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The Irish protocol.

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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 11,629 ✭✭✭✭downcow


    You are misquoting me again. I did not say there was no drugs problem in east Belfast or anywhere else. I was responding to a claim that it wa a ghetto with lots of problems. I was stating that most people I know who travel to Dublin occasionally from Belfast are absolutely shock at people spiced out of their heads and others begging in main thorofares



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,629 ✭✭✭✭downcow


    Drop the false shock. You knew rightly what I meant and tbh my dad who was from your country always referred to it as the soldiers song and his party piece was to sing it in Irish. So I’m not sure what the issue is. Should he not have been allowed to call it the ss or was he wrong?. Is that not it’s name? And if not then where did that come from ?



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,629 ✭✭✭✭downcow


    Thanks for that. I have only yet watched intro but will watch it all. I completely backs up what I am say (at least the intro does) ie SOME PEOPLE in ni are obsessed with orange



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,035 ✭✭✭✭J Mysterio


    Fascinating that your Dad is from Ireland and could speak Irish. You have given the impression that Irish is something you havent been exposed to, and so why would you understand any of it, or be able to spell anything related to Irish or Irish names and whatever else.

    What is the dynamic there? Your mother is a unionist who raised you in that way, blocking influence from your father? Or he converted, or disavowed his Irishness or what?

    You speak of 'your community' being the unionist community, but surely you should be placed somewhere between both communities in NI?

    surely given your background, you should be a strong champion of the protocol



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,278 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    Singing the song in Irish? So you mean just singing it......

    You show such disrespect and prejudice against the Irish language its really quite disgusting that id ask why do you hate it so much?

    I honestly had no clue what your abbreviation ss meant that's how rare it is to hear it called its English translation, I honestly have never heard anyone refer to it using the translated name unless they were specifically translating it for an educational purpose of explaining its name. The only time I remember hearing it have its translation mentioned in any frequency was prior to the england croke park rugby game.

    Would you be so insulting as to translate the name of all other countries national anthems when talking about them instead of at least attempting to refer to them by their native language name? Or on here just simply copy and paste the numerous times its been written.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭Jump_In_Jack


    Wasn't it originally an English language song called The Soldier's Song, that was translated to Irish and put to music and then made the national anthem?

    I thought it was common knowledge that it was known as the soldiers song.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,278 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    I was aware its english name but honestly didnt know its history thanks for that. But again I have never heard anyone call it that casually even in conversation. Its officially called Ambhrainn na Mbhiann as our national anthem I dont think its beyond the realms to expect people to call it its official name simply out of respect? Id consider the same for anyone who called the french national anthem "The Marseillaise" instead of "La Marsellaise" its a tiny change but in my opinion significant.

    For me when downcow calls is ss its just another petty dogwhistle signalling his now obvious prejudice against the Irish language



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 40,191 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    DUP & Downing St: "the protocol is not working"

    In the real world...




  • Registered Users Posts: 2,418 ✭✭✭BluePlanet


    Unlikely imo.

    What you've suggested is something along the lines of Nothing is Agreed Until Everything is Agreed. Which by the way, is a tactic unionists have employed in the run up to the GFA. We'll never get all stakeholders to agree on all things obviously, therefore will never reach an agreement.

    Better i think, to follow the concept of Brexit; win agreement on a single and simple concept, then create a framework, process and timeline to build out from there.

    Some of those undecided issues, such as flags and anthems, might be worth fighting over if you feel really strongly about such, but why front load that fight?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,966 ✭✭✭fly_agaric


    Interesting story. Investment decisions that depend on existence of NI protocol seem like a bit of a gamble on the UK not having the will (or cojones) to actually go through with wrecking it. I wonder would there have been more of that if UK govt. signals & noises about it were otherwise?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,035 ✭✭✭✭J Mysterio


    The whole point of why Brexit was such a disaster is that no one really knew what they were voting for, and that it meant all things to all people. Brexit means Brexit. Recipe for disaster. The terms of a UI need to be largely set out before any vote is held.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,418 ✭✭✭BluePlanet


    Brexit is a disaster when viewed exclusively from an economy POV. Brexit is a disaster from a Loyalist POV because of the NIP, evidently.

    But if you were emotionally invested in the concept of Sovereignty, and that was your trigger, then Brexit isn't a disaster. It may be a work in progress with some unfinished business (NIP), but not a disaster.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,418 ✭✭✭BluePlanet


    What i think would occur in your scenario J Mysterio, is that while trying to whittle down all the issues of a UI and present them as a package, in advance of the vote, is that you'll end up carrying fewer and fewer passengers along the way and the vote will fail.

    And i think many potential Yes voters, would end up voting No over what i would consider unsubstantial or lesser issues, that may act as emotional triggers. Such as insisting on the tricolour, and the anthem.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,275 ✭✭✭fash


    To a certain extent, investment creates its own momentum. The more investment there is into NI, the more obvious the consequences of and reaction to HMG reneging.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,629 ✭✭✭✭downcow


    Haha. That is slightly sectarian but I believe you don’t mean to be so I’ll give you a by ball. To assume he needed to convert because he learnt Irish 😀

    he was a Presbyterian born and reared in donegal. His experience of Irish was fairly negative. He attended a catholic school for most of his time because that was the only near option. He talked about getting Irish beaten in to him and especially because he was a prod.

    they were both moderate unionists, if you could be living in a republican area. I guess they and me were more affected by the dominant republican community and their ongoing sectarian attacks and lauding over us, than we realise.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,629 ✭✭✭✭downcow


    Tbh I didn’t think it was an issue. My dad could also sing it in English. Does it go ‘soldiers are we…..’?

    apart from this forum I don’t think I ever heard it called that Irish spelling. So apologies if ss is offensive - I am completely baffled why it would be. Is it just you or do other posters regard it as offensive?

    thh I would primarily hear it referred to as ‘the republics anthem’ but certainly quite often the ss.

    I wouldn’t attempt to spell it in Irish so would you suggest an abbreviation I could use?



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,629 ✭✭✭✭downcow


    Now you will accuse me of all sorts again, but I honestly would not have a clue how to pronounce what you have just written. Would anyone like to help me or do I need to resort to google translate.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,629 ✭✭✭✭downcow


    Ah yes. Memories. It was the chorus he would have sing foe us in English and then really show off by doing it in Irish followed by counting to twenty.

    in very recent years he had a couple he was friends with Doris and Ian. He always said he remembered their names as Doris was Irish for door and I can’t remember what Ian was Irish for. Anyone know?



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,629 ✭✭✭✭downcow


    Great stuff. As long as we don’t become too attractive for the English and Irish to live in. I sense this is happening and house prices are headed upward.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,966 ✭✭✭fly_agaric


    Well afair...doras is Irish for door, éan is Irish for bird but neither are quite pronounced like Doris or Ian! This thread is a good laugh at times...!



  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Yep. Your salaries are dog-sh1t. Outsiders easily have the means to muscle you out of the housing market. Already plenty of stories of Dublin people moving north and picking up houses for a song.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,966 ✭✭✭fly_agaric


    That is true. Unfortunately I don't think desires of companies that take a chance on it (or NI public opinion) will cut very much ice with the government.

    It was interesting as well that some of the comments/quotes about these issues in the article were anonymous.

    It (giving opinions about the NI Protocol & Brexit etc.) is obviously a sensitive business, hazardous to stick your neck out.



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 40,191 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    Northern accents would probably make them sound as @downcow has said.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,629 ✭✭✭Fionn1952


    .....the Paradox of Downcow's particular flavour of Unionism writ large right there.

    The NI Protocol is simultaneously so egregious to Unionism and harmful to business that it must be changed (lest translink need a whole new fleet), while also so economically beneficial that it could boost the economy to the extent that people could no longer afford to move their from either of NI's MUCH wealthier neighbours....

    Pick a bloody lane



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,629 ✭✭✭✭downcow


    I guess sometimes it’s better the devil you know



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,727 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Feck me, Billy Hutchison is after lambasting Bertie Ahern for stating the obvious and ended up lashing out at everyone and finished saying Loyalism's main problem is with the British government and where it is going next.

    Pivoting all around the place instead of standing still and looking in the mirror.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭Jump_In_Jack


    Amhrán an bhFiann

    Pronunciation guide to saying it,

    using English sounds,

    Our-on na vee-in



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,629 ✭✭✭Fionn1952


    A completely irrelevant response. The devil you know is gone, Brexit has taken that out back and shot it.

    The question surrounds the NI Protocol, which you're simultaneously claiming is impossible for Unionists to countenance in its current form and is disrupting your economy.....while also benefitting your economy to the extent that you fear that people may soon not be able to move there from either of (I'll highlight again) the MUCH wealthier neighbouring regions......those two positions are mutually exclusive.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 11,629 ✭✭✭✭downcow


    Many thanks. And that certainly rings a bell so I have heard it said



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