Anyone thinking of emigrating?

Tony EH · 14-01-2022 10:13PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118476854#Comment_118476854

Cheap labour and driving down wages/conditions has always been a love of the right. That's why they are in favour of immigration. They may talk the big talk about being "anti" immigration, but the fact of the matter is they have always been well disposed to it. It's a neo-liberal policy that's pursued by the right in every country they rule in. Yet there's a persistence that it is somehow the left that drive this policy who, in fairness, are interested in the free movement of people. But for vastly different reasons.

a2deden · 14-01-2022 10:19PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058226733/anyone-thinking-of-emigrating

You are in for a shock when you venture to the rest of the world.

14-01-2022 10:28PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118477123#Comment_118477123

Well the narrative tends to be formed by the fact that the Right will publicly blow dog whistles and sometimes outright come out against it. Meanwhile the Left seem to view it in "humanitarian" terms no matter the actual circumstances.

Grayson · 15-01-2022 12:34AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118476854#Comment_118476854

I'd say we're right wing economically and left wing socially.

I emigrated. last year I was getting fed up living in a shithole. I had a good job, decent wages and even had a 6 figure deposit for an apartment/house. But because I'm in my 40s it was going to be damn hard to get a place anywhere near dublin. I was a bit fed up with the job although I did love the company. So I switched my linkedin to available for opportunities. I got asked if I'd want to work in Dusseldorf. I interviewed and got it.

Here in Dusseldorf I pay higher taxes than at home. When bonuses etc are included I'm actually on a lower gross wage and being taxed more on it. But I have an apartment, at ~100m2, that's 4 times the size of the one I had at home in Kildare. And it's 1100 a month (excluding bills) which is only slightly higher than I was paying in Ireland. I'm a 10 minute walk from their equivalent of Grafton st or O'Connell st. In North Rhine Westphalia, they complain about the rents in Dusseldorf. It's more expensive than cologne or essen or dortmund or anywhere else near here. People here are surprised I pay so much rent. Especially when I could have moved to a cheaper city. But I'm living in the centre of a big european city for a fraction of what I had to pay to live in a different county to where I worked.

Ireland sucks. And it's not because of unemployed people or because of council houses. It's not because of high taxation (I pay higher taxes here). It's because the government allowed developers and landlords to make millions from everyone else. They had years to tackle this and they did nothing because they thought they could get away with it and they're obsessed with a free market ideology when it comes to the property market.

And no, I'm not a shinner. I'd never vote for them. But I do hate FF/FG. And one of my regrets about moving is that I won't be able to vote against them in the next election.

aligator_am · 15-01-2022 12:46AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118441030#Comment_118441030

If you have a degree then look into doing a TEFL course and set your sights on SE Asia, Thailand, Vietnam or Cambodia would be good options.

Wages for native English speaking teachers there are about $1200 per month and quite a few schools there will provide you with accommodation.

It'd be well worth your while to save up a few quid before you go as an "oh sh1t" fund. My understanding is that you can also continue to pay PRSI contributions remotely while abroad so you would still be eligible for full state pension at retirement age.

15-01-2022 01:25AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118478101#Comment_118478101

This is an interesting and valuable perspective imo

I must say any time Ive passed through that neck of germany it always struck me as a great place to live, is that the case

babyducklings1 · 15-01-2022 01:37AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118473733#Comment_118473733

Yes this is wrong. Why not give every worker a few free gp visits per year. This would be a progressive society.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 15-01-2022 02:00AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118478270#Comment_118478270

Oooh, I think the Marxists just collectively sighed!

Seriously, though, GP visits should be covered by health insurance (at least a certain number per year).

babyducklings1 · 15-01-2022 03:01AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118478324#Comment_118478324

Yes let workers have a few visits per year, after all people are paying prsi and yet nothing in the way of support. Just wrong.

Manic Moran · 15-01-2022 04:09AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118441918#Comment_118441918

Whilst I understand the concept behind what you're saying, I don't think that's really the effect. The price is the as high as the highest-bidding-person is willing to take. Even if 95% of people say "Nope, that's too much, the tax bill every year will kill me", the other 5% who are fighting over it are the ones who will actually set the price, the other 95% may as well not exist. And when that 5% are California or Washington transplants like myself, we don't even notice the tax bill. It's all a hell of a lot cheaper no matter what its composition.

Every State needs to get their operating costs covered somehow. In Texas, it's property tax, but there's no income tax, so if you're renting, you can get quite a decent amount of 'net' dollars a year. The other advantage is that your tax bill is known at the beginning of the year, whereas in income tax states, it's dependent on how much you work. I found that on my own, the CA income tax and property tax about equalled the TX Property tax, but when my wife's income got added in, the CA tax bill shot up, but TX's stayed the same.

If you can't handle heat, though, be cautious about central or Southern Texas. July and August can be brutal. They weren't this year, for some reason, though.

I knew a girl from Helsinki that said the same. You just don't go out in winter. At least not for long anyway. She also worked in Norway for a bit up the north, near Narvik. Said it was just miserable. Pitch black and freezing cold for about half the year."

I've encountered quite a few people who are either from or did tours of duty in Alaska. They've all loved it out there, and they say they particularly like it in Winter. I have absolutely no idea why, it's not for me (Though I will admit my visit in the height of summer was lovely). When deciding where to move to after bailing from California, we drew a line across the middle of the US and said "Not north of that...."

My parents decided to move to Vienna. They really like it there, it was their last foreign duty station, and they decided to rent a place. In fairness, it's a pretty city, and very well located to go travelling. I think they spend more time there than in their house in Dublin.

Dyr · 15-01-2022 02:03PM

If you havent settled down with kids then get the **** out of here, Ireland only exists now to generate revenue for the government rather than allow the its citizens a decent standard of living from their earnings

Grayson · 15-01-2022 02:22PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118479467#Comment_118479467

It's not revenue for the government. If it was, then we might have better public services. It's to generate money for businesses. The housing market is the prime example.

shillyshilly · 15-01-2022 02:52PM

gone from Ireland to the UK nearly 10 years now, left mid 20s.

Had I stuck around, I wouldn't have had the same opportunities in Ireland, probably still living at home, barely running a car.

on the flip side, I would like to move back and raise our young family in Ireland, so we are closer to family and friends. But I can honestly say I probably wouldn't survive unless we moved down the country, as I'm mid career where I can't get junior roles (and being honedt, I don't want to take a step back) but haven't the experience for senior roles (well technically I do, but Ireland is very competitive in the tech world, and a guy who meets the mark from the UK, is far down the list of local exceptional candidates.... I need to be outstanding)

I also wonder do I want to have my kids grow up in the environment Ireland is slowly turning into?

15-01-2022 03:49PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118478143#Comment_118478143

Agreed. TEFL is a decent option, and depending on the country in question, and what qualifications you have, you can get a decent income from it. Due to low costs of living, and often the package of free accommodation, you can save the vast majority of an income.

Re PRSI payments towards the pension that doesn't work with most? Asian countries. It's only those countries that have signed into a European framework agreement for taxation/contributions. I know that my own salaries weren't allowed to contribute when I worked in China and Japan. All the same though, you can make very good money, save it, and then later, allocate it towards a pension of your own.

In terms of money/returns, Japan/S.Korea/China remain the most profitable... and generally provide a better standard of living, while also being much safer overall (violence, drugs, etc). With China, a Bachelor degree is adequate for teaching at University levels, earning less than private schools, but also working far less (generally speaking Universities can't give you more than 20 hours of work to do)... allowing you to look elsewhere (external gigs, or working online) for an income while your visa is completely secure.

I did over a decade in Asia (mostly China) teaching initially TEFL, and then moved into subject teaching/lecturing. It's a very rewarding experience. Highly recommended.

15-01-2022 03:54PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118479541#Comment_118479541

Sure, but it's also to generate money for those who can game the system. Not a bash at genuinely poor people btw. However, a lot of government expenditure is aimed at supporting people who contribute very little to the economy (both native/foreign, and also organisations like NGOs)... and that expenditure tends to increase each year.

Dyr · 15-01-2022 03:57PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118479541#Comment_118479541

You think the reason we have **** services is because the government lacks revenue? They're **** because we accept **** services, regardless of how much money is pissed up against the wall on them

cnocbui · 15-01-2022 03:58PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118479541#Comment_118479541

The 'government' isn't the politicians you elect, it's the many thousands of public sector workers, who in Ireland, are amongst the most highly paid in the world, and are always looking for significant pay rises. If you have ever wondered why this country has such a high cost of living - there it is - plus the silly levels of social welfare spending. To fund every public sector pay rise and boondoggle, like pensions, taxes are increased to fund it, or expenditure on services are cut to fund it.

"But if the UK public sector is full of "fat cats", the Irish public sector is full of "morbidly obese cats"."

https://www.theguardian.com/business/ireland-business-blog-with-lisa-ocarroll/2010/dec/06/ireland-public-sector-fat-cats

maninasia · 15-01-2022 05:08PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118452406#Comment_118452406

I'm coming back to Ireland but not because I failed and certainly not because of money but because I miss it.

maninasia · 15-01-2022 05:44PM

Let's get down to brass tacks. The main reason for young people to emigrate right now is housing cost and availability.

It seems to me moving to another lower cost city or town in Ireland could be a better option than hot footing it overseas. Might work out better for families too.

I'm planning on moving back and more and more I'm thinking of finding a smaller town or city to move to evne though originally I was set on the big smoke. It seems to me places such as Wexford or Waterford (as examples ) or nicer suburbs of Cork could offer a lot of value especially in these days of remote working. I would even contemplate parts of Northern Ireland .

Remote working or pursuing a career or business that allows you to live in a cheaper more relaxed place...

A lot of these economic ssues such as tax , insurance , medical , housing costs do concern me so that is why I'm trying to build a warchest before moving back.

I should add living in a low tax country on a high wage is a good way to put together that warchest. I have heard of teachers going to work in the middle East to do that and it's a sensible strategy .

Portugal looks appealing to me also in the long term.

Murph85 · 15-01-2022 07:06PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118441899#Comment_118441899

What income tax does this homeowner pay? here for every ten thousand earned, over 36,000 or thereabouts. Its 5000 , out of the 10,000. 36k is a pittance of an income to hit with a fifty percent marginal rate. Transport, health, housing, law and order etc are all a disgrace! There isnt a single cosmopolitan city in the country...

I think it will be fascinating to see the emigration, once some normality resumes, once covid has died down. Its funny, Ireland could be booming, unlike the last exodus, but there has possibly been no worse time in our recent history, to stay on this island...

I read an artile in the Irish times the other day, roughly 20,000 homes built. 7,000 of those, were available to joe soap off the street, 7,000 a year, in a population of over 5,000,000. The housing crisis or gift in the governments eyes, is only going to get worse too...

We need a new common sense, no BS party! Its not SF and its obviously not FFG. Dont hold you breath for one either! The media will persecute any party, that doesnt put "de vulneable" at #1

Dyr · 15-01-2022 07:23PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480753#Comment_118480753

20,000 homes built, compare that to amount of immigrants coming into the country, like trying to hold back the tide with a sieve 🤣

Like I said, Ireland now exists to generate revenue for the Government not to generate wealth for its citizens, you will be fucked over repeatedly so long as the government recieve it's cut

dxhound2005 · 15-01-2022 07:32PM

What makes Ireland so attractive for immigrants?

15-01-2022 07:36PM

Where are these low cost towns people are meant to move to? In my town of under 40k people the cheapest shittiest house is 1200 a month.

If I'm going to move 4 or 5 hours away so that I can get cheaper rent why would I limit myself to Ireland in that case?

Mysteriouschic1 · 15-01-2022 07:38PM

I've been thinking about it to somewhere like Mexico or if possible Florida .

It all depends what jobs are like over there or if there was a way to transfer to a job there. Not sure if I would leave without a job confirmed.

tinytobe · 15-01-2022 07:40PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058226733/anyone-thinking-of-emigrating

I'd say Dublin isn't per se an ugly city but the main issue is housing, housing and again housing no matter if it's flats or houses for families. There is simply no place to live, rents for a one bedroom are beyond reach, even for one in the 40's and 50's, that is if one is lucky enough to get a rental contract, any rental contract. And who wants to live in a flat share with a bunch of strangers during Covid 19? Even London in the UK and all the issues around Brexit in the UK still make the UK attractive to go to, and renting in London is cheap and easy compared to Dublin.

If you're planning on leaving Dublin I wouldn't blame you at all and if you're young then international experience never hurts, and Dublin will also be there in 10 or 20 years, - that is if property and rental prices normalize.

I am surprised that IT companies like Salesforce, Microsoft, Google or Facebook are attracting talent. From what I've heard they have high turnover of staff, just because of the housing crisis, and these companies don't really pay that badly. It's just that Dublin has become unlivable with the sky high rents.

Motivator · 15-01-2022 09:05PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480962#Comment_118480962

I disagree. I think Dublin is a kip of a city. Bar Ballsbridge, the city is a grim place. I lived there for 4 years and I’ll be honest I ran out of it. It kills me to see it the way it is and the way it has been for the last few years. Thankfully when I was there rent wasn’t what it is now but jaysus it’s a horrible place to live.

tinytobe · 15-01-2022 09:17PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118481579#Comment_118481579

I haven't been there lately, I must admit. I was in Dublin last in 2017 and finding rental accommodation was impossible no matter how low your expectations were.

To judge that Dublin is a horrible place to live means you have to find a place to live in first to come to that judgement. I find that rather impossible.

Renting a studio apartment in London UK, even places like Clapham or Richmond is way easier, and I have first hand experience.

The fundamental problem in Dublin is that with low taxes they attract big IT players from the US to set up office in the city, but then there is no real housing for their employees. Thus I understand that people are pissed of about that.

15-01-2022 09:21PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480923#Comment_118480923

Employment opportunities. Ireland has been promoted internationally as a successful economy for decades now, and regardless of any problems within our economy/society, people are going to focus on the positives... and those positives will be employment opportunities, and the high standard of living. They won't be thinking of how expensive it is here, the lack of housing, etc. At least not until they've been here a while.

cnocbui · 15-01-2022 09:28PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118480954#Comment_118480954

For sale maisonette in Hanioti 100 sqm.

plot of exclusive use 150 sqm.

2 bedrooms living room kitchen bathroom and wc.

Furnished with all electrical appliances.

Drainage.

Parking.

It has its own water.

Mosquito screens.

Individual heating.

300 m from the beach.

€220,000

https://www.vdrealestate.gr/properties/55-%CF%80%CF%89%CE%BB%CE%B5%CE%AF%CF%84%CE%B1%CE%B9-%CE%BC%CE%B5%CE%B6%CE%BF%CE%BD%CE%AD%CF%84%CE%B1-%CF%83%CF%84%CE%B7-%CF%87%CE%B1%CE%BD%CE%B9%CF%8E%CF%84%CE%B7.html

Grayson · 15-01-2022 11:28PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118479919#Comment_118479919

Not really. When you look at social welfare expenditure, most of it is on the elderly. And even for the stuff that isn't, a lot of the money is spent badly. The government gives free/subsidised housing by paying private landlords. So they pump money back into private hands because they're ideologically opposed to public ownership.

Anyone thinking of emigrating?

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