Near Misses Volume 2 (So close you can feel it)

magicbastarder · 13-01-2022 11:56am

it's interesting that they've removed some restrictions on HGV drivers because of covid, in that context.

cletus · 13-01-2022 12:26pm

Do professional drivers have a separate licence from their driving licence? We have some teachers here that have a bus licence for the school bus, but it's just added to their normal licence, I thought. Open to correction, though

13-01-2022 1:40pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118466654#Comment_118466654

Taxi / PSV licence was a separate document, not sure if it still is.

cletus · 13-01-2022 1:45pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118467063#Comment_118467063

So, the "professional driver" thing is a bit of a mish mash. Some of them have ongoing traing, some of them don't. Some have separate permits/licences, some don't.

The reality is, there isn't two levels of safe driving on the road, one for professionals and one for social/recreational/commuting/whatever.

There is safe driving, and unsafe driving (I'm aware that there are levels of unsafe), and everyone behind the wheel of a vehicle should be held to the same standard.

Pawwed Rig · 13-01-2022 1:49pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118466456#Comment_118466456

A large %age of drivers would lose their licence in a week if they were constantly monitored and penalty points applied when laws were broken.

It is just lack of enforcement that keeps many on the road

VonLuck · 13-01-2022 3:04pm

I'm not sure what's so difficult to understand here. What I'm saying is that you should expect professional drivers to have a better standard of driving than your average motorist. I certainly wouldn't expect the same from your average motorist, unfortunately.

In the same way I would expect a greater level of skill from a professional carpenter compared to your mate down the road who cuts some timber from time to time!

cletus · 13-01-2022 3:14pm

I suppose the question is, what's a better standard of driving. As long as they are obeying the rules, and driving with due care and attention, then what is the more or better you want from them?

The flip side of the above, is that all drivers should be obeying the rules, and driving with due care and attention.

*Edit*

To address the last part of your post, vonluck, being a skilled driver is not the same as being a safe driver. The carpenter comparison is a false equivalency

magicbastarder · 13-01-2022 3:27pm

to put a different skew on it, you could argue it's the type of vehicle involved which should determine the standards to which we hold the drivers to rather than professional vs. non-professional categorisation? though that might be redundant in many cases as you're pretty much a 'professional' driver if you drive some of them.

e.g. a artic driver should be held to a higher standard than a taxi driver.

cletus · 13-01-2022 3:36pm

I'm still not sure what the "higher standard" would constitute? What would it look like?

magicbastarder · 13-01-2022 3:45pm

stricter rules, i guess; do the (suspended) laws which apply to HGV drivers and time behind the wheel apply to less regulated professions like taxi drivers?

cletus · 13-01-2022 3:51pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118468067#Comment_118468067

So, there would be levels of safe driving then? Pro drivers would have to do safer driving than the rest of us?

I'm not sure which of the rules of the road we could make safer just for one subset of drivers (I'm aware of differing speed limits for different vehicles), that wouldn't also benefit all road users by having all road users obey the new safer rules, rather than just some.

VonLuck · 13-01-2022 5:15pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118467734#Comment_118467734

What you're saying is that all drivers should be obeying the rules. That's fine, I agree with that, but it's not realistic because a lot of people are inconsiderate and just do not care. There's a limit to how effective the penalty point system can be with the general population and an increase in penalties (e.g. driving ban after say 6 points) is not going to gain traction with the general public.

Professional drivers on the other hand will likely be a lot more careful if they knew that if they break a red light or fail to indicate that their only source of income will be affected. It's a lot easier to target these people and would have a greater impact on overall traffic safety in my opinion. Looking at some rough CSO stats, commercial vehicles average about 7 times the annual mileage a private vehicle does. Focusing in on that area can yield a much better result.

AndrewJRenko · 13-01-2022 5:20pm

There are lower blood alcohol limits for professional drivers (of buses, goods vehicles and public service vehicles)

https://www.drugsandalcohol.ie/16883/

cletus · 13-01-2022 5:56pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118468721#Comment_118468721

So, we're back to looking at harsher penalties for breaking those laws, rather than a more stringent set of laws for those drivers

Cabaal · 13-01-2022 7:13pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118468760#Comment_118468760

Thats insane,

If anything they should be held to a higher standard of driving (an even lower limit!), especially HGV and bus drivers!

AndrewJRenko · 13-01-2022 9:11pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118469360#Comment_118469360

They ARE at a lower limit?

Effects · 13-01-2022 9:15pm

Had a woman left hook me to pull onto a pavement/cycle lane earlier. Came really close to hitting me, but I was quick to brake.

When I said it to her she said it was my fault for not having lights. Then when I pointed at my lights she tried to say they weren't on when she pulled in front of me.

Only yesterday evening about 5pm I had a guy in a Volvo SUV beep at me for not being in the cycle lane just 30m further ahead on the same stretch. Where it goes up and down with the dished footpath. Same guy who I witnessed driving along Fairview in the bus lane to skip the traffic, then continue straight on towards the coast from the left lane for the Malahide Road.

VonLuck · 14-01-2022 9:41am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118468957#Comment_118468957

Being a bit pedantic I think. I would consider penalties being encompassed by the word "laws".

cletus · 14-01-2022 10:32am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118472195#Comment_118472195

Not really. They're two different things, to my mind. The inital calls were for "more stringent rules", not more punishment

VonLuck · 14-01-2022 11:58am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118472397#Comment_118472397

I clarified immediately afterwards so not sure why you're still focusing in on this. You know what I mean so let's leave it at that.

magicbastarder · 14-01-2022 6:54pm

https://twitter.com/Ste_Mc_Lean/status/1481983042407313410

no details, but that's not usually a particularly dangerous stretch; hopefully whoever it was makes a full recovery. i know there's a few boardsies who live nearby or pass down the road reasonably regularly.

Breezer · 14-01-2022 7:18pm

Hope they make a full recovery. It’s not the worst stretch, but the surface downhill is in bits and there’s a left turn off it. Uphill is only one lane and can be intimidating with impatient drivers. I only go down

The off road cycle track is awful, confusing, theoretically is for people cycling up the hill only, and frequently has pedestrians and dogs on and off leads in it.

Effects · 15-01-2022 12:47am

Yeah, I'd never use the lane going down there, just stick to the road.

Never had any issues with drivers going uphill, even though it's a slower trek going up, and cars have to hold back.

magicbastarder · 15-01-2022 10:09am

You shouldn't be using the lane going downhill there AFAIK, it's for uphill cyclists.

Weepsie · 15-01-2022 10:24am

I use it several times a week, but don't come up it. I normally come back through the estates off home fsrm road. Less problematic.

But yeah, it's probably the stretch with the most likely issues for me on my commute. This morning on a mostly empty road even a Kia had to get ahead of a bmw so undertook them, and really struggled to get past them and then sped off.

There's always someone moving into the bus lane without indicating too or trying to take a shortcut

CramCycle · 15-01-2022 11:21am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118466456#Comment_118466456

I would be of the opinion that it should be the same for both, unfortunately enforcement is so poor that it isn't realistic. Several days a week I see regular commuters who rack up 12 points on their commute in the short space I see them. They obviously don't just do this for my viewing pleasure. If its not safe for someone who has racked up 6 points to be driving then neither should be.

magicbastarder · 15-01-2022 11:44am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118478708#Comment_118478708

interesting, i don't recall any issues downhill myself but i've never done it in rush hour; most of the times i've been on it were during lockdown where i was using it as part of my 5km limit spin.

Weepsie · 15-01-2022 12:13pm

The left turn onto Home farm road, into the 2-3 schools and in Na Fianna nearly always see someone kind of take liberties with the bus lane, indicators and personal space.

Then there's always the one who decides,Shure bus lane is for me too. Again this is between 8-9.30

Effects · 15-01-2022 1:11pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118478675#Comment_118478675

I didn't know that. I should be paying more attention. 🤣I guess that's why the lane abruptly ends at the lights, as it crosses the road there.

magicbastarder · 15-01-2022 1:26pm

yep, downhill cyclists are expected to use the bus lane, uphill cyclists use that path. which leaves uphill cyclists who want to go past the junction of home farm road wondering what they're meant to do; i suspect that path wouldn't have been placed there were it not for a school being on the road, but again, what are kids cycling home from school uphill meant to do?

if you're heading in the direction of ballymun from the city centre, the cycling signs direct you past the botanic gardens, and to take a right at the met building, up old ballymun road, i.e. avoiding the uphill on mobhi road.

Near Misses Volume 2 (So close you can feel it)

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