To Mask or not to two - Mask Megathread cont.

Just watching Donnelly on primetime. He was being questioned on the bizzare advice from the hse department on ventilation - AMRIC- that stated that hepa filters in school are not necessary. This is contray to advice from nphet, as well as a specialist group set up by goverment earlier in the year, as well as every scientist worth their salt.

My curiosity piqued at such a counterintuitive outlook. I became suspicious. There was at an all too familiar stench of incompetence about this. A quick google confirmed my worst fears. Guess who is the clinical lead of this AMRIC group? None other than our favourite saboteur in chief Professor Martin Cormican.

There seems to be no limits to the mans unchecked malfeasance.

This **** fool also sits on HIQA btw. No doubt he was as vehemently opposed to masking children as he was to the rest of the population before he got overruled.

Are goverment even aware of the damage this clown as done during the pandemic? Hes built his whole career on the merits of handwashing and seems to not even consider other forms of transmission. I wonder does he even accept the virus is airborne? It's like the acceptance of it might diminish his lifes work in his own eyes, so instead he continues to stubbornly trudge forward with outdated science and a defunct objective that's to the detriment of the entire country.

Martin Cormican is a dangerous idiot.

So Asian countries have been wearing masks since the fifties and then what? They super duper wear them when they’re feeling sick?

How can you tell they wear them when sick if they always wear them? Makes no sense.

Not only is Dr Colman a real pix 'n' mix spoofer he has totally under estimated the brillance of children.

This article of his is a follow up to his August column where he uggested that if masks were necessary, their introduction would not be ‘cost neutral’ for children’s emotional and social development.

Not only is his caution in both article's hypothetical he boxes in the counter that mask usage will have ‘no’ negative consequences as equally so. He fails to admit that their can be and will be a positive social and emotional development in children and adults alike from mask wearing.

What if this experience created a new profound level of connectedness/oneness that children did not loose after the masks dissapear, a new social and emotional understanding of ourselves, of the air we breath and share?

Face coverings in Primary schools

NPHET has recommended the wearing of face masks/coverings by children aged nine years and above on public transport, in retail and other indoor public settings as already required for children aged 13 years and over. They have also recommended that this is introduced for children in 3rd class and above in primary schools. They have advised that this measure is being introduced on a temporary basis and is subject to review in mid-February 2022.

Guidance on face masks/coverings in Primary schools

Wearing a face covering or mask does not negate the need to stay at home if symptomatic.

Wearing of face masks/coverings

Pupils from third class and up in primary schools are required to wear a face mask/covering. The exemptions to this are set out below.

Face masks/coverings

Face masks/coverings act as a barrier to help prevent respiratory droplets from travelling into the air and onto other people when the person wearing the face mask/covering coughs, sneezes, talks or raises their voice. Face masks/coverings are therefore intended to prevent transmission of the virus from the wearer (who may not know that they are infected) to those with whom they come into close contact.

Face masks/coverings must not contain any slogans/logos/images that may cause upset or be deemed offensive to any member of the school community.

Visors

Face masks/coverings are more effective than visors. In the limited circumstances where a face mask/covering cannot be worn clear visors must be considered.

Exemptions

A medical certificate to certify that a person falls into a category listed below must be provided to the school on behalf of, any person (pupil) who claims that they are covered by the exemptions below:

•  any pupil with difficulty breathing or other relevant medical conditions
•  any pupil who is unable to remove the cloth face-covering or visor without assistance
•  any pupil who has special needs and who may feel upset or very uncomfortable wearing the cloth face covering or visor, for example pupils with intellectual or developmental disabilities, mental health conditions, sensory concerns or tactile sensitivity.
• Schools will be best placed to identify those children whose complex needs are such that the wearing of face covering may not be possible for them, and to discuss this with parents as required. In such circumstances a school may not require medical certification to provide an exemption to the wearing of face coverings. In other circumstances where a medical certificate is not provided that person (staff or pupil) will be refused entry to the school.
• Directions for effective use of face masks/coverings

 Information should be provided by schools on the proper use, removal, and washing of face coverings. Advice on how to use face coverings properly can be found here.

•  All pupils should be reminded not to touch the face covering and to wash or sanitise their hands (using hand sanitiser) before putting on and after taking off the face covering.
•  Face masks/coverings should be stored in a designated space, for example, in an individually labelled container or bag.
•  Cloth face coverings should be washed after every day of use and/or before being used again, or if visibly soiled.
•  Face masks/coverings should not be worn if they are wet. A wet cloth face covering may make it difficult to breathe.
• Pupils using school transport
• Pupils from 3rd class and up on the primary transport scheme are required to wear face masks/coverings subject to the exemptions above.
• Mixed classes in single rooms
• Where there are mixed classes, e.g. 2nd and 3rd class in a single classroom, schools should note that only children in 3rd class and above, are required to wear face masks. As per previous advice, however, parents of other children who would prefer that their children wear a face mask are not precluded from doing this.
• Provision of face masks
• Parents should be advised that they obtain face masks for their children which fit properly and are comfortable for the child to wear. In the event that a child forgets, loses or damages their masks during the course of the school day, then the school should have a sufficient supply to replace the mask for the child in case a back-up face covering is needed during the day or where required on an ongoing basis.

Seriously?

Perhaps if the death rate were as high as initially predicted the weight of these measures could be justified. Realistically, we should be relieved that the severity of the pandemic hasn’t been as extreme as predicted -though the restrictive measures would have you believe the opposite.

Remember how the number of deaths were headline news and we had to flatten that curve (which is pretty much flat now) ….then it shifted to positive case numbers based on a test which can indicate positive for ‘fragments’ (post vaccination).

One things for sure & that’s the amount of fear & stress being generated is disproportionate to the threat, which will , in time lead to more problems.

I'm not sure how you came to that, but OK. They wear them for a number of reasons, mainly smog and when they feel sick. My point was that they wear them to protect others, but over here in Ireland there isn't a hope they would do that. That's why it's mandated for all. My point is also that if it happens for long enough, it becomes the norm but these crazy anti mask people prevent that. Over here, it's a massive government controlling conspiracy, in Asian countries its a civic duty to protect others. Just highlights the selfishness of a lot of people here in Ireland.

I'll keep listening to the medical experts. You do you.

Speaking of Asian countries wearing masks, I'm keeping my mask even after covid ends if it ever does.

I've always wanted to mask up on public transport before covid because of horrible smelling perfume which would make me sick. I never did because people will look at you all weird. But all that has changed now.

Many measures were implemented based on computer modelling. The computer modelling estimates, (such as Kings College) of death rate were far in excess of the actual rates over the prediction period.

So in the US- percentage of death overestimated with lockdowns was 95% That’s pretty huge!

For Sweden - estimated death toll without lockdown was 392% in excess of prediction!

Taiwan - overestimated by 937,020 % !!! with lockdown measures included.

Measures were introduced based on predictions. Even with lockdowns/masks/distancing ….. many modelling predictions such as Kings College were way off the mark. This is statistics not conspiracy 🙂

As for PCR tests- they were created as an aid for diagnosis (to include other information). False positives do arise, though they may be low. The test results are also influenced by the number of cycles performed. A test of high cycles would more likely yield more false positives though the patient may not be infectious. So, we see examples in the media of Rugby players / politicians (Eamon Ryan) testing positive … then getting a retest which is negative. So case numbers don’t equal the same number infected.

It’s all to easy to throw around labels.

Computer modelling of predicted deaths far exceeded actual deaths even with restrictions included. You can explore this by searching “The Failure of Imperial College Modeling Is Far Worse than We Knew” -American Institute for Economic Research.

And look up the WHO guidelines for PCR testing at your leisure (sorry I wasn’t allowed to post the links)

So it’s debatable whether restrictions based on wildly inaccurate predictions are warranted or indeed excessive.

It’s also a fact that reporting of case numbers became dominant over mortality numbers. Bigger numbers create more anxiety, whether intentional or not. The government and media have heightened anxiety rather than reduce it over the course of the pandemic to date. This is quite obviously happening through mixed messaging, sudden announcements and back peddling on advice.

Rather than put citizens at ease, the stress has been ramped up. It is clear that this pandemic is not as severe as predicted and that seasonal patterns play a role in up/down swings also.

So your comment that “the pandemic wasn’t as severe because of the restrictions” on a comparative basis with the statistics I’ve provided above , and at a generously conservative estimate, would indicate your opinion to be at least 95-100% inaccurate.

Great Post.

NPHETs models, including their so called "optimistic" ones has been consistently wildly off the mark. Yet we continue to use them to justify restricting civil liberties and shuttering businesses.

I dont understand how newspapers are still printing the rubbish they come up with like it's fact (other than frightening people is good clickbait).

Well on the bus or shop how can you tell who is sick and not? Unless you are relying on everyone to stay at home if unwell...

Has it been shown asymptomatic people don't spread covid? Pre-symptomatic people spread covid. So how do you tell the difference between someone infected who will never develop symptoms? And someone who will?

https://www.bmj.com/content/375/bmj.n2342

Well some masks do protect you, and there are indications even the blue surgical masks offer some protection \ reduction in viral load exposure. a Danish study showed less infections in people wearing masks than without, though the study size was small.

But the main reason you are asked to wear masks is to protect those around you, as a barrier, by containing respiratory droplets which may contain infectious virus particles. Studies have shown less cases where masks have been used - in arizona schools, bangladeshi villages, australian cities. Contact tracing studies have shown that infected people with masks in setting like airplanes, hairdressing salaons -did not infect other people.

Practically all businesses practice discrimination all the time. Discrimination by itself is not illegal.

If you're claiming they're practicing illegal discrimination, please identify which of the 9 specific legal grounds they are breaking.

Sounds like the OP has his mind made up and is looking for someone to back up his own 'legal' understanding

it's not discrimination as has been mentioned here so what you are quoting is nonsense