How to get my money back from a (wealthy) friend.

mickdw · 18-01-2022 9:34pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118496866#Comment_118496866

And do it on payday

StevenToast · 18-01-2022 9:44pm

Any updates from the OP on this?

BorneTobyWilde · 18-01-2022 9:57pm

Borrow something without asking, what are friends for

TooTired123 · 18-01-2022 10:56pm

You’re never getting that money back. Sorry, you’ll just have to write it off. But that shouldn’t stop you from blackening his name and absolutely stalking him all over his SM and any other communication device day and night until you get bored. Tell absolutely everyone you meet about this.

I knew a woman, separated mother of 3, who owed €1000s in stolen and borrowed money as well as property damage. She absolutely refused to even attempt to pay anyone back. She decided to just brazen it out. She lost all her friends eventually and ended up almost isolated from the rest of society. She’s now semi estranged from her now grown kids and her widowed father. Madness.

Ferm001 · 18-01-2022 11:24pm

Go to his door when you know he’s in and demand money for next day.

when he doesn’t give it, call with his parents about your concern for their poor son, and that you think he maybe in financial trouble with some unsavoury characters, and that you loaned him money to help him out. Say he seem unable to pay it and your worried about him.

El_Duderino 09 · 19-01-2022 12:24am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118497451#Comment_118497451

If the OP is going to speak to the parents then that's a very good angle to take. Great chance of getting their money back through the parents at least. Well, the not a great chance of getting the money back at all - very low chance through the friend but surely higher through the parents.

At this stage, I'd only be concerned about getting my money back. Friendship is over. Might as well get their money back if at all possible.

Curious1002 · 19-01-2022 10:52pm

I got so many superb ideas here. You are the voice of reason and you explored all possibilities and avenues that this case could go to. Thanks for that.

So I texted him on Monday lunch time this:

"Hi Jamie, hope you are ok, although long time no see or hear. It's been a longer while now, over 2 months, since I brought you the lamps for €100 and lent you the €400 for the roofers so can you please arrange the return of my €500 by the end of this week? I can come over to you tomorrow evening, if it's easier, or if you prefer, you can make a bank transfer. Here are my details: XXXXXX

I would really appreciate if there were no further delays. Thanks mate."

Result as of Wednesday night: silence. I keep checking my bank account daily, just in case.

In terms of the big-strong looking friends, well, I went through my contact list and apart from my heavy boned boss everyone else looks like they skip a few meals a week or they are females.

I just saw an add on Daft with his house share advert - he is looking for a tenant to his own house (the lamps present themselves great). Maybe indeed he is in financial trouble, but at least a text back to me would put me at ease. It does feel like he is waiting for me to do something a bit stronger or more radical so he has an excuse to block me or call the Guards on me for harassment.

StevenToast · 19-01-2022 10:58pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118503079#Comment_118503079

Well done...next move...call to the house....

Curious1002 · 19-01-2022 10:58pm

Friendship is over 100%. Clearly there was no friendship in first place, dont know what I was thinking.

You have to have a very special personality/character to borrow money, then ignore the lender shortly after and treat him like a total enemy and dirt. I dont think I ever borrowed money from anyone. I just cant do it, I wouldnt know how to even ask for it.

mickdw · 19-01-2022 11:05pm

He is laughing his hole off at you. Your text reads as though you are afraid of him and almost as if you were asking him for a loan.

You won't get your money back the way you are going.

Walk away and call it a bad debt or do something about it. A text like that won't ever get your money back.

road_high · 19-01-2022 11:36pm

Softly softly will never work with a using prat like this I'm afraid. You will have to face him

down in person, more than likely repeatedly so .

At least the text is some kind of reminder to him but that’s all it is.

road_high · 19-01-2022 11:37pm

Thanks for the update OP- I wouldn’t waste my time checking the bank balance- it simply won’t be there.

TheW1zard · 19-01-2022 11:44pm

I'd forget about the money, that's the price it will cost you to never have to deal with him again! Might be worth it

El_Duderino 09 · 19-01-2022 11:52pm

Like the poster said above, it might be tenosynovitis of getting rid of that person out of your life.

It's also a pretty good lesson in peer pressure for anyone reading. The bit that stood out in particular from your OP is this

he turned to me and said "would you mind lending me 400? " It was quite awkward, all 3 of them were looking at me.

In truth, they might have looked at you because the friend was asking you to get the money, but none of the builders had any expectation that you would actually pay them. That was simply peer pressure created by your friend.

There's a funny psychological trick which says the best way to get someone to do you a big favour is to ask them to do a small favour. Once you do the small favour, you psychologically justify doing more favours. That really appears to have happened in this case whether by accident or design.

Best of luck getting the money back, I genuinely hope you get it back. Be persistent and don't give up unless you're happy to write it off and learn the lesson.

Bob Harris · 19-01-2022 11:55pm

This all reads like a wind up to me.

road_high · 19-01-2022 11:58pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118503459#Comment_118503459

Thought had passed my mind too for the incredible naivety of it all (if true)

20-01-2022 4:11pm

OP,

As suspected, he's not wealthy and is in need of money - hence room share. That doesn't lessen your case, just puts it into context. Either he's living beyond his means or has a gambling addiction or other vice. He may also have exaggerated his income so you'd feel at ease lending him money.

Good to confirm friendship status (or lack thereof) is accepted. Unfortunately, texting isn't going to solve it. You'll need to go to his house and ask him face to face.

I'd not bring heavies with you (luckily, considering your back up 😄 ) Maybe a local boardie would volunteer for €100 (once the €500 was received).

If you can't get his attention and he doesn't answer his door I'd send him a text along the lines of...

'Can't seem to catch you. Is something wrong - I can talk to your parents to see if they need to talk to you. Call me and we can work it out.'

You said, you know his parents. You COULD talk to them, 'bit worried about your son. I lent him some money and he's not returned my calls. I'm worried about him.'

And, not inconceivable the miscreant is reading this. PAY THE OP YOU BUM!

Degag · 20-01-2022 6:49pm

Texts not working. Call to the front door is next. After knocking i'd be entering without waiting for it to be answered also, if unlocked.

Curious1002 · 20-01-2022 9:48pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118506474#Comment_118506474

That's all what I am going to do next. On Sunday I will call over to his house. Depends on the interaction (or its lack of), I will send the exact text message you mentioned above. Then on Tuesday I will head on to his parents and tell them how "worried" I am about their son.

An old lawyer I knew years ago told me to always try to build up some history, some event timeline so if it comes to the adjudication, the judge could see that I have exhausted all avenues and met with a complete lack of willingness from the other party to engage and find a solution.

If needed, I will place an add for some big guy(s) to accompany me to his house, but without doing anything bad, just to visually boost my chances.

Curious1002 · 20-01-2022 9:49pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118507390#Comment_118507390

I would love to do that but that will guarantee me trespass charges.

lawred2 · 20-01-2022 9:52pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118482707#Comment_118482707

Sorry, how would that threat work?

lawred2 · 20-01-2022 9:59pm

This lad sounds a right prick. Always amazes me that there are people who carry on like this.

Panthro · 20-01-2022 10:02pm

Any idea who the workers were in his house who you gave the 400quid to?

If it goes to any court be handy to have them on your side as a witness say "yes it was a loan not it was not a gift."

Curious1002 · 21-01-2022 9:05am

My "friend" told me he found them on Adverts and said they advertised something like "James Dream Team". He was laughing at the name and it stuck with me so I tracked that add before Christmas and i have contact number to them now. Brilliant. "James" himself might not be one of the roofers because they were 2 foreign workers but I am sure he might have a record of who he sent to this address on a specific day, what work was done and how much they agreed (€900).

whomitconcerns · 21-01-2022 9:23am

What's it got to do with his parents? Nonsense idea, unless your both 10 years old. Go to the house, tell him in person you need the money, you tried to be nice about it, now you need it straight away. That's it, simple as that.

Any excuses from him, just walk away. If he's an actual friend he will reach out straight away. If not, then it's not worth your time and effort, write him off and move on

El_Duderino 09 · 21-01-2022 2:08pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118510202#Comment_118510202

Its got nothing to do with the parents. The suggestion is that the parents might be so morto that they'll cover the debt and the OP gets their money back.

Obviously the OP should try all reasonable avenues for getting the money back from the friend, but it seems pretty clear the friend doesn't plan to pay them back. After texting, phoning and calling to the house a few times, I'd say then legal route or the parents are the next beat options and I'd say the parents are the far easier option. Legal route over a €500 debt where nothing was agreed in writing (for the €400 at least) sounds like a lot of hassle compared to trying the parents.

21-01-2022 2:21pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118510202#Comment_118510202

Hmmm. Don't involve the parents. Give up easily... Hmmm...

Oh, my gawd... You're the 'friend' aren't you. 🤣

Sheedy234 · 21-01-2022 2:32pm

Why should his parents have to pay up for him , end of the day if u don't get the money off Ur ex friend that's unfortunate but his parents should not be out of pockets because you choose to lend him money. Call to him ask for your money face to face ,if that doesn't work then I would go to his work place and shame him in front of his colleges.

21-01-2022 2:53pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118511843#Comment_118511843

I wouldn't expect his parent's to pay, but the 'friend' might not want them to find out their son is not the second coming afterall - he might pay up.

airy fairy · 21-01-2022 2:55pm

If you're personally calling to the house, or have any face to face dealing with this person, please bring someone with you, to witness what's being said. Otherwise he could make up untruthful allegations against you.

I'd be in favor of calling to the parents. You don't need to ask them for money, just make them aware of what their son has done. Nice couple or not, their feelings or upset are irrelevant to you.

Claw Hammer · 21-01-2022 3:35pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118508350#Comment_118508350

What old lawyer? Judges only care that you prove you lent the money, prove you asked for it back and prove you didn't get it. They don't want to hear your life story or any other story for that matter.

El_Duderino 09 · 21-01-2022 3:38pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118511843#Comment_118511843

You'd sooner go to his workplace and make a scene, like a scorned crazy ex, than try the parents route?

The OP said they know the parents so it's certainly worth a shot. The time for being nice and sitting like friends, has passed. If the OP's focus is on getting their money back without breaking the law or hiring goons to frighten the friend. Trying the parents is a good route to just getting the money and never look back.

El_Duderino 09 · 21-01-2022 3:40pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118511973#Comment_118511973

I wouldn't expect the parents to pay, but id say it's far more likely that they would cover the debt than the friend is to volunteer to pay the debt themselves.

TheWonderLlama · 21-01-2022 3:53pm

Think of a credible reason why you might need money. Your mother needs a new hip, your dog has swallowed a tennis ball, you found a lovely mail order bride and need to pay a deposit, it doesn't matter.

Go to his house on the 1st of the month.

Tell him story and say you need the money now and tell him you can both go to the ATM to get it. After all, he's just been paid by the bank, right?

Take no excuses, tell him you need the money now, no further delays. ATM is only up the road. Let's go.

El_Duderino 09 · 21-01-2022 4:06pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118512551#Comment_118512551

I wouldn't get into reasons why they need the money. They just need the money back because it's a debt and it's gone on too long and needs to be paid.

Panthro · 21-01-2022 4:16pm

Are the days of standing beside his car with a baseball bat shouting "Where's me effin money?!" raising the bat in a swinging motion towards the windscreen over then, yeah?!

(just kidding don't do that.)

Sheedy234 · 21-01-2022 4:30pm

His parents did not borrow the money ,he is a grown adult and they should not accountable for him . He is not talking is seriously so going to his workplace may do the job , no need to make big scene but he will see the op means business.

happyoutscan · 21-01-2022 5:00pm

I'd bet that he is a compulsive liar with a gambling problem. Guaran-f*cking-teed.

Sorry OP, the only chance you have - and it's slim anyway - of getting your money back is to be confrontational and tough about it. If that is not your psyche (and there's nothing wrong with that) then put it down as a life experience and move on. I wouldn't involve his parents as it's not their concern, and I'd consider it unfair to bring them into it. Quite possible the apple didn't fall far from the tree anyway.

There's plenty of Rambo's on here who would do f*ck all when push comes to shove so don't mind them.

Curious1002 · 24-01-2022 1:57am

so here is how it went today... and I came back home from the Garda station so you can have an idea.

I took my bike and went to Jamie's house at around 5pm. On the way I stopped and bought some food for me and hang it on the bike's steering wheel. I saw the lights on so I opened the front gate, brought my bike in through the short front yard, just in case he allows me in - then my bike would be safe. I turned on my phone audio recording and knocked on the door, once, then twice, three times and would have been knocking like that on and on until i hard his firm voice "hey, whats going on, what is it". I think he had a camera somewhere. So I said "hey it's me, I came for the money, you know, I got tired of sending you text messages and getting no response so here i am, let's chat". Silence. so I said "hey you there?" and after 30 seconds I started knocking to the door again. No voice, nothing. So I am knocking and knocking and I started to say loudly "Jamie, time to give me my money back, mate, dont play dirty with me, no games, I wont leave until i get the €500 back".

No answer, so I am banging to the door now with my fist saying, "i am not leaving, I am serious. This has gone too far, I wont leave until I see my mooo"...and the door opens, I was actually quite happy to see the door opening until i saw that he looks like a freaking mad man, goes directly at me, I take a step back with my hands in a defense mode and my back in the hedges now... he goes so close to me, all huffing and puffing around me saying "get the F out of my property, loser, out, out, OUT, now! ", he goes to my bike, takes it with my hanging bag of food, I say "hey hey, dont touch my bike" and he takes it outside the gate and tosses it on the pavement with all my food spattered on the ground now. I say - what the F is wrong with you man? give me my F-ing money back" and he goes "if i see you here again i ll call the guards you son of a $%^&" and lots of other **** stuff i cant even repeat properly.

I have never found myself in such situation before. What a total bully and he did it so smoothly, while i was like an ass, I didnt know how to face such scumbag, i seriously never had anything to do with such people before. I picked up my stuff, look at his window and he was there starring at me talking on his phone vigorously. I was sure he just called the guards. So I took my stuff and went to the guards on my way back home. I described the situation and they tell me that it's good that i wasnt charged with trespass. I asked how come and the guards say that i was on his property unannounced, uninvited and that i "clearly caused fear". They said that so far they dont have his complaint so I might be ok. They added that it's a civil matter and cant help but to stay away from him.

I played them the audio and the guards said they can't hear anything wrong Jamie did and that he was not confirming nor did he acknowledge the loan. I said that I want my lamps back and asked if they can help me to get them from him and they said it looks like a gift for them. I am like "the €400 for the roofers is a gift too" and they said that "it's possible".

Ok, so I have my answers - he is not going to pay me and I dont want to deal with him face to face anymore. When i deal with weird stuff like that and before I can think of what to do next - he does 10 things faster and more serious. I am not used to this, never had to deal with stuff like that and it seems like he knows how to scare the creditors off.

Someone said he must be gambling - yes, when we were neighbours he said had a serious gambling problem when he was younger, he said that it was like 10 years ago, that he won a lot but since then he never touched the cards again. Everything about this guy seems so weird now. but i know he works in the bank, works from home so i cant just pop in to his office because he's not there. He plays such professional figure, on the outside, attends online banking/IT events, presents on them, writes articles, he is even in a mentorship work programme and has a few staff to mentor, yet he does such **** things on the side. Jesus!

I am not sure if the next stop is the civil suit or to try his parents. Can I file a civil suit without a lawyer? If I only ask a lawyer for 1 letter - to scare Jamie that I am serious - how much would such letter cost? Can I write such letter myself and just ask some lawyer to stamp it? I am not sure how it all works.

mickdw · 24-01-2022 2:14am

This guy is a nut job.

Solicitors letter will only go in bin. Don't waste your time.

Call it a lesson learned or get someone he won't bully to deal with him.

BorneTobyWilde · 24-01-2022 3:13am

If ten people here give you 50.00 you have your money back, and its proof that not all guys are like that dickhead.

24-01-2022 8:02am

At least you are getting €50 back OP. ^^^ 🙄

At the start of this post you were looking to get money back from a friend. You/we now know this is not the case. You were 100% scammed by someone that had, at least, previous gambling issues. It has all the signs of it being back.

You are probably way down the list of people he owes money to.

You can tell your mutual friends what he did. But tell the whole truth, you gave money to Jaime in good faith, but he has no intention of paying you back and is treating it as a gift and is no longer your friend.

You can now move on and knowing the above, I'd not contact his parents or go to the bank. He will go lower than you, such as making an harassment claim to the gardai.

Sorry you came into the orbit of this punk.

24-01-2022 10:16am

The Garda behaviour is puzzling. He threw your bike out on the road .in defence of home one can only use force needed. Where was the need to throw your bike. If it was damaged would it be criminal damage.?

Harassment law says constantly calling contacting without lawful authority or reasonable excuse, .the op seems to have a reasonable excuse.

I would not involve the parents at all.

Not legal advice

StevenToast · 24-01-2022 11:50am

I think you might have to write this off unfortunately...

What an absolute scumbag...

I definitely would put in a formal complaint to the guards to have it on record.

24-01-2022 11:58am

I have a resonant story the details I won’t relate here, but simply to state you discover in time certain people transpire to be narcissists. They make you look a fool, but then comes the time of reckoning when they take a step too far. The stuff of stories and legends, but they very much exist in real life, your and my lives, and are unashamedly manipulative and not afraid of bleeding you dry if necessary.

kirving · 24-01-2022 2:26pm

While the Gardai can't be involved in civil matters like a debt repayment, it sounds to me like this Gard didn't want to get involved full stop, so fobbed you off.

Not a hope you'd be charged with trespass or harrasment IMO.

I'd be going back to the Garda station with a written account of everything to date, and ask them why the weren't interested in the criminal damage.

The good news is, that whether you get back what you're owed or not, he will continue his ways until he meets someone who sees him as a perfect target to exploit. They won't have a second thought about the Gards being involved when they want their money back.

24-01-2022 2:32pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118525442#Comment_118525442

The Gardai have their hands tied here. Yeah they could chase him over throwing the bike, but the OP was technically trespassing so who was really in the wrong blah blah.

They had no formal agreement in place for the money exchanged so all the other guy has to do is claim it was a gift & there’s nothing can be done.

im above in dublin Wednesday OP, if you give me half the cash I’ll go to his door myself for ye. Absolutely hate bullies.

edit: feel I should make it clear I’m not offering (seriously) to go to this randoms gaff for half the cash*

24-01-2022 2:42pm

"Harassment law says constantly calling contacting without lawful authority or reasonable excuse, .the op seems to have a reasonable excuse."

I think because of the lack of evidence of it not being a gift... it's deemed a gift. (Who buys someone lampshades without it being a gift for example?) and therefore Jaime can now say, he got a gift and the relationship has turned sour and he's the victim of harassment. I think the gardai have to side with Jaime if the OP turns up at his house, work or parents' place... therefore the OP needs to let it go. It's a lesson learned for the OP and all of us... only give someone money with no expectation it will come back... unless a legally binding agreement is in place.

Actually, OP - was it just bad luck you were there when he needed to pay the builders or did he call you over specifically at that time?

road_high · 24-01-2022 5:55pm

Not one bit surprised with the violent reaction unfortunately. OP I know it’s been over and over but I just can’t get my head around you giving the loan/s in the first place. Please never do something as stupid ever again.

My only suggestion is there anything that isn’t tied down at his property to ahem, “borrow”. I know this is illegal but if wants to fight dirty and all that…

I would just try the parents at least- I wouldn’t care less if they’re soft or not, if it meant getting my money back. Their son is their problem

jamesd · 24-01-2022 6:20pm

Id go to his parents and explain all that has happened - might get your money back.

How to get my money back from a (wealthy) friend.

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