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Schools to close again.. Covid

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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 840 ✭✭✭teachinggal123


    I’m not going to be lectured by you (or anyone else on this thread) about what I can/can’t post here.

    If you have any issue with my posts you can report me. Until then, I’ll post as often as I want (and stay within forum rules of course).

    Edit: thanks for the idea of starting a whole new thread about parents & teachers experience of teaching online! I might actually do that :)



  • Registered Users Posts: 17 Aleppo_rex




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,481 ✭✭✭lulublue22


    Please do - it will allow you to share your experiences with like minded people , provide a valuable platform for assessing how shite educational provision was during school closures while freeing this thread up to discuss the current issues at hand - the potential impact of omicron on the functioning of schools. Win win for everyone.



  • Registered Users Posts: 299 ✭✭Five Eighth


    It's true that hospital numbers are rising but...I would like to delve deeper into the headline stat.

    Any answers anywhere to the following:

    How many of those in hospital with Covid are unvaccinated?

    How many are in hospital only because of Covid?

    How many have underlying health conditions?

    What is the age profile of those in hospital with Covid?

    How many were admitted to hospital for reasons other than Covid and then contracted the virus in hospital?

    Also, ICU numbers seen fairly static.

    We must as a society start living with Covid. What is the point of nationwide multiple vaccinations if our response to every Covid wave is to revert to lockdown?

    What is the trade-off between the benefits of closing schools and colleges and the drawbacks to society (most importantly the psychological/emotional/developmental/mental health etc. of children and young adults)?

    Schools and colleges must stay open.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,398 ✭✭✭am_zarathustra


    If ICU rates stay stable it's brilliant news, bodes well for the next few months. I'm just not sure schools will have the staff needed to open this Thursday, I know we will struggle and rolling closures or random classes being sent home is not ideal either. The following week we might be ok, people are being more cautious, the situation should improve even without school closures provided everyone stays the course for the next few weeks/months.

    Staffing is just going to be a recurring issue, we were only beginning to see it in December and that's with s and s still available, I've no idea how we get to March! I mean we will, we will muddle on as always but having kids back in a classroom less than 14 days from Christmas day just seems like an unnecessary extra gamble when it would cost 2 days at Easter to close for the extra couple of days needed for an infection break



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,481 ✭✭✭lulublue22





  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,011 ✭✭✭Random sample


    The government could be using this time to sort out sending out antigen tests to all students so they can test weekly/ twice weekly for the next few weeks.


    When will schools know if they have enough staff? Principals are unlikely to o contact teachers before Thursday to find out who’s isolating/restricting so won’t feasibly know their own situation until Thursday morning.

    Post edited by Random sample on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,276 ✭✭✭combat14


    exactly will be very difficult situation in many schools on thursday e.g. the gardai are reporting 18+% absence of their staff, firestations missing 15% - more than likely many schools will face a similar situation - parents will only have dropped their kids and will have to come back and collect them again!! crazy stuff..


    add to that the high risk of spreading covid further given the pcr testing systems almost complete collapse - it is madness to open schools at present



  • Registered Users Posts: 110 ✭✭timmymagoo


    How can there be such high numbers of public sector workers out missing

    The math don't add up

    By that logic come Tuesday 15 % of all private sector employees will be missing

    Sometimes you just have to laugh.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 378 ✭✭brookers


    Are you sure this is a real teacher, could be a poster trying to wind up teachers, Covid bringing out all kinds of trolls.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,513 ✭✭✭KildareP


    Because gardai, fire service and many other public sector roles are public facing and can't work from home like many in the private sector can. By all accounts retail and hospitality are facing similiar, increasing absenteeism.



  • Registered Users Posts: 110 ✭✭timmymagoo


    Lets see what the retail absences are like, the real front line



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,398 ✭✭✭am_zarathustra


    Multiple restaurants/takeaways closed around me due to covid cases. These are private businesses. This isn't just the public service they just happen to be front facing so it's more obvious. You don't go looking for a guard or nurse if your grand, grabbing a pizza is different.

    I would also point out that they are working in high risk environments for catching Covid where avoiding risk may be difficult. Most of the staff in my place wohld be able to teach online or do a good bit of their jobs with Covid but they can't exactly rock up to the school while positive. Almost all my family and friends who have undergrads or more are working from home.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,382 ✭✭✭✭rainbowtrout


    Ah, your nose might have been peeking out of your mask up to now, but the whole mask has slipped now. 'The real front line', give me strength.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 48,256 ✭✭✭✭km79


    I would be fairly certain you are right .

    A long timer on my ignore list but the new site has messed that up



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,411 ✭✭✭Icyseanfitz


    SNAs are not insured to supervise classes without a teacher present.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,653 ✭✭✭Wildly Boaring


    In construction going off our current info we're planning 25% to 33% absences this week.

    Now we do have a lot of travelling and all the extra difficulties.

    Several suppliers were in contact over break to stay they'll have delivery issues.


    BBC reporting 25% absences projected




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,398 ✭✭✭am_zarathustra


    I think they can at the moment because of the discretionary COVID hours schools can use. That would be secondary not primary though, I wouldnt know the situation there.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,921 ✭✭✭Bananaleaf


    There are posters claiming to be teachers who definitely are not. I'd bet my house on it.

    Schools have ended up very short-staffed on account of close contact isolations and they have and may continue to have to enlist the support of graduates from other fields to help out with S&S, but even the most desperate of principals would cover a class themselves before letting someone with a reading age of 'Facebook' within 10metres of their students, never mind 2.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,411 ✭✭✭Icyseanfitz


    I work as an SNA in post primary and no we are not allowed to supervise a class alone (of course doesn't mean it's not happening where management are chancing their arm), covid hasn't changed this, It's not in our role, we aren't insured to do it and would be liable if anything happened in the class.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 110 ✭✭timmymagoo


    All being equal the same numbers pro rata should be out across-the-board

    If schools do close then other offices and factories and retail centres should close , not all but some

    Let's see how this week plays out,



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,276 ✭✭✭combat14


    yes lets see how it plays out, peoples health is just a game - why not send all the office workers back to the office too and see what happens 😀



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,398 ✭✭✭am_zarathustra


    Your actually right I'd say, I'm confusing keeping things on the road and what should be happening or is legally covered.......a symptom of the times I suppose. But yeah, it's definitely happening in a lot of post primary schools I know. Frankly the SNAs would have good behavioral management, better than most dips or random grads for sure!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,398 ✭✭✭am_zarathustra





  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,481 ✭✭✭lulublue22


    Our school community managed ok up till Dec since then covid has really hit our place - we now have outbreaks in a number of classes which dominoed over xmas with the inevitable knock on effect on staff - that’s only the cases we know about.

    Testing is reaching capacity with a positivity rate in and around 49 % of swabs taken. how you fail to see that that has real time impacts on staffing across the economy is incredulous. It is one of the reasons that rules around isolating of close contacts is changing and why they are talking about derogations from close contact guidance for certain workers.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,398 ✭✭✭am_zarathustra


    All things being equal makes so sense in the context of an airborne virus. I'm more likely to catch something in a room with 50 people than a room with 10. Very unlikely if I'm working from home!

    I know of hairdressers, restaurants, takeaways, hotels ect that have had to already closed. Plenty of announcements on Facebook ect

    https://www.echolive.ie/corknews/arid-40774479.html

    I don't want the schools to close or even be delayed in coming back but the last time we gambled and went for the "sure let's see" appoach we ended up in lockdown for almost 2 months. For a sake of a few days that seems foolish. Waiting til Tuesday is sensible, see if the ICUs hold but coming back for those 2 days just seems pointless given what could be gained by not.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,411 ✭✭✭Icyseanfitz


    Lines are blurry with SNAs covid or not 🤷‍♂️ the lack of minimum qualifications and a department of education who can't seem to make their mind up as to what our actual role is on a year to year basis doesn't help anything. Sure it's only a year and a half ago where they tried to redeploy us to be medical assistants 🤣



  • Registered Users Posts: 110 ✭✭timmymagoo


    What don't you get

    If they do not open Thursday they will not open for at least a month probably much longer

    If that happens so be it, the reality is I will be pissed off but I will get over it and I wish all teachers well on here.

    If they do close I personally will tell my boys they are on holidays there will be no seesaw or any other bill sh1t pretence

    I am not going through that complete joke of home schooling again

    But either way I will pop off now

    Ciao



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,622 ✭✭✭Treppen




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,622 ✭✭✭Treppen





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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,276 ✭✭✭combat14


    uk are advising employers to expect up to 25% absences over next while

    meanwhile we still await update on further muddying of covid isolation waters -

    Government to consider easing some self-isolation rules - Ryan

    https://www.rte.ie/news/2022/0102/1269520-covid19-schools-hospitals/



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,786 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    It’s a good idea, however employers will have to understand that employees won’t be in work as expected (regardless of if the parents have covid or not) as they are home schooling their children.



  • Site Banned Posts: 2,799 ✭✭✭Bobtheman


    It's up in the air and the situation could reverse pretty quickly. They should make a definite call tomorrow. I have no idea why we have to wait until Tuesday. If there is a delayed opening it wont be over a week.

    I was convinced of a delayed opening but the wind is now shifting



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,262 ✭✭✭Grueller


    Both Ulsyer Bank branches local to me were closed due to lack of availability of staff last Friday. Their cleaning crews couldn't even reach all the premises they were meant to, due to lack of cleaning staff and multiple sites nationwide being shut due to covid.

    I'll probably be dismissed as this being anecdotal but it is the case.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,700 ✭✭✭Gusser09


    Cant see a delay reopening them. The main issue not reopening is the impact it has on the whole economy. Everbody is affected. A lot of people without covid cant go to work thus impacting on business who might already be suffering staffing issues because of covid and close contacts etc. Its a mini lockdown of sorts and makes zero sense. Omicron causes little to no medical issues in anyone. It's time to plough through this and the schools playing their part is critical.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,276 ✭✭✭combat14


    schools will open - nphet arent meeting till thursday - you couldnt make it up lol



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,099 ✭✭✭RealJohn


    Have you given up entirely on pretending to be a teacher? You seem more interested in overtly attacking the profession you’re pretending to be a part of.



  • Registered Users Posts: 529 ✭✭✭snor


    Are they not due to meet today with health and education ministers?



  • Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 7,381 Mod ✭✭✭✭HildaOgdenx


    If a profile is private, type the name in manually, onto your ignore list.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,398 ✭✭✭am_zarathustra


    I thought tomorrow? I think your right though, I don't think nphet would actually need to meet, it's more an acute teacher shortage that's going to be the issue as people finish up quarantines from the Christmas holidays. They might just leave it up to individual principals then, may as well double down on the urban/rural gap at this stage



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,622 ✭✭✭Treppen


    "Omicron causes little to no medical issues in anyone."

    Is COVID over so?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,398 ✭✭✭am_zarathustra


    Interesting to see approaches around the world.

    Delayed by a couple of days to get more hepa filters (on top of 70000 already in the schools) and n95 masks for teachers with free 3 ply medical masks for kids .........

    Norma is doing what now?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,398 ✭✭✭am_zarathustra





  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,960 ✭✭✭Jizique


    A phrase like "acute teacher shortage" suggests 40-50% shortage but the reality is presumably closer to 10%, at most, using data from various hospitals and the guards. I presume there would always be some absence this time of year anyway, even without covid.

    I accept that the odd class may have to be sent home but it seems a bit OTT to close all schools.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,786 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    Are the DOE supposed to be organising hepa filters for schools or is down to individual principals to do this or are we being told hepas make no difference?

    Im a parent of two primary school kids and I haven’t heard much information about these filters from the school or department. If it was a case of funds, I think parents would be willing to plug the gap.

    My understanding is it’s about €600 per unit, so if there’s 30 students that’s €20 per parents.

    What’s the official guidance on this? Thanks



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,398 ✭✭✭am_zarathustra


    Most country's are modeling for 25% absense. From my own circles this seems about right. That's a dangerous level of staffing for a school with supervision ect decimated. Insurance may not allow opening, never mind what anyone on the ground thinks can be done. I'd imagine it's more acute at primary, although individual classes can be sent home there.

    It's also not just the covid issue. Like with hospitals, care home ect substitutes are thin on the grlhdn for years, schools have been kept open by good will, mixing classes, favours, DPs, Ps and SNAs in the classrooms and all manner of creative thinking. This is pressure on a system already under massive pressure. I know teachers teaching way outside their subject areas just to keep the show on the road with all the prep that comes with that.

    I'm not suggesting the extra two days as anything other than a way to break the 2 week infection cycle cleanly and then hope it's enough to keep enough staff in schools to keep them open. A small change might make all the difference.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,066 ✭✭✭HerrKuehn


    Exactly, even if a few primary classes can go in, the school should be open. I am sure parents know that they may have the kids home due to the teacher being out. It makes no sense to close the whole school and certainly not to close all schools. Primary cannot be taught remotely and sending on a weekly email with Twinkl exercises is not teaching (this is what happened with both my kid teachers).



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,276 ✭✭✭combat14


    govt meeting with unions on tuesday today is a bank holiday

    nphet having own meeting on thursday (after schools return!) ..

    hard to see how schools can return safely without latest health advice given radically deteriorating situation in case numbers over last week..



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,700 ✭✭✭Gusser09




  • Registered Users Posts: 2,066 ✭✭✭HerrKuehn


    If NPHET were concerned I am sure they would have met before schools were planned to open. In fact I would say it was planned to meet on the day schools open to reduce pressure on them to keep the schools closed.



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