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Santy get a boyfriend...

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Comments

  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,095 CMod ✭✭✭✭Ten of Swords


    @99nsr125. do not post in this thread again. Your argument amounts to counting the thanks of other posts to prove a point and abusive personal attacks on other users



  • Registered Users Posts: 521 ✭✭✭DontHitTheDitch


    It would help if you knew what you were talking about. St. Nicholas was a bishop and in the Netherlands, where the St. Nick tradition really blossomed, he was shown in bishop's robes, which were often red and white. Here he is:

    When the tradition moved to the US, he was portrayed as being dressed in red and white decades before Coca Cola started their marketing campaigns. How German Refugee Thomas Nast Invented How Santa Claus Looks Back During the Civil War - Long Island Wins

    I'm sure there were several gay saints and bishops, the point is none are recorded as such.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,793 ✭✭✭FunLover18



    The fact is you're picking and choosing what parts of the tradition suit you and your beliefs and calling it "canon". Saint Nicholas wasn't recorded as being gay but very little is known about the actual man and all we have is legend so I doubt if there are any records of him being straight either.

    All of which is besides the point because we're discussing Santa Claus who is not a bishop and is not intended to be a historically accurate depiction of one which would be impossible given what little we know. Santa rides a sleigh drawn by flying reindeer and delivers presents to all the children in the world in one night ffs. Whether he goes home to a man or woman had absolutely no impact on that.



  • Registered Users Posts: 521 ✭✭✭DontHitTheDitch


    Typical. Don't know what you are talking about but you regard your opinion as having greater value than millions of people over the generations. It's very 'in' to regard your opinion as superior to all prior generations, you're right on trend. The funny thing is we seem to have the only people who consider themselves cultural orphans while championing the traditions of people they have never met.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,108 ✭✭✭CGI_Livia_Soprano
    Holding tyrants to the fire




  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    from the word Babylon,

    The original derivation of the name Babel (also the Hebrew name for Babylon) is uncertain. The native, Akkadian name of the city was Bāb-ilim, meaning "gate of God". ... According to the Bible, the city received the name "Babel" from the Hebrew verb בָּלַ֥ל (bālal), meaning to jumble or to confuse.

    That's very appropriate.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,793 ✭✭✭FunLover18


    I'm not discussing the opinions of millions of people whom neither of us can ever meet (Convenient that you just assume they'd agree with you). I'm discussing your opinion which seems to be that Santa can't be gay because he's based on a saint whose sexuality you're assuming and whose wife has only existed in "canon" for 150 years or so. I wonder if in the 1800s there were people complaining about the sexualization of Saint Nick.



  • Registered Users Posts: 521 ✭✭✭DontHitTheDitch


    You really can't think outside your own preconceived ideas. It's not that millions of people over several generations 'agree' with me, Santa was never 'gay' until this ad. So a month or so. Just like he was never a virtuoso tap-dancer, a chess grand-master or a paragliding Welshman. This is not difficult territory, your post-hoc reasoning is getting in your way.

    His story has emerged from the purpose he serves, he's a jolly old man who magically gives gifts in the middle of the night to sleeping children. He's based on a legend associated with the real St. Nicholas. If there was an Ad with santa saying 'ho ho ho, Make America Great Again boys and girls, and remember, you can't change gender before Christmas Eve or you'll go on the naughty list' then the same people who are here gladly saying 'Santa can be whatever our imagination lets him be' would be frothing at the mouth.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,108 ✭✭✭CGI_Livia_Soprano
    Holding tyrants to the fire


    The only people “frothing at the mouth” are the posters who keep getting their knickers in a twist over Santy having a boyfriend in one ad. Apart from them the only reactions are “oh, right,” “that’s nice,” and “why does this bother some people so much? That’s a bit homophobic.”



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,108 ✭✭✭CGI_Livia_Soprano
    Holding tyrants to the fire


    Santa Claus tapdancing:

    https://youtu.be/WexNrjbg2tk

    Santa Claus playing chess:

    https://youtu.be/87uonFWlXEc

    Santa Claus paragliding:

    https://youtu.be/8QZyZFaPdOU

    He’s not real, lads, he’s a figure of folklore. There’s no Santa Claus canon except what we make up at any given moment. Get over it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 521 ✭✭✭DontHitTheDitch


    You've far too much time on your hands, so obviously you will now be able to find videos where Santa is a virtuoso tapdancer, a chess grand-master or a paragliding Welshman.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,277 ✭✭✭km991148


    I love it when the "You've too much time on your hands" (or its stablemate.. 'I don't have time for this') is brought up..



    You are on page 25 of a nonsense thread.. the concept of valuing time has ceased to exist for some lol



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I'm gay, you can call me whatever you want but I'm not backing this argument. For context:

    Cultural appropriation[1][2] is the inappropriate or unacknowledged adoption of an element or elements of one culture or identity by members of another culture or identity.[3][4][5] This can be controversial when members of a dominant culture appropriate from minority cultures.[6][1][7]

    According to critics of the practice, cultural appropriation differs from acculturationassimilation, or equal cultural exchange in that this appropriation is a form of colonialism. When cultural elements are copied from a minority culture by members of a dominant culture, and these elements are used outside of their original cultural context ─ sometimes even against the expressly stated wishes of members of the originating culture – the practice is often received negatively.[8][9][10][11][12]

    Cultural appropriation is considered harmful by various groups and individuals,[13] including Indigenous people working for cultural preservation,[14][15] those who advocate for collective intellectual property rights of the originating, minority cultures,[16][17][18][19] and those who have lived or are living under colonial rule.[1][20][21][19] Cultural appropriation can include exploitation of another culture's religious and cultural traditions, dance steps, fashion, symbols, language, and music.[22][23][24][25][26]

    Those who see this appropriation as exploitative state that cultural elements are lost or distorted when they are removed from their originating cultural contexts, and that such displays are disrespectful or even a form of desecration.[8][14][27][28] Cultural elements that may have deep meaning to the original culture may be reduced to "exotic" fashion or toys by those from the dominant culture.[8][9][29] Kjerstin Johnson has written that, when this is done, the imitator, "who does not experience that oppression is able to 'play', temporarily, an 'exotic' other, without experiencing any of the daily discriminations faced by other cultures".[29] The academic, musician and journalist Greg Tate argues that appropriation and the "fetishising" of cultures, in fact, alienates those whose culture is being appropriated.[30]

    The concept of cultural appropriation has also been heavily criticized.[31][32][33] Critics note that the concept is often misunderstood or misapplied by the general public, and that charges of "cultural appropriation" are at times misapplied to situations such as trying food from a different culture or learning about different cultures.[34][35] Others state that the act of cultural appropriation as it is usually defined does not meaningfully constitute social harm, or the term lacks conceptual coherence.[36][37] Additionally, the term can set arbitrary limits on intellectual freedom, artists' self-expression, reinforce group divisions, or promote a feeling of enmity or grievance rather than of liberation.

    You can argue that this is not cultural appropriation because it is not a minority culture being offended or oppressed, but that's like saying you can't be black and racist.

    Cultural appropriation can include exploitation of another culture's religious and cultural traditions, dance steps, fashion, symbols, language, and music....The academic, musician and journalist Greg Tate argues that appropriation and the "fetishising" of cultures, in fact, alienates those whose culture is being appropriated.


    He’s not real, lads, he’s a figure of folklore. There’s no Santa Claus canon except what we make up at any given moment. Get over it.

    Get over it. Santa is an institution derived from the legend of Saint Nicholas, a Christian symbol of humility and generosity, he served the poor and needy and did so as works of his Christian faith which included his tenure as Bishop of Myra. If you find people are upset then it's more than likely as a result of what is essentially cultural misappropriation of a sacred object which is particularly sensitive to a particular group or identity. Something the LGBT folk should have plenty of experience and understanding of.

    Additionally, the term can set arbitrary limits on intellectual freedom, artists' self-expression, reinforce group divisions, or promote a feeling of enmity or grievance rather than of liberation

    wouldn't expect anything less.



  • Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Such absolute rubbish.

    A fictional character had, a fictional wife, now that fictional character has a fictional boyfriend. In one advertisement. In a different country.

    The boss of the world hasn't stated that Santa is gay 🙄

    So what. I might send out Xmas cards this year showing Santa as a transsexual. What will happen? Nothing. Cos he is a fictional character that can be whatever I want him to be.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    So what. I might send out Xmas cards this year showing Santa as a transsexual. What will happen? Nothing. Cos he is a fictional character that can be whatever I want him to be.

    May all your Christmases be merry and gay 🎅



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,208 ✭✭✭✭B.A._Baracus


    People in this thread are vile.

    Because if you do anything short of jumping out of your chair, clapping your hands while screaming 'yaaaaaaay' to this gay Santa, then you are a "homephobe" - no ifs or buts. That's an absolute. An ignorant way of thinking. There's no grey or other shades. Nah, it's black or white.

    Some of yous see homephobes in your tea.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 829 ✭✭✭hognef


    For all of you who found the Santa ad so controversial, here's Posten Norge's 2019 Christmas ad: https://tv.kampanje.com/posten-med-ny-vri-pa-juleevangeliet

    It involves some other [traditional|fictional] characters. See what you think.

    Apologies if this was posted already; I'm not reading 25 pages of hysteria to check.



  • Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    It was posted before, But the homophobes have no issue with it!



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  • Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    It is vile, but only because some posters are so against men kissing that they make a big deal out of an advert!



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,793 ✭✭✭FunLover18


    Hahaha I can't believe you're the one accusing me of preconceived ideas! I'll repeat again, Santa wasn't married until 150 years ago, SIXTEEN HUNDRED years after the real St Nicholas died. That did not affect the purpose he serves nor does this ad.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,793 ✭✭✭FunLover18


    Are you seriously using the cultural appropriation line? With **** Santa? The man (who is fictional) is literally a mish mash of legends and cultures! Christmas is literally a pagan holiday appropriated by the Church. Honestly, I despair.

    To suggest that this is cultural appropriation is also to suggest that Santa is an integral part of heterosexual culture and identity which he's not.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,277 ✭✭✭km991148


    Nothing of the sort..


    If you need to avert your eyes (presumably because you are so disgusted), explicitly state that this is disgusting, refer to gay people as not normal, then you might be a homophobe. Not calling that out (all behaviour on this thread) or indeed playing it down (with your jumping out the chair in support comment..) could be considered vile.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,208 ✭✭✭✭B.A._Baracus


    Beautiful post.

    See ladies and gentlemen this is a text book after hours reply. Km gets back to me saying how I am wrong (fair enough, we all different opinions) but then closes it with my comment of jumping out of the chair actually being vile.

    As I said. If you do not support a gay Santa anything less than 100% you are wrong. At least according to certain users on here.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I'm ashamed to be gay right now. It's a shameful game of identity politics and I don't find it even remotely surprising when people really do have issues with LGBT culture because it seems to feed on division and subversion. Yes, it is cultural appropriation, it's a Christian holiday and a Christian festival and he is a character derived from Christian folklore. You want it to be about gay mens rights? Well, there ya go. Merry Christmas.



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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    The figure of Santa Claus has pretty much been viewed as non religious for decades. If anything he's a more capitalist figure at this stage. Like I'm guessing the average child doesn't associate him with Christianity. He may have been loosely based on a saint but at this stage, not remotely related to Christianity.


    On top of that, you're making an assumption that all branches of Christianity are homophobic. Eg the Lutheran church in Norway is unlikely to have an issue with the ad. They allow same sex marriages. Meanwhile, not a single poster can point to Norway having an issue with the ad.



    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-norway-gaymarriage-idUSKCN0X81EW



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,092 ✭✭✭Christy42



    Pretty sure Santa goes pretty heavily against Christian scripture. From where I sit I see Santa shilling out for a company. Seems a whole lot less moral to abuse a Christian saint's legacy to make money than to have a gay snog. Futurama has the futuristic Santa as a psychopathic murderer shooting at anyone he can with a rocket launcher. A lot of people are now also arguing it is not a Christian holiday and it is hard to argue with a large proportion of those celebrating it not being Christian especially in Norway which most recent surveys has more people not believing in a God than believing in one, not even a Christian God mind so Christians are definitely in a minority there.


    I am curious why showing a gay person is said to be identity politics but a straight person isn't. Honestly I don't see the difference. It isn't political anymore, it is the equivalent of showing a mixed race couple. Sure it might have been a thing when Kirk kissed Uhura but most people in western europe have moved on since. It was shown in Norway ffs, did they even notice it for all the division you talk about? I suspect most watched, thought nothing of it and moved on with their lives without the outrage. Not every gay kiss is about gay rights. Sometimes it is about two people wanting a snog.



  • Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    It was a pagan holiday first, so don't be ashamed, turns out the church culturally appropriated it first 😁



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,793 ✭✭✭FunLover18


    Why would you be ashamed? Santa Claus is in no way integral to my culture or identity as a straight man, I'm at a loss as to how he could be. Santa is represents generosity and goodwill (something some people on this thread could do well to remember), as I'll say for the billionth time his sexuality has no bearing on this whatsoever and therefore no sexuality has more claim over him than another. He's only been "canonically" straight for 150 out of 1750 years.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,005 ✭✭✭ebbsy


    Its just a ploy to turn people of different opinions against each other.

    Just like this thread.

    The fact that its been allowed to carry on for 25 pages says it all about AH.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,793 ✭✭✭FunLover18


    You never know, maybe in 150 years it will be canon 🙄



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,118 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    Part of the point KM made was that there were fairly vile homophobic posts in this thread and many many posters stayed completely and utterly silent in response. Its a fair point. Like many said a thing about LGBT people "poisoning humanity" and are lucky not to be strung up like in Russia.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,277 ✭✭✭km991148


    No. You misunderstood (probably with all the chair jumping lol)

    but seriously, let me clarify:


    There was explicit homophobia on this thread. That was really the vile stuff. Your comment seemed to trivialise this by effectively saying people were getting their knickers in a twist over nothing (or that by not applauding the advert, you are a homophobe. This isn't true you don't need to support it, but equally if you come out and say it's disgusting or that gay people are not normal, then I will call it out).

    I didn't say your point was vile, just that you are ready to down play.

    Do you think the examples I gave are acceptable? Would you also call out the actual homophobia instead? I'm sure someone can link the posts if it helps.

    Maybe some of the ladies and gentlemen?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,821 ✭✭✭✭cj maxx


    The vast majority of children grow up with a mum and dad. Even if they don't live together.

    While some have a dad and dad and some have mum and mum the vast majority have mum and dad. Thus a Mr & Mrs Claus isn't such a big deal for children to understand. The ad is very much aimed at a niche market. One which , at least from my own experience, is many years away.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,793 ✭✭✭FunLover18


    Love is love, children actually have no problem understanding that, that's the beauty of children, they are young and innocent and largely free of all the prejudices and hangups that adults can get bogged down in. The difference between a heterosexual and a homosexual couple is surface only.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,118 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    How is two men kissing a phenomenen thats many years away 🤣

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,092 ✭✭✭Christy42


    They have uncles, aunts, family friends etc. who themselves grew up a lot more open about it than previous generations. They have a friend with two male parents or whatever. A kids life is so much more than their parents.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,715 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    So all these years Santy the sly old dog was keeping it to himself he was into a bit of man on man action.

    MrsClaus won't be happy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,821 ✭✭✭✭cj maxx


    I meant the children not believing in Santa, not same sex couples.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,108 ✭✭✭CGI_Livia_Soprano
    Holding tyrants to the fire


    I’d say that there are a lot of angry, middle-aged, stale, pale, and male boards.ie readers retiring to bed tonight half-cut, quivering in a sweaty rage at the idea of Santy relaxing with a glass of hot milk and sucking another man’s dick after a long night’s delivering presents.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,338 ✭✭✭✭Potential-Monke


    Surely the other lad would suck Santa off, and not expect him to do even more work after a couple of nights of delivering presents? If not, he should head back to Mrs. Claus, she wouldn't have expected any cunnilingus after Xmas night.



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