The creeping prominence of the Irish language

Languages aren't magic, they're just skills and like all skills if you don't use it, you lose it. I had no reason to use it for years, have since lost it, and have no intention of regaining it.

Was there a public vote on the 2003 act? I wasn't old enough to vote then and google doesn't show there was.

Like the John Hinde postcard thatched cottage, nice to see and part of our heritage but hardly any bastard is committed enough to live in one.

It has to do with the fact that for all intents and purposes I'm not an Irish speaker now, it doesn't really matter that I could potentially recover it.

I think you're a little bit mixed-up here.

Since around the time the crash happened, there have been few enough Gaelscoileanna set up, but there has been a great deal of encouragement by the Dept of Education to Educate Together. If you look at their website, they have 96 primary schools and 23 secondary schools, mostly set up in the last ten years or so. And fair play to them, I'm all in favour of getting the churches out of education. All but one of these schools teach through English, BTW. Patronage for the one that teaches through Irish is shared with An Foras Pártrúnachta.

Over the same period, very few Gaelscoileanna have been permitted to open by the Dept of Education, despite huge demand. I wonder why. Some people would be of the opinion that they favour Educate Together because they do not have a vision for changing the country - what Educate Together do is simply acknowledge a change that has already happened: secularisation of the country. People no longer go to church in any great numbers, and as such removing a small number of schools from church control is no big deal, as it is a reactive movement.

The Gaelscoil movement on the other hand is a proactive movement; they have a vision for a country where as many people as possible can speak Irish. The people who run the country don't want this, as this would represent a major change within society, and could pressage further unwanted and unpredictable change. They don't like change that they do not control; indeed for many years, Educate Together was also stymied, but has come to be seen as no great threat and certainly the far lesser of two evils..

I studied Irish in secondary school I never spoke Irish for 1 minute, I had a few books to read, story's. I know maybe 30 words in Irish, I can see no practical value in knowing Irish in the real world everyone speaks English, if someone wants to spend time learning Irish good luck to them it's like playing the bodhrán for 95 per cent of people it will not get them work most people do not work as teachers or in tg4 its not hiding away or in the depths of my memory I did not like it all the books we read were about farmers rural people no connection to modern life you can't recover something if you never learned it and you had mediocre teachers when you are over 40 you realise time is limited you have a limited amount of time to learn skills

I think most young people would prefer to learn subjects that will help them to get actually get work maths English science computer studys

If you lived in the 70s there was a great revival in Irish folk music the chieftains the dubliners Luke Kelly etc and even then most people were not that interested in speaking Irish now we have 100s of TV channels streaming TV Netflix etc YouTube I see no sign of any uptick in Irish language apart from government funded ads in irish

I don't know what's going on in schools eg how is Irish taught now is it just reading a few books

Actually it's you that's mixed up I'm afraid.

You're confusing the setting up of new schools with the transfer of religious patron schools to a new patron (divestment).

Dept of Education are naturally reluctant to allow a new gaelscoil to open in an area if it's going to leave the existing schools with empty places. But for ETs they don't allow a new one to be established under those circumstances at all - only in an area with growing population and enough unmet demand for school places to justify a new school can an ET be established. Even then, they can - with no consultation with parents or any appeal or review process - just decide to expand the existing religious patron school(s) in the area rather than allow a new ET to be established.

This is divestment, and to all intents and purposes it is not happening at all. Only a handful of schools in the entire country have been divested from a religious patron to non-religious, and most of those afaik have been to ETB (Community National Schools) not ET. The CNSs still have religious instruction during the school day and prepare for sacraments, so really are "catholic lite" schools.

The RCC has been able to stymie any calls for divestment in most areas, e.g. in Malahide a couple of years ago a survey established there was enough demand to divest 2 of the existing 8 primary schools, in the end they managed to block even 1 through a campaign of fear, uncertainty and doubt targeted at the parents of pupils in those schools. Meanwhile the parents of future pupils didn't get any say at all. Allowing the church to run this process is a joke but that suits the Dept of Education down to the ground.

I saw this article Mother with child with special needs of secondary school age claimed in court - that she should get an exemption from Irish. As it is effecting the child’s mental well being. The school said she did not satisfy the exemption. And it was noted the child attended Irish classes when at primary level, with no exemption.

Personally I hated maths would loved to have had ADHD to try and claim an exemption.

The posts by PeadarCo & Wibbs above sum up well the current state of Irish in the state. The language is stuck in some some sort of crack, sustained by state supports and legislation and national self delusion. Those with a real interest in the language need to recognise this and change their approach. A love of Irish for what it is and a personal desire to learn it, a recognition that it can and will never be more than a very valid cultural activity. And that is the sum total of it's limits. The idea that it can be reinvented and restored as a national means of communication is just totally unrealistic and does more harm than good.

Withdraw all state supports and enabling legislation and let it thrive like a weed.

The creeping prominence is entirely false and driven by legislation, not from the people.

The post previous to mine claimed it was something the people wanted. How would you know that without a vote on the issue?

I'm of the impression that they need us to hate the language so that they can have somethign to debate. Just being indifferent to it kind of makes it look like it's unimportant, and that hurts them more.

What was it Oscar WIlde said, better to be talked badly than not to be talked about at all.

True, but they come and go because they have no real substance to their arguments, but if you raise logical points form a neutral point of view you still get shot down - as a "noisy anglo" to quote one case - by people who are claiming that the langauge as an integral part of the entire country's lifestyle. I got hammered by three sperate people simply for pointing out that Irish is not a life-skill in the same way maths or english is.

For me - as I've said before - people tend to be more obsessed with the status of the language rather than the progression of it.