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BoJo banished - Liz Truss down. Is Rishi next for the toaster? **threadbans in OP**

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  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,642 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    I'm not. I'm interpreting why Johnson sneered at the notions of having Saville's crimes investigated and giving my opinion.


    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Registered Users Posts: 33,620 ✭✭✭✭Penn


    Starmer apologised on behalf of the CPS, as the Head of the CPS. That doesn't mean he was involved in the decisions made in individual cases.

    Johnson was directly involved in several of the No.10 parties and has only apologised each time it's been proven that he lied about them previously. He's doing everything possible to refuse to take responsibility for his own actions and decisions. Right now, he could admit his failures, apologise and take responsibility, but instead he's hiding behind the police investigation (even though the investigation doesn't prevent him from answering questions in Parliament provided he's telling the truth), will only admit to what he has to, and will then bloviate about having to move on and move forward.



  • Registered Users Posts: 26,492 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    Johnson has some form for criticising child sex abuse investigations when the suspects are white, but being more keen on them when they are not.



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,863 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    Won't matter to the rabbit hole burrowers what any of us say but here are the facts anyway.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Have you actual evidence to back this extreme claim up?

    The insinuation is that you believe Boris Johnson is sympathetic to white paedophiles.

    Say what you like about Johnson's remarks to Keir Starmer, but your claim has even less evidence and is even more extreme in comparison.



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  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,479 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    You mean evidence like this?

    Where he viewed spending money on investigating Historic abuse cases (Operation Yew Tree et al) as "money spaffed against a wall"

    Using a slang term for violent male ejaculation to downplay the importance of investigating male child sex abusers really does show genuine class , it really does.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    That wasn't the argument made.

    Personally speaking, I think Johnson is spot on there; it's a waste of resources. But that's another debate.

    The argument was that Johnson was somehow more sympathetic to "white" paedophiles. It's an absurd conclusion - and there's not a shred of evidence in favour of it, either.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 20,350 Mod ✭✭✭✭Weepsie


    Lets not forget, elsewhere on this boards, eskimo tried to compare Marcus Rashford to Jimmy SAville and Jeffrey Epstein. He picks strange sides when it comes to truly terrible people


    And no surprise. Claims of no evidence, evidence given. Goalposts moved to say that's not what was being said.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,642 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    Of course. When it's a black man doing charity work, it's outrageous and then Saville gets invoked. But when it comes to investigating Saville it's somehow a "waste of resources". Says it all.

    But yes, this is getting off topic. We've known for years that Johnson is a creature devoid of all morals so it's not surprising that he'd sneer at any sort of investigation like that.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Registered Users Posts: 33,620 ✭✭✭✭Penn


    So it's a waste of resources to investigate historical child sex abuse cases, but also Starmer is responsible for an actual investigation into Savile not producing enough evidence to warrant a prosecution even though Starmer wasn't involved in that investigation or decision?



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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I'm not arguing in favour of the merits or demerits of what Johnson said; all I'm doing is pointing to Keir Starmer's apology where he accepted "full responsibility" for the matter.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,275 ✭✭✭km991148


    It's certainly an interesting view point for such a keen defender or womens rights, especially given the amount of young women that those investigations covered.



  • Registered Users Posts: 33,620 ✭✭✭✭Penn


    You're not arguing in favour of the merits or demerits of what Johnson said?

    "Personally speaking, I think Johnson is spot on there" - You, 21 minutes earlier



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,604 ✭✭✭✭Leroy42


    Exactly, and that was the intended point of what Johnson said. He doesn't want you to actually care whether what he said was right or wrong, but the focus should be on Starmer, or the media, or something something.

    Whataboutery at its finest. I asked earlier, but I'll ask you. What reason do you think Johnson raised the Saville story up during a discussion about NO 10 parties and breaking of Covid laws?



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,758 ✭✭✭Bobtheman


    The Tory Party remind me of FG in the 1990s. Too quick to stab their leader in the back.

    Dumping a leader rarely leads to electoral success though it worked last time for the tories.

    What i can't understand is why the tories are panicking so much. Is the possibility of poor local elections really a cause to dump a leader given they are more than 2 years away from an e



  • Registered Users Posts: 891 ✭✭✭erlichbachman


    shocking treatment of Boris, he'd a few scoops after work during lockdown, no big deal, now every sad covid case has been regurgitated as if it was the big man's fault



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,863 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    Sorry new guy but a bunch of people tried that silly wind up pages back already.



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,479 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    Isn't it refreshing to see a leader accept responsibility for something that happened on their watch , even if in this specific case they had absolutely no role whatsoever in the issue in question?

    Compare that to Boris Johnson who continues to refuse to accept responsibility for flagrant misbehaviour despite being neck deep in the actions of a breach of the prevailing law of the land - Laws that his administration brought I might add.

    Polar opposite examples of Leadership there for all to see.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,793 ✭✭✭Ahwell


    Except you just made that "he accepted "full responsibility" for the matter" crap up. What he actually said was “I would like to take the opportunity to apologise for the shortcomings in the part played by the CPS (Crown Prosecution Service) in these cases. If this report and my apology are to serve their full purpose, then this must be seen as a watershed moment,” - big difference.



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,863 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    Whatever about whether Johnson made stuff up to distract I can tell you Eskimo definitely will make anything up to distract from the true topic.

    If ye don't just ignore it this thread will spiral into a never ending loop of semantics with ever moving goalposts.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 891 ✭✭✭erlichbachman


    Not actually a wind up, old guy, believe it or not some of us on here don't really see the big deal, and find the wheeling out of covid sad stories in order to win points is rather disgusting.



  • Registered Users Posts: 33,620 ✭✭✭✭Penn


    Johnson backing down on his comments regarding Savile:

    "I want to be very clear about this because a lot of people have got very hot under the collar," Johnson told broadcasters.

    "I'm talking not about the leader of the opposition's personal record when he was when he was DPP and I totally understand that he had nothing to do personally with those decisions."

    “I was making a point about his responsibility for the organisation as a whole. I do want to clarify that.”

    Of course, why else would Johnson have brought up Jimmy Savile otherwise? Starmer wasn't involved in the investigation into Starmer (which Johnson now accepts) but Johnson is directly involved in the parties/gatherings at No.10. How else does it possibly make any sense in the context of the questions he was responding to? And how will Johnson's supporters who defended Johnson's comments now continue to do so even though Johnson himself has now said that he wasn't talking about Starmer's record or involvement in that case?



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,286 ✭✭✭Kalyke


    Well the Tories certainly have the monopoly of the "happy" Covid stories with their Billion pound PPE contracts to their cronies etc.



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,863 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    What a load of nonsense. No one will believe a bit of this except the people who will pretend to.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,642 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    Doesn't matter. He's dropped the dead cat. It's done it's job and nobody cares about the aftermath.

    Conservatives lie. There's not a single one of the cabinet who has shown an ounce of integrity or decency throughout this mess.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Conservatives lie.

    No.

    People lie; regardless of what political party they belong to or support.

    This blanket hatred for conservatives is frighteningly unhealthy.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,642 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    People do indeed lie but the modern Tory party has had an industrial-scale upgrade in their output.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,479 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    Add to that the fact that they no longer care if people know they're lying either.

    In the past when politicians were caught out lying it had consequences , not so much any more it seems for the Tories and others.

    Lying is perfectly fine as long as it is in the pursuit or retention of power. That's all that matters to them any more.



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  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,642 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    Yep. You could argue that this is the purest form of conservatism the United Kingdom has ever seen. Any pretence at giving a crap about national security, the people or even religion of all things has just been abandoned in favour of base venality and deceit. There's no intellect, no heart, no honour and no sense of duty. Johnson fancies himself as Churchill but while the latter was also an unapologetic racist imperialist, he did possess a sense of duty and a work ethic. Siring illegitimate children seems to be the only thing Alexander cares about.

    The Economist ran a piece hailing Johnson as being the most honest Tory (in his own way). I don't think that this is what they meant.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



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