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Company Training during Annual leave

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  • 21-11-2021 6:37pm
    #1
    Nicetrustedcup
    Registered Users Posts: 425 ✭✭


    Hi everyone wondering if you can help me,


    Few months back I had to do some workplace training during 4 out of 7 days days off Annual leave that I booked off , I also had to do a exam outside of working hours for work and was also offered no time off in return

    I was not offered any extra days off in return, am I being OTT requesting these days off in lu?


    thanks



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    #2
    Nicetrustedcup
    Registered Users Posts: 425 ✭✭Nicetrustedcup


    Yah cool work is considering them as holidays even so I needed to do this training to do my job,

    the issue I have is how do I speak to my manager about this when he has a total disregard for time off or anything like this



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    #3
    gameoverdude
    Registered Users Posts: 6,317 ✭✭✭gameoverdude


    Holidays are holidays. If you're working/ training(work related), they're not holidays.



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    #4
    Strumms
    Registered Users Posts: 25,471 ✭✭✭✭Strumms


    The four days should be added back to your holiday allowance.

    the exam again could be offered as OT or hours... either way you should be compensated.

    to be honest, for the inconvenience and your flexibility if I was a manager I’d throw an extra days leave in there as a thank you...



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    #5
    Pawwed Rig
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,385 CMod ✭✭✭✭Pawwed Rig


    Just to be clear was it training organised by your employer that they required you to attend or was it training that you organised that your employer was not involved in?

    Seems bizarre that they would try to claim this was hols if they had required it?



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    #6
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 1,344 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118202591#Comment_118202591

    I have a total disregard for paying the tv licence fee/tax but they eventually, after several red letter, send someone around to warn me I face court for not paying, then when they send me the final warning I end up lashing out €160. The point is it's totally irrelevant how a manager 'feels' about these things.... if you're doing legitimate necessary training during your requested/approved holiday days, then you didn't GET those holiday days..... no 'it's and buts'



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    #7
    daheff
    Registered Users Posts: 5,866 ✭✭✭daheff


    If they won't give you back the days off, then I'd suggest you take as much sick days as you can until you recoup these days



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    #8
    Nicetrustedcup
    Registered Users Posts: 425 ✭✭Nicetrustedcup


    They should be and will they is another thing as our work holiday year isn’t the same as jan to dec it’s mid year to mid year don’t ask ….

    the training was paid for by the company and was on it with 6 others form the office at the time, however eveyone else was working I was on AL,

    I have been having a disagreement with my manager on this topic for the past 5 months and has gone nowhere … his words is that we are expected to be flexible ha



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    #9
    Strumms
    Registered Users Posts: 25,471 ✭✭✭✭Strumms


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118202662#Comment_118202662

    Flexible, that’s a word that was bandied around in my last place by the manglers.

    its usually a one way street... one not favoring the employees...

    generally code for... “ consistently bend over for us and maybe once time in a year we might exceed to your request for help “.



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    #10
    Pawwed Rig
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,385 CMod ✭✭✭✭Pawwed Rig


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118202662#Comment_118202662

    That is BS then. Annual leave is protected by law. If they required you in then it is not holidays.



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    #11
    Nicetrustedcup
    Registered Users Posts: 425 ✭✭Nicetrustedcup


    Thanks everyone for the help on this,


    it was workplace training that I was told to he on by the manager who booked my name in for it, I did not go looking for it, however it’s a skill needed for my role


    during the AL I also had to do workplace meetings and a report and side deck for the manager on a project ….


    no Time in liu was offered, I have had many disagreements with my manager over this this is only the tip of disagreements on common workplace laws


    have a meeting with him and his manager tomorrow and this topic and is one of the 3 major questions I am raising



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    #12
    Mrs OBumble
    Registered Users Posts: 25,975 ✭✭✭✭Mrs OBumble


    Once the training date was known, why didn't you cancel the leave?



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    #13
    gameoverdude
    Registered Users Posts: 6,317 ✭✭✭gameoverdude


    It's not holidays then. Would they be happy for you to go off to Berlin for a jolly during work time?



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    #14
    Nicetrustedcup
    Registered Users Posts: 425 ✭✭Nicetrustedcup


    irs My own fault for not canceling the holidays however my manager should have at least offered me time off in return


    yap they would go awol if I just went off to another country and took a few days off ha,


    but this is tue joys of big company’s …..


    but wish me luck in tomorrows meetings I need it



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    #15
    Pawwed Rig
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,385 CMod ✭✭✭✭Pawwed Rig


    If it is a big company you will be fine.

    Go over his head if you have to. A HR dept will very quickly tell him that your hols are your own.



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    #16
    gameoverdude
    Registered Users Posts: 6,317 ✭✭✭gameoverdude


    I presume you have a holiday request application. Just cancel the days. Let them bring it up. You were working so not annual leave.



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    #17
    Nicetrustedcup
    Registered Users Posts: 425 ✭✭Nicetrustedcup


    Don’t worry it’s going to be a fun meeting and it was one,

    Refused to talk about it and told me to HR,

    cant keep claiming stuff, I was told but I am old I have proof and this is why the relationship between myself and my manager has broken down

    HR are next to useless anyway no idea what the next action might be



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    #18
    Jim2007
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 10,305 Mod ✭✭✭✭Jim2007


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118202662#Comment_118202662

    Yes you need to be flexible to some extent as in if the course could only be held that week and there were others involved. But did you specifically point out you had holidays booked for that week and did he specifically say it was coming out of your holiday allowance?



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    #19
    Nicetrustedcup
    Registered Users Posts: 425 ✭✭Nicetrustedcup


    Yes I did point out that I holidays booked and yes it was coming out of my allowance


    and yes the course was booked only for that week it was 8am start or 10pm start it I wonted to be on with the us,



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    #20
    knipex
    Registered Users Posts: 2,018 ✭✭✭knipex


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118202662#Comment_118202662

    Couple of questions.


    Had you annual leave booked before the training was planned or did you book after On the understanding that you would attend ?

    Was this a travel to site multi hour training thing or a 20 minute teams online training thing ?



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    #21
    SVI40
    Registered Users Posts: 646 ✭✭✭SVI40


    Next step would to get onto these:

    https://www.workplacerelations.ie/en/



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    #22
    HildaOgdenx
    Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 7,115 Mod ✭✭✭✭HildaOgdenx


    As pp have said, is there a system on which you book leave? If so I would go back in and cancel the days, as you were working, and not on A/L.

    If the issue continues, email HR. Keep it very professional and polite.

    State that you had booked <whatever dates> as A/L, but as you were on a training course, you wish to have x number of days added back to your annual leave allowance.



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    #23
    Nicetrustedcup
    Registered Users Posts: 425 ✭✭Nicetrustedcup


    Can’t go in and just cancel one day at a time it’s block booking system basically a holiday system what was not designed as one,


    I have went to hr and they send me back to management and so on,


    I did make them aware I am going to the wrc over this and gos in one ear and out the other



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    #24
    gameoverdude
    Registered Users Posts: 6,317 ✭✭✭gameoverdude


    Don't go to the wrc, in my opinion...yet.

    Play the long game. I'm guessing your company talks about flexibility and such. Discuss with your manager about taking a day in lieu around Christmas/ new years.

    Being reasonable and looking like a team player(yada, yada, yada) will put them on the back foot. But stand your ground. It was your time off.

    A couple of questions, was this training known about prior to booking holidays and is it really essential?



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    #25
    Jim2007
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 10,305 Mod ✭✭✭✭Jim2007


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118206510#Comment_118206510

    You did not really answer the question, not it does not matter to me, but if you expect for this to be up held then you need to be able to say categorically that your boss told you that they were taking your training course time out of your holiday allowance, that it has been deducted and you have been offered no compensation for this.



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    #26
    Nicetrustedcup
    Registered Users Posts: 425 ✭✭Nicetrustedcup


    So update got 3 full days back from work ….


    as confirmed holidays booked before training, requested manager to cancel leave never replied , so hr added my days back



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    #27
    Pawwed Rig
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,385 CMod ✭✭✭✭Pawwed Rig


    Good outcome!!



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    #28
    Mrs OBumble
    Registered Users Posts: 25,975 ✭✭✭✭Mrs OBumble


    Excellent.

    I wouldn't worry about the exam time (unless it was like a full day) - you've won the major issue.



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    #29
    gameoverdude
    Registered Users Posts: 6,317 ✭✭✭gameoverdude


    Good stuff!



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    #30
    kennethsmyth
    Registered Users Posts: 1,188 ✭✭✭kennethsmyth


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118222432#Comment_118222432

    Why not 4 days?



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