireland.

Not the regional bus services operated by Bus Éireann or Go Ahead Ireland.

LXFlyer · 15-11-2021 6:59pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118170154#Comment_118170154

The Short Hop zone is the area within which the more heavily subsidised Dublin fares apply.

Irish Rail fares are distance based, and they have steadily reduced the number of fares to six within the Short Hop Zone in December 2018.

Personally, I think that the use of the term "zones" relating to fares within the Short Hop Zone is probably not the best choice of words and just causes confusion.

Basically for each station within the Short Hop Zone, every other station has a fare from that station based on distance, and these fares are categorised into six separate distance ranges from each station, into 1 (Cheapest), 2, 3, 4, 5 and 6 (Dearest).

In other words they are not zones per se, but rather graduated fares based on distance for every single station pairing.

AngryLips · 15-11-2021 7:53pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118171252#Comment_118171252

They either need to redraw the short hop zone on Irish Rail so that it aligns with leap fares, or else they need to actually draw the zones on the publicly available Irish Rail maps. At the moment, the map shows short hop zone as far out as Kilkoole on the south side, even though the preferential fares only go as far as Bray.

LXFlyer · 15-11-2021 8:30pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118171501#Comment_118171501

It's a bit more complicated than that.

The Short Hop Zone does run to Balbriggan, Howth, M3 Parkway, Kilcock, Sallins & Naas and Kilcoole.

Within that zone, the fares are on the more heavily subsidised Suburban Fares Matrix and not the Intercity fares matrix.

That's the easy bit.

Now, the NTA have introduced a further zone within that, bounded by Rush & Lusk, Howth, M3 Parkway, Maynooth, Hazelhatch and Bray, within which the 90 minute multi-modal fare of EUR 2.30 (EUR 2.50) will apply for trips from the city centre.

As I said above, the fares across the short hop zone, are not based on what anyone would think of as zones (like in London), but rather there are six fare categories, which are distance based, and which means that every station will have unique fares to other stations.

So, for example, the map at the end of the NTA fare determination where they show "Zone 5" and "Zone 6" applies to Dublin City Centre stations only.

Raheny would have a completely different fare category map, based on distance, as would, for example, Leixlip Confey.

Every single station will have an individual set of fares based on the distances travelled from them and these will be categorised within fare categories 1-6.

Confused? Well so am I - take a train trip from Maynooth to Bray.

That's fare category 5, but yet is in the new inner zone covered by the 90 minute fare. So what fare applies?

AngryLips · 15-11-2021 8:44pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118171678#Comment_118171678

Surely a Maynooth to Bray journey would be covered by the 90 minute fare? I totally forgotten this tidbit, but short hop zone is to indicate where leap card can be used for payment on IR. My point is just that the information needs to be clearer: just show the short-fare zone on the short hop map.

The J Stands for Jay · 15-11-2021 8:46pm

The short hop zone for using the leap card includes Kilcoole, bit Kilcoole does not have a leap card validator. I'm not surprised at the new fares being confusing.

LXFlyer · 15-11-2021 8:55pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118171731#Comment_118171731

Well one would think so - but currently that trip from Maynooth is in fare category 5 based on the distance travelled from Maynooth.

So I don't know is the answer. Some clarification is needed on this.

Just to clarify that while the Short Hop Zone is is the area around Dublin where you can use LEAP, the primary defining point is that it is where the more heavily subsidised Dublin Suburban Fares matrix applies on Irish Rail, for both cash and LEAP fares, as opposed to the higher InterCity fares matrix.

SeeMoreBut · 16-11-2021 9:02am

With the 90 minute fare which is good for some people will people get the pleasure of paying extra due to a points failure?

MOH · 16-11-2021 9:14am

Am I missing something or is this is basically an 11% fare increase on most single bus journeys (4 to 13 stages)?

Irish Steve · 16-11-2021 9:27am

The issue that's going to raise a lot of blood pressure in Meath is that Ashbourne (and South Meath) is Bus Eireann, not Dublin Bus, and it seems there's nothing for this area in the new plan, despite being closer to the city than Balbriggan and Maynooth etc. A historic anomaly that seems to have been completely ignored by this change. Doesn't affect me personally, as I have free travel now anyway, but there will be a lot of unhappy commuters in this area. Also completely unclear is what the position is with the Go Ahead Swords - Ashbourne service.

No great surprise, this area has been badly treated by service providers for most of the 30 years we've lived here, it's only very recently there were any alternatives other than Busaras from Ashbourne, and even now, there are very few alternatives if you don't work in the city centre.

SteM · 16-11-2021 9:41am

How does this work if someone gets on a Dart in Greystones and then changes to a Luas in Connolly to Heuston 70 minutes later? I assume nothing changes and it will be full fare for both journeys (€4.90 + €2.10).

But you could theoretically get an 84 from Greystones, change to a Dart in Bray and then change to a Luas in Connolly under the new fare structure. Is that correct?

Stevek101 · 16-11-2021 9:56am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118173485#Comment_118173485

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118173351#Comment_118173351

All fares seems to have the 90 minute feature. So it'll just be €4.90.

For bus users its a fare increase for all stages 1-13. However there is no increase for 13+, unless of course you use to make a transfer than you are making a saving. I reckon that's why its €2.30 for the next few months.

LXFlyer · 16-11-2021 10:27am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118173416#Comment_118173416

Presumably they would then be happy to have their buses stop at every bus stop in the city en route to pick up and set down rather than the limited stop service that they currently have?

I suspect not.

Irish Steve · 16-11-2021 10:57am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118173707#Comment_118173707

At peak periods, there wouldn't be a lot of point picking up, there's no space, but it's moot anyway, there's not that many stops that are not used between Finglas and Abbey Street. That said, I'd be more in favour of reducing the number of in city stops, if, and there's the rub, there was a sensible interlink to allow the use of city buses to feed the longer routes. Not just for the Ashbourne area, for a number of routes, the ideal scenario would be to have "interchange" hubs in the vicinity of the M50 where major routes from further out are joining, and then have high speed non stop feeder services from those hubs to the centre, and to other hubs and areas, but that would mean a fundamental change to the structure of service. As an example, it's long overdue that M3 Parkway should be such a hub, and services like the 109 should run non stop from M3 Parkway down the port tunnel to the centre, and then have feeders in to M3 to cover places like Blanchardstown, Finglas, the industrial estates, and across to places like Red Cow, where similar interchanges could be operated, as the massive shortcoming of too much of the present system is that it's focussed on the city centre, and getting from (say) Finglas to Sandyford is not an eay or quick journey.

The concept of a metro that covers much of the route of the M50 was proposed a long time ago, and it still a totally valid concept, but it needs to be capable of running at reasonable frequency and high speed, not messing around at street level like the LUAS concept, the requirement is to be able to get people from one side of the city to the other, without making the centre of the city a high volume interchange, but we don't seem to have the people with enough vision to make that happen. There are massive numbers of very large industrial areas around the city now, and that's only going to continue, but getting to those areas by public transport is not as easy as it needs to be, the result being massive numbers of cars going to those areas every day.

bk · 16-11-2021 11:00am

I've mixed feelings about this.

Obviously great news that it is finally been introduced and for those who will benefit from it.

However a massive, 25c increase for most people (stages 4 - 13) who will never benefit is a complete rip off. I'd fall just outside the short zone, about 3.5km (depending on how they measure it) and would take just one bus into the City Center. Pretty much everyone in this area of Dublin is going to be super pissed off at this massive price increase for little or no benefit for them. Paying €2.50 to travel just 3.5 km is ridiculous.

Also any news on how you buy a short ticket? If it continues to require driver interaction, then it kills any benefit in terms of reducing dwell times.

Also any news on how the 3km short fare will be operated, how do you work out if the trip is 3km, will the journey planners be updated with this info?

LXFlyer · 16-11-2021 11:46am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118173879#Comment_118173879

Totally agree about the €2.25 increase to €2.50. I could live with €2.30, but an 11% fare increase is too great.

Let’s be honest, this is to facilitate a relatively small number of people by comparison. I welcome the 90 minute ticket, but it’s coming at a price.

As for the detailed mechanics of the “short” fare, it seems that the NTA are keeping this as secret as the last secret of Fatima!

Stevek101 · 16-11-2021 11:48am

The sub 3km fare is in all likelihood going to be stage 1-3. They are claiming that 40% of people on this short fare will be able to go "slightly further" without any detail of who these commuters are or even if they are bus users.

It would be nice to see who is using what fare, I recall the 4-13 was the most used a few years ago. So I would agree most will be seeing a 25c increase and many will not want to use the interchange. The whole reason for bringing it in was that Busconnects would require many to get a transfer to complete their journeys but the local TDs put a stop to that.

LXFlyer · 16-11-2021 11:52am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118174146#Comment_118174146

I suspect it’ll be 1-4 stages due to the extra length claim.

To be fair, changing will happen more once the new orbitals are launched next year.

They will be straighter than the current ones and that may mean people changing to do current trips.

Also in this phase, users of parts of routes 25, 66a and 66b will all need to change if making off-peak trips to the city, as will anyone travelling between Chapelizod and points west of Palmerstown.

It is essential to have the 90 minute ticket to implement this phase.

Stevek101 · 16-11-2021 12:00pm

I completely agree a 90 minute was needed but it would of been better to have a short non interchange fare rather than a sub 3km fare. Basically the current 2.25 reduced to 2 or 1.75 to increase public transport usage.

B2021M · 16-11-2021 12:03pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118173879#Comment_118173879

Yes that increase has been hidden in all the headlines and affects far more people.

billyhead · 16-11-2021 12:04pm

Sorry for the stupid question. Say you need to get a bus and train into town. Do you tag on once on the bus and than tag off at the end of the train journey in say Pearse Street for the 90 minutes rate to apply or do you have to tag on when you board the bus and also at the departing train station and than tag off as normal at Pearse Street?

Stevek101 · 16-11-2021 12:05pm

I reckon you'll be tagging on and off as normal. But will only be charged the 90 minute fare €2.30/€2.50.

LXFlyer · 16-11-2021 12:14pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118174237#Comment_118174237

Tag on the bus, tag on and off on the train.

Peregrine · 16-11-2021 1:35pm

Has the DB fare calculator been taken down?

Anyway, there's still no detailed info on the short fare and how it will be measured. I think it will include a lot more people than before. And, yes, it will require driver interaction for now. This step is just minor changes using existing equipment. It's not enough but it's a step that should have happened years ago so I'll take the win for now. It's been barely a year since the NTA took over fare revenue from Dublin Bus.

But the fare itself is a big issue. A lot of people who read the proposal are pissed off about this and a lot more will be pissed off when the fare goes up next year. €2.25 is definitely the most common fare and most people won't need to interchange even after BusConnects. My 5km journey is going from €2.25 to €2.50. I have no need to interchange regularly and I only use the bus a few times a week so the caps don't come into play. €2.30 isn't great but most people can live with that. I suspect there will be a campaign in March to keep it at €2.30.

loyatemu · 16-11-2021 2:04pm

€1.50 flat 90 minute fare covering the whole SHZ would be simple and no increase for anyone - I mean do they want people to use PT or not?

breezy1985 · 16-11-2021 2:18pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118175058#Comment_118175058

They could have left the single fare as is and the have the €2.50 for 2+ fares.

Or do like London and have 1 free transfer in the allotted time and then pay again which would have suited most commuters.

Is the 3km a journey distance or crow flies ? If they done this in Limerick my single bus 3.4km journey would be hiked up if using road distance

loyatemu · 16-11-2021 2:31pm

Or do like London and have 1 free transfer in the allotted time and then pay again which would have suited most commuters.

one of the key features of BusConnects is more transfers (or it was when it was first announced). How many passengers will be making 2 transfers though, not really worth the extra complication of charging them extra.

devnull · 16-11-2021 2:36pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118175058#Comment_118175058

.That would require significant additional Government funding to cover the massive shortfall in fare revenue.

devnull · 16-11-2021 2:39pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118174135#Comment_118174135

Believe that there are still certain wheels in motion in the background in terms of the implementation and finer details of this new fare system and how it will work in practice which is also why no operator other than LUAS have yet published any details on the new system etc.

Really shouldn't be that way and it should be finalised by now, but with the network committed to be changing on 28th it could well be the case that they know they need the new system to launch at same time as the network but it's behind where they would like it to be.

Agree that going to £2.50 is a bit much. I would have been okay with £2.40 or so but going to £2.50 is a little too much. Would have been sensible o just go with £2.30 and review at next fares determination rather than say it's going to increase straight off the bat. I presume that the NTA are going down this road because of fear of loss of revenue?

bk · 16-11-2021 2:45pm

The more I think of it, the more it is a complete rip off.

Just ten years ago, in December 2011, my fare, the Stage 4 to 7 fare, increased to €1.70

It will now become €2.50, so that is just under a 50% increase in ten years!

To put that in context, inflation over the past 10 years has been 5.08%, which would mean that €1.70 fare should be coming €1.79 next year!

The majority of us are being screwed by the NTA for a relatively tiny number of people who will use the transfer.

breezy1985 · 16-11-2021 2:48pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118175286#Comment_118175286

My point was London have no extra charge for distance so its £1.40 for 1 or 2 buses. If you want 3 buses you start over

Bus Connect will make it €2.50 for most people for 1 bus which is wrong.

loyatemu · 16-11-2021 2:55pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118175353#Comment_118175353

well, yes... but how much in the context of the billions being promised for transport in the dim and distant future. I'd like to see them put their money where their mouth is now.

single cheap flat fare - no one complaining about it here, no more interaction with the driver, no complicated system full of exceptions, and incentive to get people out of their cars, particularly with WFH meaning fewer people have annual/monthly tickets.

devnull · 16-11-2021 3:00pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118175541#Comment_118175541

So you need to lobby the Government to provide the funding to allow that to happen and to pay for the additional staff and vehicles to surface the extra demand that would be generated.

Believe it or no, the NTA don't simply ask for money and get it every time. Often what they want in terms of finance the Government isn't willing to commit in which case they can only deal with what they are given.

I think they've got it wrong on the €2.50 fare still, it's just bad PR to say €2.30 than €2.50 after a while, just stick it at the lower amount and then just review it the next time the fares re reviewed. They've made a faux par here.

bk · 16-11-2021 3:16pm

So here are what the fares were in 2012 and what they should be today with inflation:

Stage 1 - 3 - €1.25 - €1.31
Stage 4 - 7 - €1.70 - €1.79
Stage 8 - 13 - €1.95 - €2.05
Stage 13+ - €2.40 - €2.52

Only the 13+ people are ok, everyone else is getting screwed. Even the new short fare people are like a 25% increase in ten years (5 times inflation). The Stage 4 -7 people are the worst off at 10 times inflation!

bk · 16-11-2021 3:19pm

"So you need to lobby the Government to provide the funding to allow that to happen and to pay for the additional staff and vehicles to surface the extra demand that would be generated."

Given that they have been increasing fares at up to 10 times inflation over the past ten years, the question to ask is what have they been doing with all the extra money.

The €2.50 fare is 37% higher then the London Bus flat fare of €1.83, how in hell can they justify that?

breezy1985 · 16-11-2021 3:24pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118175711#Comment_118175711

No zones on London buses either. Same price for any journey.

Now I get that TFL have the massive UK tax base and crazy high user numbers but they also have to fork out for tons of quiet or empty trains and buses every night so it's not all easy sailing

LXFlyer · 16-11-2021 3:24pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118175600#Comment_118175600

100% agree with this.

Reducing the fare to EUR 1.50 isn’t going to happen without a substantial increase in the subvention, over and above the significant payments made during the last eighteen months.

People seem to be forgetting that the operating companies would have gone bust last year but for a massive increase in day to day funding.

devnull · 16-11-2021 3:28pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118175736#Comment_118175736

You need to also remember that the vast majority of people who take a bus in London are taking far shorter journeys than the average passenger on your average Dublin Bus route though, so it's not exactly comparable.

LXFlyer · 16-11-2021 3:32pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118175695#Comment_118175695

It’s inevitable if there is fare simplification that there’s going to be winners and losers.

I fully agree that the majority of people would be being “screwed” if this fare does increase to EUR 2.50. In fact, I think politically that will be toxic and it won’t happen.

Most people could live with EUR 1.60 and EUR 2.30, but beyond that it’s just ripping people off.

As I said the 90 minute option is a nice thing to have, and it is essential in the context of the rollout of the new BusConnects local and orbital routes, but the vast majority of people will continue to be making a single mode journey and won’t avail of it.

The majority are paying for this.

devnull · 16-11-2021 3:34pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118175695#Comment_118175695

I understand what you are saying, however there is another group of people who are vastly better off, namely though who use more than one mode of transport, it used to be vastly expensive before multi modal caps and transfers for people who did that compared to what t is now.

The tickets you are comparing from 2012 to now are not exactly the same because there are now caps and transfers which didn't exist then and whilst they may not work that ell for the bus only customer they are vastly cheaper for those who are using more than one method, you can't overlook that I'm afraid.

I do think that €2.50 is too much as I've said a couple of times though. It should stay at 2.30, which I think is fine considering the extra features and benefits the ticket has now versus when it had none of these 10 years ago.

breezy1985 · 16-11-2021 3:35pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118175766#Comment_118175766

Really ?

There are people bussing it from Croydon to London Bridge. I used bus from Waterloo to Catford and my coworker Waterloo to Wimbledon.

Ya there are plenty of people who train or tube then get a short bus but the 2 bus or long distance bus to work group is huge especially in South London.

devnull · 16-11-2021 3:36pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118175802#Comment_118175802

If you were to look at the average London bus journey vs the average Dublin Bus Journey, I can see the later being quite a bit longer. That doesn't mean that there are not people taking long bus journeys in London, but it's a far less percentage of their patrons than in Dublin.

Stevek101 · 16-11-2021 3:39pm

The highlight from the determination:

It is clear, therefore, that there are challenges surrounding the funding of existing public transport services

as well as the improvements the Authority wishes to see implemented in order to improve provision across

the state. In light of current uncertainties in relation to the wider economic recovery in the aftermath of the

pandemic, combined with our ambition to increase the use of public transport as a means of addressing the

challenges posed by climate change, it is the view of the Authority that the implementation of increased

fares as the primary driver towards the overall cost of public transport provision is not appropriate at this

time and could drive customers from public transport at a time when we need to see customer journeys

increasing.

And what do they do... Increase the fares for most 😂