BoJo banished - Liz Truss down. Is Rishi next for the toaster? **threadbans in OP**

You think lying should have no consequences? Do you us that model in all aspects of your life, do you apply that to everyone?

You also appear to be very much of the view that Johnson is completely powerless in all of this, simply being washed around by the power of others. The PM of the UK is, by your view, completely at the whim and mercy or others.

If that is true, isn't that really a scary thought? With Ukraine looming, we have a PM completely sidelined and compromised by others around him.

So was in ever in control? Was he merely a stooge for shadowy figures in the background?

If that is the lane you are picking it isn't a very good strategy

This is the bit that finishes him off politically. If he is still PM by the next general election, all Labour will have to do for their party political broadcast is play a few of his most unctuous appeals for compliance with the rules, then read out a few choice excerpts from the Sue Gray report. Even though hopefully by that stage we will be long out of the pandemic, the voters, even those who didn't agree with the restrictions at the time, will be infuriated all over again by his "Do as I say, not as I do" carry-on.

I'm not saying he is at the mercy of others - although he might well be. I am saying that the way leaks and the media are used to stir the people up for political ends is far more corrupt than anything Boris done. I don't think he partied like 'Caligula'. He probably obeyed most of the time like the rest of us. There are very few people on the planet who did not break the rules in minor ways. Seems the worst rule people can break is to get caught.

So what you're saying is that Johnson has done much worse, we just don't know about it?

You have cited the media, politicians and silly rules. Basically everyone else is to blame except the man that actually is responsible.

Of course it only got out because of a leak, in the same way that many crimes are only solved because of witnesses. Are you suggesting that criminals should have the right to perfect privacy and that they shouldn't be convicted because it was only due to someone leaking the evidence.

Take a step back from you defence of Johnson and just think about the knots you are tying yourself in.

I just cant see how he survives this but at the same time he has muddled his way through so much already it is a possibility :)

Do you know what was his actual lie to parliament? Was it something blatant or something where he could make a grey area and wriggle out of it?

Roles reversed, if Starmer was in power and the same set of events happened, would you have an issue with that?

One other point to note is many of the Tory leaning media outlets have changed from supporting Johnson and the Tories to hammering Johnson on the issue of parties and cover ups. Do you have an issue with that and what is their motivation for the pivots?

Caligula? What about Starmer coked and boozed out of his mind, stumbling over empty beer cans, vomiting half-digested beer over the balcony on top of the cleaner whilst pissing on himself and doing sodomy with the kitchen porter at the same time?

And that's also a big issue. The Sun didn't report on most of the party leaks because their Deputy Editor was at them because he was the Tories communications director or similar at the time. And over the last few years, the Tories have made use of media mouthpieces like Robert Peston and Laura Kuenssberg by just leaking the narrative the Tories wanted to push and reporting it with no journalistic review. Many media outlets are firmly in the pockets of whatever party are in power at any time.

But just because something is deemed a more or less important issue, doesn't mean it's not an issue which needs to be addressed. The numerous breaches of Covid rules, Ministerial Codes, and lying to the public about same makes the issue more serious than "cake and wine" and should still be addressed.

What? Your logic is so bizarrely backwards. They are being held to a higher standard because they are the leaders of a country and it has nothing to do with the leaks. When they decide the rules that they are foisting on everyone else don't apply to them the consequences of those actions are theirs and only theirs and have nothing to do with anyone who decides to leak those actions.