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Garda preparedness for mass shootings - Glenties incident (2020)

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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,369 ✭✭✭AyeGer


    Fu*ker though he was Rambo or something. I never heard of this when it happened. Hard to imagine he won't get some jail time for that.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,316 ✭✭✭mikethecop


    but not better than 2 on each district hq unit trained and with access to pistol and uzi for 24 hour cover


    i understand the twice yearly training was too expensive ......



  • Registered Users Posts: 22,334 ✭✭✭✭Esel


    if the eru had access to a helicopter they could deploy to rural areas more rapidly ,

    In the current incident in Donegal, where would the helicopter be based? How long would it take to load, then fly to Glenties?

    I would say if a helicopter-based armed response ever happens in this country, it will be a military helicopter carrying a load of Rangers.

    Not your ornery onager



  • Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]




  • Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    I believe the eru has access to aircorps Aw 139s helicopters,eru does all the civil jobs that includes emergencies including possible off shore tasks ,

    It's Seems they would be deployed over the rangers even though they train side by side



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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,316 ✭✭✭mikethecop


    yes i know 🙄

    neither is there trained local members like i said



  • Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Because that's what various reports over the years recommended. I would prefer to have a car of young well trained, well resourced, armed members, patrolling the country and responding to calls, 24/7, rather then relying on a local detective, who finishes work at 2am.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,316 ✭✭✭mikethecop


    not very reassuring or safe when they are roaming the county side 2 hours away though is it ......

    the members trained were usually on the regular and offered 24 hr cover in the event that they are required



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,486 ✭✭✭✭Strumms


    What if at McDonough shopping centre in Kilkenny was attacked by terrorists of whatever cause, guns, grenades etc.., knives… 8.50 on Thursday night…

    kilkenny / Carlow district have only 3 out of 27 stations open 24/7…Kilkenny, Thomastown and Carlow itself…

    be some job amassing enough armed Gardai to preserve life, to defend life, business and each other…

    there could be a massacre in the center and up Johns St before any great numbers would arrive.



  • Registered Users Posts: 22,334 ✭✭✭✭Esel



    Not your ornery onager



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  • Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    So you would prefer some guard on the regular to have access to a gun, rather then units of highly trained, highly armed members patrolling the country?

    You do know there are huge amounts of the country where people can be waiting hours for someone to come from the district hq at night time? Thanks to the reductions in districts. I would think any ASU would be there just as quick.



  • Registered Users Posts: 647 ✭✭✭eddie73


    There needs to be a weapon in each station with a trained Garda to use it. This trained Garda would by systematic in his approach. There would be no PTSD.



  • Registered Users Posts: 647 ✭✭✭eddie73





  • Registered Users Posts: 3,078 ✭✭✭salonfire


    There is


    Oh and sh1t, yes sh1t, is a cause of PTSD among our esteemed police force. Lookup the payment awarded to that particular proud member of the force.



  • Registered Users Posts: 220 ✭✭Black Noel


    When you're still playing imperialism you need plenty of armed cops 😆



  • Registered Users Posts: 220 ✭✭Black Noel


    The cops used G36s, which are large cumbersome looking weapons. You'd really have to wonder why the Germans need to produce such a weapon when the much more compact M4 is widely available and 30 years ahead of it. Even the Famas is a more compact weapon developed 20 years before the G36. The Garda MP7 is a much more compact weapon for city firearms units.



  • Registered Users Posts: 762 ✭✭✭starkid


    If i was a betting man i would say Ireland will eventually experience some sort of event like this with much worse outcomes. theres a rage building across Ireland, a culture shift as well. Irish exceptionalism saids things like that don't happen here. Ireland was a backwater for so long and also we had a different type of murdering scum in the RA who killed plenty. we're now like any normal western society. we have one of the lowest spends on justice and police in Western Europe iirc. we're seeing some of the lax attitude play out with the Russian stuff. we only have active patrolling armed gardai cause of the Regency bloodbath. and i''ve definitely seen less of those lads.

    Armed Gardai took 6 minutes to get to a man with an axe on the liffey boardwalk which wasn't reported but it was i think 2018/19. a pretty good response time i suppose. however the issue is there is absolutely **** all visible gardai even as a deterrent. a mass shooter would have plenty of time in Dublin to inflict casualty without being hampered by a garda.

    Was out in town the other night , Friday and i did not see 1 garda visibly patrolling the city centre outside of a vehicle from my walk from Ranalagh over Summerhill to Ballybough. the only few i did see drove down from fitzgibbon station after some crazed loon stood around screaming and jumping on cars naked for 30 minutes in PArnell street. try do that in some other cities and a swarm of police would get you before you'd got your willy out. Bear in mind you are talking about the city centre not the boondocks.

    I've been to places all around the World where active, visible and on foot ,(and armed) police are regular. even small enough towns. Here that would be seen to be too much. too overt, too black and tan or some such nonsense. Policing by consent etc.

    thank God its still a relatively safe place here in Ireland. for how much longer, who knows. again i live in Ballybough, theres an edge about. increasing prices, increasing isolation of communities, constant immigration/globalisation and a transient population of migrants (which i don't care, mostly EU but it leads to a different mindset and it changes Ireland for better or worse - see Sweden or read up on what is apparently happening with those deliveroo attacks).

    no doubt there will be people saying us speculating is pearl clutching. same sort of people who argue about experts saying the Russian drills are a real concern. we are sleepwalking into the issues. 6 stabbings including a murder in the space of a month last year should have been a fire to light peoples arses about issues. but no it was ignored.

    Gun crime in IReland is higher per capita than the UK.



  • Posts: 1,010 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I suspect if a mass shooting outside a city in Ireland, the first responders will be locals..community alert txt...armed with tools shotguns and .22s. Maybe lucky and have a detective nearby with a pistol. The lad in th3 story maybe not, but if the perp enters a school for example locals will respond



  • Registered Users Posts: 40,458 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail




  • Registered Users Posts: 647 ✭✭✭eddie73


    That would be messy. You could end up with a long jail term regardless of the circumstance, or more importantly, no negotiation training in defusing the situation. The incident in Glenties would appear to be a one off. The person in question will not get much mercy from the justice system if the details are correct. Cocaine, booze and then a bit of medal of honour around the town for afters.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 6,673 ✭✭✭Feisar


    I would have thought a MP7 would be enough gun in an urban environment. Just looked it up, Wiki says effective range of 200m. Sure I wouldn't have the warn fuzzy feeling an old school FN gives but it'd still be adequate for the job. Yer man had a bolt action rifle in anything from 22-250 up to some sort of 338 magnum. Sure these rifles have 1000 yard type ranges but one would want to know what they were at to make hits at that distance. Again he was in a town so range will be limited, max effective range is sort of a moot point.

    Can someone tell me what a high powered rifle is?

    First they came for the socialists...



  • Registered Users Posts: 40,458 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    it was the rifle he used for hunting deer so .308 or similar. Similar to the round the army used in the FN FAL.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,673 ✭✭✭Feisar


    And one can get a deer licence on a 22-250 although 6mm and up is preferred. So 243 and up. Actually a 6mm or 6.5mm is ballistically superior at distance due to their higher ballistic coefficient.

    First they came for the socialists...



  • Posts: 0 Aldo Clean Hoagie


    They just do training and whatnot on their downtime but they’re basically sitting ready to go at any time.

    To my knowledge they have absolutely nothing to do with the “regular” Gardai and while they’re stationed in regional barracks they would be in a part of it that’s reserved just for them and their equipment etc. all of it is tied to each ASU member individually and it’s their job to mind it so they keep them well away from the normies.



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,400 ✭✭✭BrianD3


    Re: the 1000 yard range, the point I was making was not that he could deliberately aim at and hit something at that distance but to show how drunkenly shooting in random directions could kill someone a long distance away. I just looked it up and a 308 has about 4 times the KE at 1000 yards as a 22 lr has at the muzzle. And a 22 lr is more than capable of killing or maiming at short range.

    I agree that MP7s and the likes are good for the Gardai. They don't need to be taking long shots and it's likely that mass shooters will be poor marksmen and looking to "spray and pray" at short range.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,316 ✭✭✭mikethecop


    yes i would, it would be safer for the garda and provide a better service to the public. the issue was the cost

    you would be very very wrong . any where outside the motorway network in rural areas can be difficult and slow to get to. some one in a district is obviously going to be faster and safer to react to an serious armed incident , not to mention the likely hood that a local resource might be in a better position to deal with it due to knowing the personalities involved rather than some highly trained dude from 2 hours away .

    hard to understand your position on this tbh



  • Posts: 1,010 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I was more considering a terrorist attack. there would be no point in negotiation. the above situation, people would just seek cover and wait it out.

    Yes it would be very messy.



  • Registered Users Posts: 40,458 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    hard to understand your position on this tbh

    not that hard to understand. they are defending their employer.



  • Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Because the ASU are stationed in stations around the country. It's not difficult to understand at all. If there is an incident in rural Cavan/Monaghan for example, why would a detective from Cavan be quicker getting to it then an asu from Cavan? Same in many parts of the country.

    issue wasn't cost, the issue was having a highly trained armed support available 24/7. Detectives currently still carry and therefore still have training, those costs didn't disappear. Detectives will eventually be working 9-5, that's the way things are going

    ASU provide cover 24/7, unfortunately in rural Ireland ,there might be one car with uniformed members covering hundreds of square miles. The addition of Armed Support Units to the force can only be considered a good thing.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,316 ✭✭✭mikethecop


    there is no kind or amount of training that can counter PTSD



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