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Climate Bolloxolgy.

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  • Registered Users Posts: 462 ✭✭Ish66


    Move to Poultry, Chickens don't fart.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,209 ✭✭✭Brussels Sprout


    Hi. It's not a case of one over the other. Fracking absolutely needs to be reduced (and ideally eliminated altogether) as well.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,987 ✭✭✭endainoz


    Agreed, whataboutery is better used for the loyalist lunatics on Twitter.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,115 ✭✭✭emaherx


    The word whataboutery should be banned from this thread, as largely it makes no sense, the original topic raised is about how different sectors carbon emissions are accounted and an unfair loading placed on agriculture. Simply saying it is whataboutary seems like lazy counter argument that is thrown around all too often. Ironic that its constant over use has become a deflection from the debate.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,234 ✭✭✭green daries




  • Registered Users Posts: 20,053 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    Get rid of cows and farm kangaroos. Leaner meat and less methane.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,462 ✭✭✭J.O. Farmer


    Good plan, the snowflakes will be too young to remember Skippy so no problem selling them kangaroo meat.

    If that fails sure some lad will take them to mix in with beef burgers instead of horse meat.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,901 ✭✭✭amacca


    agreed...whataboutery is very relevant in this debate. you cant blame farmer for this and tell them to change the way they do business and expect them not to say what about your multiple flights, massive construction projects, margin squeezing multinationals, companies producing pesticide resistant seeds that cant be saved so you can grow your own crops in perpetuity if you want to, trade deals that source food from areas where its less sustainably produced while squeezing already established domestic business that can produce it much greener, destructive carbon credit schemes, hyper processed muck controlled by a cadre very rich indivduals jetting round the world attending conferences attempting to control the food chain, importation of foods from here there and everywhere when the real answer is locally sourced foods at a price that leaves a margin for the primary producer......it should be nothing but repeated whataboutery because if this thing is going to be solved equitably its issues like those above that will have to be tackled rather than drive a group that are probably the solution into the ground.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,234 ✭✭✭green daries




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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,234 ✭✭✭green daries


    I nearly swallowed my tounge the other day when I heard John gibbons looking for planned personal austerity 😂😬. I laughed so hard if anyone saw me they would have rang the physc ward for me.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,729 ✭✭✭Birdnuts


    he gives me indigestion nearly as bad as when Eamon Ryan pops up on the Tele



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,234 ✭✭✭green daries


    😂👌A perfect description an irritating man who has made a lot of money off the back of agriculture as for eamo jasus he is some dose



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,764 ✭✭✭Dakota Dan


    Neither do cows except on the rare occasion, they belch.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]




  • Registered Users Posts: 20,053 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    Quoting Ryan, now there's an own-goal, congratulations.



  • Registered Users Posts: 461 ✭✭HerrKapitan




  • Registered Users Posts: 6,901 ✭✭✭amacca


    That to me doesn't necessarily say we should stop all beef production if that's what you think its saying. As I rewatch it....it seems to have included the process of slash and burn in the calculation of the carbon footprint of beef.....not much of that going on in ireland...its a complex topic and as good as the inanutshell videos are you couldnt hope to get all the nuance in a 10 minute video

    ruminants are part of a natural cycle....they are actually useful for the biodiversity of certain areas ....the video fails to address the potential negative consequences for the environment in the unlikely event everyone was to switch to a vegan diet....the answer doesnt lie in sudden dramatic shifts in diet but an incremental change...it also doesnt lie in zealous total eradication of something thats been in our diet for thousands of years and has existed in some form or other in that time...we have canine teeth for a reason (we are omnivores ffs)

    now over intensification/overproduction/waste and the primary producer being shafted to concentrate wealth and profits in the hands of a few.....that is a problem.....that would be my angle on the buy local thing.....cut the real driver of the problem out....or try to over time...farmers can work with nature if they are not driven to work against it and paid fairly for their produce....... but if you pay a guy poorly for his produce and force him to work against nature because of the system he is in then that is the real driver of most of the problems

    the video also fails fairly spectaculary in not mentioning that cropping means disturbing soil (tilling/ploughing etc which releases carbon - although there is a mention of the emissions for rice production) and lets assume everyone did move to a vegan or vegetarian diet do we really think there wouldnt be overproduction, more use of pesticides and huge release of carbon that way too, Id argue its potentially much more destructive idea than a mix of grass fed beef, poultry etc etc but paid for appropriately......the video did in fairness did speak about the energy density of food..but I would also wonder how much more crops we would need to produce an exclusively vegan diet for the worlds population given the foods wouldnt necessarily have the same energy density, that would surely bump up the amounts would would have to grow and the soil structure you would have to damage this releasing carbon etc etc


    it just doesn't sit right with me anyway...........I see much more beneficial behavioural changes that could and should be made to ameliorate climate change than attempting to make beef production a thing of the past but people dont want to hear about them.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,556 ✭✭✭roosterman71


    With fertiliser prices through the roof, and even the product itself getting scare, how is that going to impact all the veg/corn products that vegetarians and vegans rely on for sustenance? Grass will still grow though animal numbers will probably have to reduce.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,142 ✭✭✭✭wrangler


    When the civil servants get enough food scarcity, they might reconsider the cutbacks



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  • Registered Users Posts: 18,567 ✭✭✭✭_Brian


    It’s hard to plough a field with a pencil.


    these bureaucrats haven’t a clue about food security. Europe has fantastic food production capabilities and yet they are rolling it into an era of food scarcity.



  • Registered Users Posts: 849 ✭✭✭Easten


    I think your first paragraph sums up the Irish thinking, as in it's not me it's the bad Brazilians with their slash and burn. No mention of all the soya and Maize based feed products that we use that comes from those same ex-rainforest lands that btw are being slashed and burned by mainly European companies



  • Registered Users Posts: 32 matt.v


    Buying local is a pipe dream, good butchers are few and far between and one's that slaughter their own are even fewer.

    All in all a lot of it boils down to the underappreciation of food in our society. The only thing people look at on the pack of meat is €/kg, most wouldn't care about where or how it was produced. When people are like that producing quality animals alone won't cut it, you have to be selling on a high quantity of them too. Flash back to the start of covid when people were buying all around them and returning to cooking hearty, traditional meals, or the yellow vest riots in France over food cost inflation. Most of the time people just take a constant supply of nutritious food for granted. Its pointless for the top to lecture down to farmers about cutting herd numbers when the whole rest of the system is stacked against you.



  • Registered Users Posts: 849 ✭✭✭Easten


    Absolutely, it boils down to people talking out of both sides of their mouths

    Michael O Leary made an interesting comment last week during an interview, he said how Ryanair had offered the passengers the chance to offset the carbon used in the flight by making a voluntary "green" payment towards the carbon. Nobody took this up, people just wanted cheap flights.

    Same thing for food, they just want cheap and plentiful. They'll play lip service to the state of the Environment or global warming while chewing on a steak and ham sandwich in the over heated office but they will not pay a cent towards it.

    It'll take a lot more damage to the Environment before anything really gets done.



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,477 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    If we are really serious about the climate we should have a greenhouse gas level scale that every product a consumer can buy has imprinted on its packaging/sale tag.

    For example a T bone steak from Argentina in Tesco swords has x greenhouse gas generated to put it on the shelf.

    A T-bone steak from the local butcher, who sourced locally, has x/2 greenhouse gas generated to put it on the shelf.

    Same with cars, clothes, all other food, etc etc.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,142 ✭✭✭✭wrangler


    Everyone wants change but no one wants TO change



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    One taxi driver shares his experience after switching to an EV for his business




  • Registered Users Posts: 11,271 ✭✭✭✭Base price


    A great short video from Cammy/The Sheep Game - Just Keep Farming.

    https://fb.watch/9DIZIv9KCN/



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,204 ✭✭✭DBK1


    Hard to argue with anything he said. Probably one of the best summarisations of the whole debate really.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,021 ✭✭✭alps


    Had a look on the Opel site for info..


    You need to be staying in the city🤯




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