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Covid 19 Part XXXV-956,720 ROI (5,952 deaths) 452,946 NI (3,002 deaths) (08/01) Read OP

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    #35822
    prunudo
    Registered Users Posts: 7,455 ✭✭✭prunudo


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118390963#Comment_118390963

    The old apologetic non apology that the public/civil service love so much.



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    #35823
    cuttingtimber22
    Registered Users Posts: 1,325 ✭✭✭cuttingtimber22


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118390963#Comment_118390963

    To be honest there is an element of “keep digging” in his qualifying remarks particularly in terms of availability of PCR tests. This was a case where the politicians who were following the people rightfully overruled NPHET.



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    #35824
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 4,727 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I see lots of people say society will crumble etc etc. It's already crumbled the last 2 years for lots of people losing their jobs and business etc.

    You're doing well if you're only potentially impacted a bit now.



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    #35825
    iwasliedto
    Registered Users Posts: 93 ✭✭iwasliedto


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118390366#Comment_118390366

    I think it is English hospitals not UK ones but your point still stands.



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    #35826
    bucketybuck
    Registered Users Posts: 18,485 ✭✭✭✭bucketybuck


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118390977#Comment_118390977

    No, the context has not changed.

    Testing and identification of cases was always vital in a pandemic and NPHET actively discouraged the use of a tool that could have made a real difference. They then continued to discourage it for nearly a year.

    Your reasoning now is the same faulty reasoning that they had back then, and the same ignorance of the strengths and weaknesses of antigen testing.

    You are a poster on the internet so it doesn't matter much, but the government public health advisors showing such ignorance is rather more unforgivable.



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    #35827
    Father Hernandez
    Registered Users Posts: 11,253 ✭✭✭✭Father Hernandez


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118390874#Comment_118390874

    I'd argue it was a very thought out comment given you have to write it out and post to Twitter in the public domain. Below for reference that hasn't been deleted. He only responded to the criticism as he was massively criticized and called out by actual experts in their field.

    People still to do this day might have skepticism on using them (certainly in my family) due to NPHET continually refusing to use them. Even now, it's unclear why they are being used when they were ignored for so long.

    Nolan's tweet is the epitome of the appalling communications we've had from Gov and NPHET throughout the pandemic, one talking over the other, zero leadership and ultimately a factor why the country is such a shítshow at the moment.


    https://twitter.com/PhilipNolan_MU/status/1391095650750709769?s=20




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    #35828
    fits
    Registered Users Posts: 13,512 ✭✭✭✭fits


    The context has completely changed! We are maxed out on testing capacity and have never before seen levels of infection and a variant that is less dangerous. How is that the same? Lots of captain hindsight’s on here.



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    #35829
    FishOnABike
    Registered Users Posts: 4,477 ✭✭✭FishOnABike




    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118387886#Comment_118387886

    If they get a PCR test I guess that could allow a CoViD-19 Recovery Certificate as before. I think a recovery certificate was valid for 180 days.

    It might be needed for someone to extend their vaccination certificate until they have waited long enough post infection to get a booster.

    It might also be important for someone who has recovered and might otherwise need a negative PCR test in the near future for travel, work or other purposes.



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    #35830
    bucketybuck
    Registered Users Posts: 18,485 ✭✭✭✭bucketybuck


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118391038#Comment_118391038

    Its not hindsight if you said it at the time.

    Which we did.

    NPHET were dangerously wrong on this, just as they were with the nursing homes. People should remember things like that when bowing to the "experts".



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    #35831
    fits
    Registered Users Posts: 13,512 ✭✭✭✭fits


    I don’t think I’d bother getting a pcr test at the moment if positive on antigens. Had my booster so I don’t think it would make much difference.



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    #35832
    Bananaleaf
    Registered Users Posts: 2,921 ✭✭✭Bananaleaf


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118388977#Comment_118388977

    Apologies - I thought you were being argumentative. There can be quite a lot of that around here so I must see it, even when it's not there. Again, I apologise.

    I am going to get my booster this Saturday. I haven't been socialising in almost 2 years now. Myself and the OH have busy lives, most of which has always revolved around things that are naturally self-isolating!! - working to pay the bills, taking care of our dogs and we both practice sports that lend themselves to the outdoors (cycling and running) so Covid hasn't really impacted on us socially. I only say this to give context to the bit above in bold - we haven't made martyrs out of ourselves, that is just the stage of our lives we are in. If Covid had happened 10 years ago, it would be a very different situation for us. I think this is just as much a factor in people's opinions on lockdowns as whether or not they are in the public or private sector is.

    When I return to work (secondary school teacher), this is where I will be most at risk of catching Covid. I appreciate that Omicron might be milder than Delta, but I would still rather not get it tbh. In the same way that I would rather not get a cold. The talk of how inevitable catching Covid is right now bothers me. I understand that any of us who are not working from home are in the same boat, I don't think I'm special or unique.

    So anyway, I am going for the booster as soon as I can - I would prefer to be returning to the classroom fully boostered up. Interestingly, all booster appointments for today, tomorrow and Monday in Punchestown are gone, but wild availability on Saturday and Sunday. People don't want to get vaccinated at the weekends, presumably when they are off work already!



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    #35833
    fits
    Registered Users Posts: 13,512 ✭✭✭✭fits


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118391049#Comment_118391049

    Who’s we?



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    #35834
    MerlinSouthDub
    Registered Users Posts: 1,615 ✭✭✭MerlinSouthDub


    Signs of a stabilisation in Denmark. Cases down from 23000 to 20000 with a higher number of tests. Test positivity down from 12% to 10%. A good country to watch because they have huge test capacity. Hopefully the trend continues over the next few days.

    https://www.sst.dk/en/english/corona-eng/status-of-the-epidemic/covid-19-updates-statistics-and-charts



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    #35835
    bucketybuck
    Registered Users Posts: 18,485 ✭✭✭✭bucketybuck


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118391046#Comment_118391046

    We are now seeing repeated stories of people catching covid for a 2nd time within a matter of months.

    Which makes the already useless covid certs even more useless and unnecessary.

    Every logical fact about omicron renders covid certs completely irrelevant from the standpoint of infection control, they should immediately be discontinued.

    So people should question why they aren't and won't be discontinued.



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    #35836
    iamwhoiam
    Registered Users Posts: 16,138 ✭✭✭✭iamwhoiam


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118391038#Comment_118391038

    so at what stage of the game did Prof Nolan decide that the snake oil antigen were now ok to use ?



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    #35837
    bucketybuck
    Registered Users Posts: 18,485 ✭✭✭✭bucketybuck


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118391063#Comment_118391063

    The people on here that you just called "captain hindsight". Myself for one, feel free to search my posts.

    Do you recall, a few minutes ago when you said "Lots of captain hindsight’s on here".



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    #35838
    Stheno
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 51,688 Mod ✭✭✭✭Stheno


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118391058#Comment_118391058

    Same here. If I got a positive antigen I'd do a second and if that was positive I'd just isolate.

    My OH had two positives so we took that approach but he needed the PCR for work purposes



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    #35839
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 8,647 ✭ [Deleted User]


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118391014#Comment_118391014

    I think it reasonable to say, society won't collapse. Going on that positivity rate.... electives, some chemotherapy/ radiation etc. will all be stopped in short to medium term. Not due to risk of covid but due to health worker's being off sick/ self isolating. There will be excess death from the omicron wave but it won't come from covid deaths, it will be due to health worker's being out.



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    #35840
    Doctor Jimbob
    Registered Users Posts: 7,643 ✭✭✭Doctor Jimbob


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118390963#Comment_118390963

    He didn’t apologise or retract it though. In fact he doubled down and claimed he was right despite the criticism.



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    #35841
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 8,647 ✭ [Deleted User]


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118390698#Comment_118390698

    The point was a lot of people who are willingly unvaccinated don't seem the most well informed/ mentally stable or really have any idea what they were anti about.


    The use of the vaccines has always been about risk reduction, not elimination.



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    #35842
    cuttingtimber22
    Registered Users Posts: 1,325 ✭✭✭cuttingtimber22


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118391049#Comment_118391049

    You are absolutely right and without that policy change we would not have had the supplies of antigen test that we have had in the last 6/8 weeks. I was picking a few up when shopping in Dunnes and they came in very handy. Also useful to recall that antigens are only sent out by the HSE when identified as a close contact and we can see where that is going now as regards availability of PCRs and delays in contacting people.



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    #35843
    DeanAustin
    Registered Users Posts: 3,821 ✭✭✭DeanAustin


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118391139#Comment_118391139

    Ah it was a bloody stupid statement. NPHET have been proven badly wrong on antigen tests - I know I'm coming out of a week long isolation tomorrow because of antigen tests. I took one last week and was positive so knew there was a good chance I'd had Covid. I'm usually stubborn around sickness so I'd probably have put it down to a cold otherwise and gone around willfully ignorant that I had Covid.


    I do think he gets beaten round the head too often with that comment on here but when you say something so quotable and are completely wrong, I guess you have to expect it.



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    #35844
    Apothic_Red
    Registered Users Posts: 554 ✭✭✭Apothic_Red


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118390819#Comment_118390819

    On the back of that mention of Denmark I checked todays data

    denmark 3.PNG

    So no jump in ICU which is encouraging.

    Amazing how similar our figures are.



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    #35845
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 533 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    We were slow to introduce antigen tests, initially very slow to introduce masks even though there was very little public issue with them and we we went into a mantra of "schools are a controlled environment" "schools are safe" while doing absolutely nothing to make that so - no investment went in to filtration or ventilation.

    Other countries have been mandating FFP2 masks, especially in public transportation and tight spaces, we only got around to doing that in healthcare very recently, despite months and months or evidence that it was extremely useful.

    We also still have very confused messaging about what is established fact - it is airborne. The advice keeps fixating around washing hands and surfaces to the point I'm actually wondering are they trying to deliberately infect people. They can't be that thick, can they?

    We could have also probably helped keep hospitality open by ensuring excellent ventilation was in place. I'd rather see it a bit drafty than closed. Why weren't we lashing in large extractor fans into pub windows and so on? We used to have them to deal with smoke 20+ years ago.

    Although, I suppose when you consider the track record in some hospitals on containing MSRA and C Dif outbreaks etc, why are we surprised?

    My observation is it's often the public being ahead of the curve eg buying antigen tests before they were recommended and parents investing in filters for schools etc that has been the driver for policies on these things. NPHET dragged their feet on all of those.



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    #35846
    Apothic_Red
    Registered Users Posts: 554 ✭✭✭Apothic_Red


    Deaths in the UK continue to reduce

    https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/details/deaths

    This is all weird but encouraging



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    #35847
    Stheno
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 51,688 Mod ✭✭✭✭Stheno


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118391201#Comment_118391201

    Yep it's astonishing how the figures track so closely bar the number of tests

    Feeds into the line of thinking that the amount of positives we are seeing is a much "truer" figure due to people testing after a positive antigen



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    #35848
    Lucas Hood
    Registered Users Posts: 7,205 ✭✭✭Lucas Hood


    It’s amazing how can Denmark manage 400/500k tests a day across both pcr and antigen.



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    #35849
    Father Hernandez
    Registered Users Posts: 11,253 ✭✭✭✭Father Hernandez


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118391173#Comment_118391173

    Sorry to hear @DeanAustin, I was the same as you. Took antigen on Christmas Eve actually feeling fine, tested positive and cancelled all plans. Would have been in contact with a lot of people otherwise and who knows how many people would've been infected.

    My opinion on Nolan is that it was a dangerous comment that undermined the use of them at the time and caused major mistrust in antigen tests. Once you do that, it's very hard for the general public to get that trust back.

    Other countries have been using them for a much longer time, the UK get them for free. Here we pay €30 for a box of 5 in some places which isn't sustainable. NPHET were originally against the use of masks, then antigen tests, what's next? They've gotten obvious things wrong plus their forecast models scenarios have been comically bad/wrong, why should we continue to trust these 'experts'?



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    #35850
    Stheno
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 51,688 Mod ✭✭✭✭Stheno


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118391222#Comment_118391222

    Are those antigens at home tests that people report or official tests?



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    #35851
    corkie
    Registered Users Posts: 7,487 ✭✭✭corkie


    Experts warn PCR testing system 'maxed-out'

    Infectious diseases expert Dr Eoghan de Barra has called on the Government to make a decision now about using antigen tests as a means of identifying Covid cases, as PCR testing capacity has been overwhelmed.

    The curve needed to be flattened and self-isolation was necessary for anyone who has had a positive antigen test or was experiencing symptoms. Making changes in the length of time for self-isolation would be a call for Government and was necessary to stop numbers rising, he said.

    “The Government was elected to make these tough decisions,” he told RTÉ radio’s News at One.

    Something people reading the forums here know since before Xmas.



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