Do men need a license to be allowed socialise (MOD NOTE IN OP)

Well, I think unpopular criticisms need to be considered. Look at Irish society and you see a wide range of places where boys/men are influenced by women. It's interesting the way feminists will complain about the numbers of women who have to raise children rather than work outside the home, but there's little consideration about what these mothers are teaching their sons. From childhood to adulthood, we are all either in the home or at school, being influenced by Adults... but the majority of teachers in our schools are female. Why is it that men are supposedly picking up their dismissive attitudes towards women, or feel that they can be violent towards women? How is it that "male culture" has so much importance when it's not other men teaching us these things...?

Because I don't see many ways in society where a male would be on the receiving end of conditioning to see women this way. Unless it really comes down to personality and personal experiences.. but shouldn't that mean we should be examining the interactions that boys have with girls? Perhaps consider the influence that girls/women have on boys/men, etc.

Instead, the focus is almost entirely on the male gender. There is no examination or concern for how women influence men. None. They've managed to escape all responsibility completely, and to suggest that there is such a responsibility, means that someone is victim blaming or whatever.

IF we really want to create a safe society (for everyone), we should be examining all aspects of society and culture. Not ignoring the influence that women have on boys or men.

Putting forward more laws/legislation is not going to change much. Instead, we need to examine what our society is.. what messages are being promoted.. and for God's sake, cut out the double standards (in society).

I think it's a bit of both. Society has changed and a subset of men have not changed with the times. They need to change with that and be more respectful and appreciate of the fear women have on a day to day basis.

From what I see, law and order is completely fucked in this country and getting worse. (In Dublin anyway). The lack of action enables awful behaviour as there is no fear of consequence. That's what happens when you have multitudes of people walking the streets with 200+ convictions.

TBH I'd be wary of people around me at 2 pm, nevermind about 2 am. Any group of lads (regardless of ethnicity) makes me hyper aware of my surroundings.

I haven't any trouble in a decade, but i'm still very careful of who is around me. Just as I'd never get drunk alone/solo in a bar, or be drunk with a group of strangers (regardless of their gender)... it's simply safer not to.

I don't think it's just fear of consequences. It's also a sense that there won't be a reaction to what they do other than everyone desperately trying to avoid eye contact. That's exactly what happens when something kicks off on say the LUAS or on trains.

If someone intervenes, there's a significant and very much perceived risk they'll get stabbed.

If they throw a punch or directly intervene to disperse a situation, there's also a genuine risk they'll be prosecuted, or at least dragged into a mess of investigations and potentially civil actions. People tracking your address / work down and harassing etc etc.

So we all look away. That's the reality of it.

The fact that the Gardai aren't resourced enough to regularly appear on the streets also has a significant impact. It's that lack of disruption of bad behaviour. It doesn't even need dire consequences in court a lot of the time. It's just the 'Hey you... was do you think you're doing?" type impact.

I mean, take that incident on the DART a few months ago where those girls were spat at and pushed under the train in one case. How the hell did that happen? Why did those guys think they could do that?

It's largely because we all look down. Respond to the 'what are ya lookin' at!?' by not getting involved and that isn't because we're cowards it's because there are huge consequences to being involved.

We're a society that increasingly just lets the bullies win.

Good post. Agree with 99% of it.

Although I would point out that women rarely act alone. I've had numerous times where I've been set up by a woman, so that her boyfriend got offended/violent. Or where there's more than one woman involved in harassing and getting violent themselves. It's true that I'm probably physically stronger than most women, but I'm also extremely skinny, which means it hurts when anyone hits me... and quite a few women manage to be heavier, or be relatively as strong as me. Quite a few men these days spend most their time in the office, and have little involvement in sports or manual labor.

I agree that there is a greater likelihood that danger will come from men. However, as a man, I know exactly how to respond to a man when he gets violent. I certainly don't have the same knowledge when it comes to a woman, and in many ways, can be more dangerous than aggression from a man. There's also the aspect that many women rely on the idea that men won't hit them, and so push the envelope harder in how aggressive they behave (for whatever reason). I've no idea of how many times I've been hit by drunk women in bars/clubs, for nothing more than being a convenient target for their aggression.

Yes, it's important to recognise the risks to women.. it's also important to consider how women behave in society. The men who act violently in society are a minority compared to the overall male population. The women who act violently in society are also a minority... but one is ignored, and the other is highlighted.

Most likely we'll do nothing. That's what we always do.

It's very much 'is there anything to be said for a Massl" type response to everything.

I mean you've women taking to the street about violence against women.

Irish Rail went on strike about violence against rail staff.

Commentary all the time about violent crime.

People going: "could you point to any evidence of rising violent crime?"

Sure we'll write a report and blame Facebook, or add another €10 to the price of a pint.

They complained to the Gardai multiple times. The individual gardai were lovely, but they've such limited ability actually do anything about any of it that nothing happens. It seems unless your stalker / harasser actually commits some violent offence then it's like their hands are tied as the prospect of taking a case and being successful is so slim it's pointless / might even undermine a future prosecution.

"Any person who, without lawful authority or reasonable excuse, by any means including by use of the telephone, harasses another by persistently following, watching, pestering, besetting or communicating with him or her, shall be guilty of an offence." Should not need physical attack

Messed up the quote cannot edit is

the tradesman could be genuinely good looking and could be grubby cos he was working hard. Why would a hard working man necessarily seem creepy

the only difference being context and appearance

that would be if the woman liked him he was noticing her or chatting her up. if she didn't he was creepy.

We're increasingly creating a society where the most important position is to be a victim... and the victims are entitled to be bullies, because no responsibility for their behavior is extended to them.