Rose Of Tralee now accepting trans applicants (Threadbanned List in OP)

Exactly! Just like on this thread!

Is sexual attraction relevant in the rose? Is it about beauty or perving over young* (and now older married) girls?

Apparently according to some here the only point of the ROT is about having a display for heterosexual males to drool over.

On the one hand they claim the whole point of it all is about sexual attraction. On the other they claim its irrelevant. It really does show up the arguments here for what they are. Ridiculous incoherent drivel.

It's all very confusing really. I guess that's what happens when you outsource your opinions entirely to outrage rags and twitter.

"fervent activists" who are fervent about whatever it is they are fervent about shout discrimination about everything. Including men's rights activists, lesbian separatists, racial supremacists, religious zealots etc etc. It is all dangerous. But not as dangerous as trying to claim these "fervent activists" (who may exist only in the fevered fervent imaginations of a few equally but opposing view fervent activists) represent the entirety of a group of people.

Fervent activists claim fervent activists of group they dislike are being fervently active.

Funny how the BBC, hardly a hotbed of anti modern social outlooks, would run a story like this then?

There is some really fooked up thinking out there now.

And no I am not talking about trans people wanting to live as a different gender, but trans people demanding that they be treated the same as people born to their desired gender.

Trans people can live as whatever gender they want, whatever makes them happy, but they simply aren't the same no matter how many contortions some try and introduce into the debate.

Hell you had one of our resident modern right on thinkers earlier in the thread say a woman is a woman or something to the same degree.

Facts are facts, adding breasts, taking female hormones, removing a penis does not make someone the exact same as a born XX chromosome female.

Likewise taking male hormones, removing breasts, adding a penis does not turn someone into the same as a born XY chromosome male.

This trying to rewrite science, anatomy, physiology is evident in a few areas, all to make certain people feel included.

It has been very obvious in womens sport where a long time high profile lesbian athlete was hounded out of her position because she stated the scientifically proven facts that transwomen born and raised as males would be physically superior to born and raised females.

As for the Rose of Tralee, I am surprised it has lasted this long.

Yeah you're right fervent activists against everything trans always shout fervently

Hahaha @ the BBC being claimed as a hotbed of liberals supporting trans rights. Yeah no. More drivel.

That original article had to be edited because it quoted a rapist who also made violent threats to lynch trans women.

The BBC now has a reputation for its transphobia

https://www.starobserver.com.au/news/bbcs-lgbt-staff-are-quitting-over-transphobic-work-environment/206961

When The Guardian - who infamously edited Judith Butler to remove where she discussed links between (fervent activists) on the Gender Critical side of the issue with the Far-Right after it was published, and published an article on the murder of Sarah Everard where the author shoehorned in unsubstantiated claims that trans women pose a danger to cis women is highlighting transphobia in the BBC you know it's bad.

Besides.. motivated by persuasion and debate... what nonsense. Gay rights should never have been a debate. Trans people usually start one rung lower where their very existence is a debate (as has been shown many times on this thread).

Why?

I just love when people try and tell me my lived experience as a gay rights activist since 1981 here in Ireland and in the UK was something completely different to how it actually was while using the very same language homophobes used against us then to attack transgender people now.

I know who stood alongside us. And I know who called us abominations and bullies. I hear the same words being used against my allies by people who were always my enemies but now like to pretend they were there with us all along.

I was one of the motley crew of butch dykes, twinks, drag queens, transgender women and men, Leathermen, Rubber Queens, Greenham Lesbians who were beaten, battered - and for thousands of us left to die alone during the AIDS crises, legally excluded by Ireland's criminalisation of homosexuality and the UK's Section 28. The people who shouted, protested, argued, and absolutely refused to stay quiet in the closet.

We cheered the dykes who invaded the BBC . We were arrested and beaten by the police and Gardaí. We sent gay men and lesbians to NY to protest over the exclusion from the Patricks Day parade - and they were arrested. We protested the suspended sentences handed down to the murderers of Declan Flynn. We funded taking the Republic of Ireland to the European Court of Human Rights.

I am one of the It's A Sin generation and I was there.

Our equality wasn't won by having a reasoned discussion with facts and debate - it was won with the blood, sweat, tears, deaths from AIDS, murder, and suicide of the people who refused to act as something they were not.

And alongside us all the way were our Trans sisters and brothers. While the passing straight acting "respectable" folk told us to stop rocking the boat and be nice little unthreatening gays good for a shut that door are you being served ooh err missus carry on camping night at the forum titter on the telly.

Get away with your pathetic attempt to re-write history.

You don't have the right to deny my lived experience of being queer bashed, spat on while with my young son, bailing friends out of jail after the police decided to get violent at peaceful protests, being called an abomination by family members, being told by the Chief Rabbi at the Holocaust Memorial in Whitehall that the "queers deserved it", holding the hands of young men I don't know so they don't die alone - all to suit your ideological agenda.

I know who the bullies are here.

It's those who steal other people's history to justify their vitriol.

It's those who dislike who we are so try and force us to live as who we are not.

Gosh, another "homosexual" - a term most gay people haven't applied to themselves in decades. Next you will be telling me you are an "Invert".

And apparently you don't believe in gender unless someone claims they are not the gender you think they are.

I am not "framing" anything - I am saying you are talking complete and utter bovine manure when you state equality was achieved by debate and facts. You, on the other hand, are so busy framing you should get a job in the national gallery.

Nowhere did I claim all "homosexuals" do or do not support anything or anyone. Only the fervently active are delusional enough to believe they speak for an entire community.

In fact I stated the opposite - I made it very clear that even during the fight for decriminalization (never mind equality) there were many "homosexuals" who wanted us noisy rabble to shut up and go away. Just like there were a few "homosexuals" who were absolutely against Marriage Equality.

The difference between us is I was there during the time you claim we were all having lovely chats about "please Sir, can you please stop persecuting us if we promise to be nice homosexuals?" and you patiently were not. And you got called out on your pathetic attempt to re-write history to suit your agenda.

And I know a lot of gender critical people - funnily enough none of them were around during the actual fight for rights either. And like you they get mighty defensive when those who personed the metaphorical barricades point that fact out. Like you they like to bang on about what they insist is the history but when called out by actual participants try and dismiss this living testimony.