Paid cash in hand?

Brid Hegarty · 05-12-2021 5:28pm #1

So I did my first week of work last week with a new company as a bus driver for school kids. On Friday the owner paid me in the yard by taking taking out a big wad of cash and giving me €350 into my hand. I asked about there being a payslip and he said that if I wanted one to let him know. Said something about how he's not good with computers and that his some now does all that now that the accountant's gone. Having thought about it since I realised I should have also asked him if that was before or after tax! And what about showing my PRSI contributions.

05-12-2021 5:33pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058221315/paid-cash-in-hand

I'm guessing you didn't get a contract either. Did you agree €350 - is that the correct gross?

Simply put, you're not employed. You are being exploited in the black market economy. You'll have no pension / PRSI, SW entitlement. But, there should be a lot of jobs out there.

In particular you'll not qualify for PUP either if that comes back.

Brid Hegarty · 05-12-2021 5:40pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118272711#Comment_118272711

We agreed €300 but it ended up being €350 because he had me do some extra work. He'll have to find a way to fudge it when I ask him for a pay slip. So what's the best way for him to fudge it? Will he take money away from the €350 in my next payment?

JustJoe7240 · 05-12-2021 5:44pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118272711#Comment_118272711

Quite the assumptions you made based on what's posted. It's possible the OP is being paid in cash but is still being put through the books.

@Brid Hegarty Has your employer asked for your PPS number?

Brid Hegarty · 05-12-2021 5:47pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118272748#Comment_118272748

Yes. Wasn't in rush about it but yes. I don't know if I need the company number for Revenue purposes. But when I gave him my bank details he said something about how he hasn't been using that method because of changing banks or something.

Tell me how · 05-12-2021 5:48pm

Get a new job. This guy only intends paying you cash, some weeks it'll be 300, some weeks it might be more.

You seem to have avoided the question of whether or not there is a contract. I'd be very doubtful that everything is above board and you are on the insurance policy to drive a school bus. Did he ask you to provide proof of a valid/clean license for this work? Were you Garda vetted before starting work?

If you are involved in an incident in which kids are injured, you could be in a very tricky situation if everything isn't absolutely 100% in order.

Brid Hegarty · 05-12-2021 5:50pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118272764#Comment_118272764

I didn't get a contract. Forgot all about it to be honest. Yes I've been garda vetted, and have all necessary licenses so there's no issue there.

05-12-2021 5:52pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118272776#Comment_118272776

I’d push for a payslip. Find out who the accountant is and ask if it’s ok to contact them to arrange payslips to be emailed to you weekly.

05-12-2021 5:54pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118272748#Comment_118272748

Books? Payroll isn't done on books anymore, certainly not since it's now reported live directly to Revenue.

You're the one making assumptions. I'm literally taking the OPs words verbatim. Also, what gross payment would you need to be paid to get paid 350 net exactly? Give an example, use whatever assumptions you like. Or admit you haven't a scoobie what you are talking about.

happyoutscan · 05-12-2021 6:04pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118272795#Comment_118272795

You're as bad as each other.

OP check your revenue online under 'Manage my tax 2021'. If your employer is listed there (under 'Your jobs and pensions' , you can check what tax/PRSI etc contributions you have made.

The day of receiving payslips are gone as everything goes through Revenue anymore.

If there is nothing there on your Revenue, ask your employer when he is getting his bookkeeper/accountant to set you up as you wish to immediately look at your pension options etc (or anything else).

It is entirely possible that your employer just has not gotten around to it. I would not listen to those telling you to find another job until you at least find out what I've mentioned first.

Brid Hegarty · 05-12-2021 6:38pm

@[Deleted User] I'm guessing you didn't get a contract either.

Well I mean I wouldn't be too worried about that. In reality there has to be a lot of small companies that don't give contract to their staff. Right?

mrslancaster · 05-12-2021 6:47pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058221315/paid-cash-in-hand

You must know what rate of pay you agreed before you started the job so you can work out whether the cash you got is net after tax/prsi/usc. Nothing to stop a company paying in cash but most don't for practical or security reasons.

Employees are legally entitled to get a statement of wages (ie a payslip) showing the gross amount and itemised deductions for every payment received whether it's his son or whoever else processes the payroll and irrespective of him changing his bank account.

Edit: Employees are also entitled to get a written statement of core terms by day 5 and can request a Day 5 Statement. EE's are entitled to get a written statement of terms and conditions within 2 months.

05-12-2021 7:03pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118272827#Comment_118272827

Dear God.

YOU ARE ENTITLED BY LAW TO GET A PAYSLIP. It has nothing to do with the new filing with Revenue. You might be thinking of a P60.

OP, you also need to get a contract of employment. Everyone should get one.

Look up citizens advice. The problem with boards.ie everyone can hit keys on a keyboard.

SVI40 · 05-12-2021 7:26pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118272827#Comment_118272827

Pay slips are still a legal requirement. Revenue do not show deductions for health insurance, union fees, bike to work scheme, so may other deductions that may be made. Such a silly statement. SMH.

JustJoe7240 · 05-12-2021 8:19pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118272795#Comment_118272795

How pedantic, You know exactly what i was referring to.

Have no interest engaging, you seem like a very angry individual, Your use of capitals in this thread is embarrassing

Mrs OBumble · 05-12-2021 8:57pm

You don't need to get a contract until a few weeks (maybe 4) after you start).

Think of what you got as a cash advance.

Do ask for a payslip each week. Yes, his son will have to do it.

Also do ask for their number so you can register for tax. Yes his son will have to get it. Again - no problem.

koutoubia · 05-12-2021 9:21pm

I drive a bus that is mainly used for a school run. I dont have a contract and everything is above board wrt Revenue and insurance.

You may have all the required cards BUT if the school run is a contract from a state agency then your employer has to go through the Garda vetting precedure regardless of whether you supplied one yourself.

If not and he is not a big operator I woud have concerns about how the business is run.

Ask for a payslip that can be confirmed by revenue otherwise walk away as no doubt they are cutting corners and you dont wanna find out the hard way.

A half experienced bus driver will walk into a driving job in the morning.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118272764#Comment_118272764

doc22 · 05-12-2021 9:28pm

Maybe he's going to class you as self-employed and you'll have to sort out your own tax by the looks of it

rolling boh · 05-12-2021 9:54pm

You are asking for trouble working like this get something else with your licence that should be easy enough to find something that is above board .

listermint · 05-12-2021 10:06pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118272827#Comment_118272827

The day of receiving payslips is gone.... Lol. Absolute lollers.

05-12-2021 10:56pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118273711#Comment_118273711

Don't call people out that know more about the topic than spoofers. I am angry at people not knowing the basics and acting like they do, especially if they have attitudes. The OP has a lot of signs of not being legit. Round sum payments. Let them know if you want a payslip. It might regularise, but you'd expect the employer to be forthcoming on that 'will get it sorted' not IF you want it sorted.

You should get the basics of your contract within 5 days. This is essential, what are your working hours, rates of pay, breaks etc. These are basic protections.

Brid Hegarty · 05-12-2021 11:28pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118274211#Comment_118274211

Thanks. Well this is the only experience I have as a bus driver... with this company! It's not that big a company. Main bus company in my town though... 14 buses in total.

Do you get holidays pay (8%)? I haven't asked yet but I'm almost certain I won't be getting it. I was told by one of the other employees there that it's not standard in the industry to pay holidays pay!

05-12-2021 11:44pm

As an employee you are 100% entitled to holiday pay and bank holidays (that depends on a number of factors as to when and how much).

Min 20 days annual leave and 9 public holidays if an employee per year.

If you don't get holiday pay then they must be trying to treat you as self employed. BUT, he did mention the possibility of a payslip, which would lean towards employment expectation.

I would consider 14 buses as not a small operation.

There are a number of rules as to how employed and self employed are defined.

If he provides the bus, your insurance, dictates when and how you work and you can't arrange for someone to cover for you I'd suggest it likely you are employed.

koutoubia · 05-12-2021 11:55pm

Its very possible that you will be 'let go' during the school holidays hence no holiday pay which makes more it more important that you are paying tax so at least you can claim for the time you are off.

06-12-2021 10:07am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118275201#Comment_118275201

That's not how holiday pay works. If you work you accrue holiday pay entitlement for the time you work. It could be 8% (or higher, depends on the contract).

koutoubia · 06-12-2021 11:23am

The poster is getting paid cash into the hand. If no tax is being paid then its highly unlikely they will get holiday pay. I am giving them the information as to what could happen as they are doing a school run like myself and thats my experience unless the operator has enough work out of school term to keep them on.

mickdw · 06-12-2021 11:45am

Alot of responses here don't reflect the reality of working for a small privately run business. Yes, the law says you get payslip and holiday pay and you should have a contract but the reality is different.

This guy appears to have some cash income and he fancies having a driver working somewhat casually. It's happening all over. Driver will be told there is no more work at short notice if it suits the business.

He will be paid per shift worked. No more. No less. Probably won't work bank holidays but won't be paid for them either.

I'd advise going to work for bigger company.

06-12-2021 11:55am

the real worry is insurance to me. Who is responsible if the bus is crashed.

06-12-2021 12:04pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118276321#Comment_118276321

In the OP the employer mentioned a payslip if asked for. That suggests employment. It's not up to the person running the business to decide if the OP is an employee or self employed - payment in cash does not affect that decision. I've mentioned a few key tests above as to what constitutes 'for service' and 'of service' - here it is in more detail. See page 6

Going by what we know it would appear employment.

https://www.revenue.ie/en/self-assessment-and-self-employment/documents/code-of-practice-on-employment-status.pdf

06-12-2021 12:24pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118276453#Comment_118276453

I agree there is some cash/under the table work being done out there, but only when both parties agree. An example would cash businesses like plumbers and taxi drives. Less so when one party wants the relationship to be official. Most small businesses would not take on someone that should be an employee and risk it going wrong. The risks are too great. As has been mentioned in this case Insurance would be a major concern.

Brid Hegarty · 06-12-2021 12:44pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118276321#Comment_118276321

Are you getting the 8% holidays pay on what you work though?

Paid cash in hand?

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