Limerick Northern Distributor Road Plan

phog · 12-02-2021 9:28am

Mc Love wrote: »

Fine

https://twitter.com/sasanovak48/status/1359122193372901379?s=20

One tweet about a meeting that took place before the row - did any of the Greens and I include the Green TD here meaningfully engage with the Moyross residents once they tried to stall Phase 1 of the road?

3 of them went down to Westfields in the middle of the row over the road to make a video clip on how important Westfields is but couldn't be bothered meeting with the residents of Moyross.

banie01 · 12-02-2021 9:32am

phog wrote: »

One councillor - did any of the Greens and I include the Green TD here meaningfully engage with the Moyross residents once they tried to stall Phase 1 of the road?

3 of them went down to Westfields in the middle of the row over the road to make a video clip on how important Westfields is but couldn't be bothered meeting with the residents of Moyross.

Did Novak also switch her Social Media to private and stop engaging when she was called out on the above?
Or was that beforehand?

phog · 12-02-2021 9:35am

mdmix wrote: »

what like 10, 12? in an urban area of 100k, how many is loads?

This is what you said

In Limerick, you either live with your parents until your 30s or share a house in the suburbs and are forced to drive to work

So don't be getting snotty now about how many I'd know out of the population of the city.

breezy1985 · 12-02-2021 9:53am

phog wrote: »

One councillor - did any of the Greens and I include the Green TD here meaningfully engage with the Moyross residents once they tried to stall Phase 1 of the road?

3 of them went down to Westfields in the middle of the row over the road to make a video clip on how important Westfields is but couldn't be bothered meeting with the residents of Moyross.

Their dail candidate for county Limerick in the last election has left the party because she says she had warned top brass to not block the road after a number of meeting with the locals. Green chair for the area stepped down for the same reason so greens were engaging it's just the top ones didn't listen

banie01 · 12-02-2021 10:32am

breezy1985 wrote: »

Their dail candidate for county Limerick in the last election has left the party because she says she had warned top brass to not block the road after a number of meeting with the locals. Green chair for the area stepped down for the same reason so greens were engaging it's just the top ones didn't listen

Just on that, yes there was engagement from certain green party members.
Those members were told to toe the party line, and didn't.
Their conscience stood at odds with what was ordered.

No elected green representative had such qualms and some went so far as to spin fairy tales of community engagement in support of their stance.

Sasa Novak for example put her social media on private for a period, yet is now acting like the party was in favour all along!

Sheer hypocrisy.
Waffle regarding cross party support, when the only opposition to the scheme were her party!

https://twitter.com/sasanovak48/status/1359588338219515911?s=19

https://twitter.com/sasanovak48/status/1359449689880473600?s=19

Crystalsun · 12-02-2021 10:52am

I can't understand why Greens didn't get involved earlier in the process ( which is it ? incompetence or sleepiness?) Afterall its on the drawings since 2009).

Apart from the fact that the link was necessary and is the only positive thing to come out of Limerick Regeneration, the Greens could have contributed something to this project by demanding land use stipulations the entire length of the road , in the spirit of
transport oriented development thinking . But they don't think and they missed the boat. They just take orders from aliens.

On balance ,this road is Hyde Rd or Brookeville avenue on speed( because of the bus lanes ) really beautiful roads by the way , especially around Autumn time.
God speed the work and keep everyone safe.

banie01 · 12-02-2021 11:12am

Crystalsun wrote: »

I can't understand why Greens didn't get involved earlier in the process ( lincompetence, sleepiness, ?).

Apart from the fact that the link was necessary and is only positive thing to coome out of LImerick Regeneration, the Greens could have contributed to something to this project by demanding land use stipulations the entire length of the Road , in the spirit of
transport oriented development thinking . But they don't think and they missed the boat. They just take orders from aliens.

On balance ,this road is Hyde Rd or Brookeville avenue on speed( because of the bus lanes )
God speed the work and keep all everyone safe.

The Coonagh - Moyross - Knocknalisheen project in its was signed off by a Green minister and was supported by his department through its planning.

The issue isn't that the Greens didn't get involved, it's that they threw an entire community under the bus (ironically) for idealogy rather than even attempt to understand the visceral sense of abandonment in the community or the vital need for this road in conjunction with the other measures.

Crystalsun · 12-02-2021 11:39am

banie01 wrote: »

The Coonagh - Moyross - Knocknalisheen project in its was signed off by a Green minister and was supported by his department through its planning.

The issue isn't that the Greens didn't get involved, it's that they threw an entire community under the bus (ironically) for idealogy rather than even attempt to understand the visceral sense of abandonment in the community or the vital need for this road in conjunction with the other measures.

In that case we have a pretty incompetent Government people if they ignored best practice when designing infrastructure in the 21st century. Ireland.

And I assume they've included a trunk water main , foul sewer and Gas in the contract.?? even if they forget about houses

Cookiemunster · 12-02-2021 11:51am

Crystalsun wrote: »

I can't understand why Greens didn't get involved earlier in the process ( which is it ? incompetence or sleepiness?) Afterall its on the drawings since 2009).

Apart from the fact that the link was necessary and is the only positive thing to come out of Limerick Regeneration, the Greens could have contributed something to this project by demanding land use stipulations the entire length of the road , in the spirit of
transport oriented development thinking . But they don't think and they missed the boat. They just take orders from aliens.

On balance ,this road is Hyde Rd or Brookeville avenue on speed( because of the bus lanes ) really beautiful roads by the way , especially around Autumn time.
God speed the work and keep everyone safe.

Crystalsun wrote: »

In that case we have a pretty incompetent Government people if they ignored best practice when designing infrastructure in the 21st century. Ireland.

What on earth are you talking about? What best practice has been ignored? The Greens weren't in governmet during the time this project was being conceived and planned. In fact they barely even had any TDs. Never mind councillors.

This whole route has footpaths and cycle lanes along its entire length ans upgrades the existing roads to have the same. It will allow buses to run through Moyross. What more do you want?

Also that's the first time I've ever heard Hyde Rd described as beautiful. It's quite the opposite in fact in most peoples opinions.

banie01 · 12-02-2021 12:11pm

Cookiemunster wrote: »

What on earth are you talking about? What best practice has been ignored? The Greens weren't in governmet during the time this project was being conceived and planned. In fact they barely even had any TDs. Never mind councillors.

Gormley was Minister for Transport environment, heritage and local government. from 2007 to 2011, the conception, initial planning and sign offs were all on the Green watch.
It's hiatus was unfortunate, but its current use as a football by the greens is at odds with the original support offered.

**Edit**
Corrected Gormleys ministry.

Cookiemunster · 12-02-2021 12:19pm

For some reason I though that government was gone before 2011. I knew Bertie resigned in 2008 but I didn't realise that Cowen (and his government) lasted 3 years :eek:

Crystalsun · 12-02-2021 12:55pm

Cookiemunster wrote: »

What on earth are you talking about? What best practice has been ignored? The Greens weren't in governmet during the time this project was being conceived and planned. In fact they barely even had any TDs. Never mind councillors.

This whole route has footpaths and cycle lanes along its entire length ans upgrades the existing roads to have the same. It will allow buses to run through Moyross. What more do you want?

Also that's the first time I've ever heard Hyde Rd described as beautiful. It's quite the opposite in fact in most peoples opinions.

Plans for housing/ offices / factories / hospitals along its axis for instance and after 14 years there's not even a plan.

Don't be using the Greens as some sort of straw man . The Green agenda is not about enhancing the quality of life for people. Its about impoverishing the masses something they tried to do.

And Hyde Road and Brookeville avenue ARE best practice when it comes to Transport Oriented Development. Both designed and buuilt before a green hedgehog ever surfaced.

jpharvey · 12-02-2021 1:25pm

adaminho wrote: »

The worst thing is I have Coke bike's at the end of both Street's but the closest I can can get to work in the Crescent is Mary I!

Are the Coke bikes still up and running?
Didn't know there was no stand at the Crescent, would've thought that was a really obvious place to put one.

breezy1985 · 12-02-2021 3:41pm

jpharvey wrote: »

Are the Coke bikes still up and running?
Didn't know there was no stand at the Crescent, would've thought that was a really obvious place to put one.

Ya still going and ya the crescent and UHL seem like obvious destinations

phog · 12-02-2021 3:45pm

jpharvey wrote: »

Are the Coke bikes still up and running?
Didn't know there was no stand at the Crescent, would've thought that was a really obvious place to put one.

One stand at the Crescent isn't enough but yes, the bike scheme should have been extended beyond the city centre long before now.

This is my first year not rejoining the scheme, with working from home and the scheme not being extended I thought it was time to give up on them, though I have to say I've missed it a few times already but town is small enough to walk around anyway.

stefanovich · 12-02-2021 4:07pm

Cookiemunster wrote: »

Also that's the first time I've ever heard Hyde Rd described as beautiful. It's quite the opposite in fact in most peoples opinions.

Was home to the cheapest house in Ireland at one point.

Side note: Criminals sure are good at getting google to blur their houses.

stefanovich · 12-02-2021 4:10pm

Cookiemunster wrote: »

Also that's the first time I've ever heard Hyde Rd described as beautiful. It's quite the opposite in fact in most peoples opinions.

The road is not bad - with the grass verges and the trees etc. Just the burnt out houses, criminals and RAT graffitti is off putting.

jbkenn · 12-02-2021 4:13pm

Wondering who erected the big "Build our Road" sign on the roundabout at the exit from Tesco Coonagh?, who funded it?, and who gave permission to erect it?

Cookiemunster · 12-02-2021 4:16pm

jbkenn wrote: »

Wondering who erected the big "Build our Road" sign on the roundabout at the exit from Tesco Coonagh?, who funded it?, and who gave permission to erect it?

I would say the locals for the first two questions and nobody for the last.

breezy1985 · 12-02-2021 4:20pm

jbkenn wrote: »

Wondering who erected the big "Build our Road" sign on the roundabout at the exit from Tesco Coonagh?, who funded it?, and who gave permission to erect it?

A couple popped up in Moyross too and a van

jpharvey · 12-02-2021 9:25pm

Poxyshamrock wrote: »

Nice to see that the road has been delivered for the people of Moyross a US-based private hospital.

Looking into that today, I'm feeling a slight sense of unease about that myself. Apart from the fact it came out of nowhere, the company doesn't seem to have the best rep in the US.

adaminho · 12-02-2021 10:56pm

jpharvey wrote: »

Are the Coke bikes still up and running?
Didn't know there was no stand at the Crescent, would've thought that was a really obvious place to put one.

breezy1985 wrote: »

Ya still going and ya the crescent and UHL seem like obvious destinations

The closest to the Crescent S.C. is Mary I . The closet to U.L. is Lock quay. The closest to LIT is Clancy strand!

Crystalsun · 12-02-2021 11:43pm

adaminho wrote: »

The closest to the Crescent S.C. is Mary I . The closet to U.L. is Lock quay. The closest to LIT is Clancy strand!

And another thing...Are we expected to bring our own helmet? or is there magical invisible protective shield around them when you mount them.

And if people en masse use these contraptions without helmets , is it not a terrible example to set for kids.

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/1220-killed-or-seriously-injured-in-london-road-accidents-over-three-months-a4069436.html

I wonder how many were spontaneous cyclists on a BORIS bike without a helmet, or the well seasoned commuter cyclist with all the gear. From what Ive seen here in London , I'd venture that the former well outnumber the latter.

breezy1985 · 13-02-2021 1:30am

Crystalsun wrote: »

And another thing...Are we expected to bring our own helmet? or is there magical invisible protective shield around them when you mount them.

And if people en masse use these contraptions without helmets , is it not a terrible example to set for kids.

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/1220-killed-or-seriously-injured-in-london-road-accidents-over-three-months-a4069436.html

I wonder how many were spontaneous cyclists on a BORIS bike without a helmet, or the well seasoned commuter cyclist with all the gear. From what Ive seen here in London , I'd venture that the former well outnumber the latter.

Some people do bring helmets but not many and they are not a legal requirement. Out of 1220 people seriously injured or killed 280 were cyclists according to that report.

Most were because of cars not the type of bike used so its the bad car drivers are the ones setting the terrible example for the kids

Crystalsun · 13-02-2021 9:52am

breezy1985 wrote: »

Some people do bring helmets but not many and they are not a legal requirement. Out of 1220 people seriously injured or killed 280 were cyclists according to that report.

Most were because of cars not the type of bike used so its the bad car drivers are the ones setting the terrible example for the kids

Don't twist it for an agenda. No where in that report does it say that most of 280 cyclists KSI were because of cars.

Check the officiall report online from TFL.

mdmix · 13-02-2021 10:13am

Crystalsun wrote: »

And another thing...Are we expected to bring our own helmet? or is there magical invisible protective shield around them when you mount them.

And if people en masse use these contraptions without helmets , is it not a terrible example to set for kids.

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/1220-killed-or-seriously-injured-in-london-road-accidents-over-three-months-a4069436.html

I wonder how many were spontaneous cyclists on a BORIS bike without a helmet, or the well seasoned commuter cyclist with all the gear. From what Ive seen here in London , I'd venture that the former well outnumber the latter.

All categories up, not just cycling. From the article:

“There is concern that TfL is consistently failing to spend money set aside to make roads safer.”

Safer cycling infrastructure not only increases cycling numbers, it saves lives. Graphic from different article

Crystalsun · 13-02-2021 10:35am

mdmix wrote: »

All categories up, not just cycling. From the article:

“There is concern that TfL is consistently failing to spend money set aside to make roads safer.”

Safer cycling infrastructure not only increases cycling numbers, it saves lives. Graphic from different article

Thanks for that . .
However, its the importance of helmets in saving lives that I'm highlighting Coke bikes and Boris Bikes don't advance that culture. Cars ( willl be cars and unless we ban them there'll be no change ( and probably a worse situation when self driving cars come).

Two things can happen when you come off a bike. You grip the handles and end up ramming your head against the road in front of you. Or you let go handle bars and do a superman, whereby you ram both pams against the road , driving force through your radius bone and smashing open the radial cup bones in both your elbows.

You can do something about former , less so about the latter. Please wear a helmet at all times. not because anyone says so , it's because bone is softer than concrete and you never know when they come face to face.

breezy1985 · 13-02-2021 10:53am

Crystalsun wrote: »

Thanks for that . .
However, its the importance of helmets in saving lives that I'm highlighting Coke bikes and Boris Bikes don't advance that culture. Cars ( willl be cars and unless we ban them there'll be no change ( and probably a worse situation when self driving cars come).

Two things can happen when you come off a bike. You grip the handles and end up ramming your head against the road in front of you. Or you let go handle bars and do a superman, whereby you ram both pams against the road , driving force through your radius bone and smashing open the radial cup bones in both your elbows.

You can do something about former , less so about the latter. Please wear a helmet at all times. not because anyone says so , it's because bone is softer than concrete and you never know when they come face to face.

Absolute BS I have had plenty of crashes where I didnt hit my head or break any bones. You clearly have an agenda against cycling and are trying to push it with a fake "wont somebody think of the children" argument.
I did read the article above wrong and it said "A TfL report said that more cyclists were killed or seriously injured as a result of collisions with cars" not most but the article still gives no other info on the nature of the incidents or a link to the report

we are probably starting to annoy people now but there are a million threads about this on the cycling forum where I would be happy to keep going

Crystalsun · 13-02-2021 11:26am

breezy1985 wrote: »

You clearly have an agenda against cycling and are trying to push it with a fake "wont somebody think of the children"

Well "I" have children and I think about them. It's not fake.

yop · 13-02-2021 11:02pm

mod note: back on track please. Take it to the cycling forum

Red Silurian · 13-02-2021 11:34pm

jpharvey wrote: »

the company doesn't seem to have the best rep in the US.

Limericks politicians will welcome them with open arms so

Brennans Row · 04-11-2021 8:24pm

Europe’s newest university town could transform the mid-west (Irish Times)

Ed Walsh

Marking its fiftieth anniversary, the University of Limerick (UL) is once again planning a most dramatic initiative to restructure itself academically and physically as a knowledge-age institution. It is planning Europe’s newest university town on an extension of its campus in County Clare.

The first phases of campus development took place on the south side of the Shannon, the second on adjoining lands to the north. Purchase of land in Clare commenced in the 90s, and, with the construction of two bridges, the campus of over 16,000 students now magnificently straddles the Shannon … one part in Limerick, the other in Clare.

In 2011 Clare County Council (CCC) zoned land for university development and in 2016 UL and CCC commenced discussions to explore how the presence of UL could act as a catalyst for economic and social development, regionally and nationally.

The board consulted widely and produced its plan within a year. The plan was unanimously approved by the elected members of Clare County Council in April 2018.

The university town would be developed on a 260-acre site, as an extension of UL’s northern campus, and be designated as a Strategic Development Zone (SDZ).

While the SDZ lands are in Clare they are in the as-yet undeveloped north-eastern segment of the greater Limerick urban zone. The new university town will act as a catalyst for the development of this neglected area.

**********************************************************************************************************************

The Limerick Northern Distributor Road is clearly denoted as the main access route in the image above.

phog · 05-11-2021 9:13am

Surely the Greens will have a train station or two on campus before they leave government, I mean they're promising them everywhere else so probably UL deserves mention too. Add to that a multi lane cycle track connecting UL to Limerick, Killaloe and to Nenagh so that they'll be no need for additional road access to UL.

Glenomra · 05-11-2021 9:40am

Ed also mentioned that the new town will have a Marina and a Michelin star restaurant can't wait. That's the end of Enzos for me!!!!

05-11-2021 8:10pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118121831#Comment_118121831

Ed also mentioned they are planning an electric tram between UL and TUS (formerly LIT), so it sounds like they are planning for it without the road if needs be...

breezy1985 · 09-11-2021 9:43am

"neglected area" it's just farm land it's no more or less neglected than every other farmland in Ireland

A2LUE42 · 02-02-2022 11:56pm

I see Eamon Ryan is at it again.

Limerick Leader: Phase two of major Limerick road project is put in doubt by Transport Minister.

https://www.limerickleader.ie/news/home/734959/phase-two-of-major-limerick-road-project-is-put-in-doubt-by-transport-minister.html

breezy1985 · 03-02-2022 8:45am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118573687#Comment_118573687

In fairness if you read it his point is that growing more into Clare is bad for Limerick which it is. I still think they should build the road but he ain't wrong on that point.

There is also no actual new news in the article as the road isn't currently scheduled to be built so it's just clickbait from the LL

Cookiemunster · 03-02-2022 8:46am

I wouldn't be too bothered about Ryan or anything he says. He was 100% against the Coonagh to Knockalisheen part too, but was very quickly put back in his box. This road is being pushed by the councils, so won't be canned my him and he'll be well out of office (and possibly the Dail) before it gets anywhere near needing funding for construction.

phog · 03-02-2022 8:49am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118574199#Comment_118574199

That would be my view too, he's stirring for the sake of stirring so his supporters can feel good about themselves but overall he'll have very little say in the road.

breezy1985 · 03-02-2022 9:14am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118574199#Comment_118574199

This road is probably 2 daily terms away at least so ya he is only grandstanding and it will probably play well in his constituency in Dublin. If I was Leddin Ide be worried about it though.

As for being put back in his box he certainly was and no one should forget the Greens are only the little ones in government. It's FF and FG who have been in power for years and couldn't be bothered building needed ring roads and motorways around Limerick.

Mc Love · 03-02-2022 9:39am

I dont think building the LNDR will achieve anything other than more traffic

breezy1985 · 03-02-2022 9:59am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118574408#Comment_118574408

Unless used in conjunction with with changes to road use in other areas like the promised bus lane over Sarsfield bridge which is reliant on LNDR.

Also these new roads are good for more than just cars as they will have cycle lanes which most of the old streets are currently too small for.

My biggest gripe with the Greens is that they didn't try implement a national minimum standard for cycle lanes on new build roads to avoid the shtty tarmac footpaths we got round Moyross and Monaleen.

03-02-2022 10:04am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118574408#Comment_118574408

Where would all this extra traffic come from?

phog · 03-02-2022 10:27am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118574527#Comment_118574527

You are probably going to get a link that will show you something about induced demand - we have a population of ~5m the majority of it being East Coast/Dublin based so unless we get drivers from all over the country heading to Limerick just to drive around our lovely new roads then the concept of induced demand isn't really relevant to Ireland or the mid west region in particular.

03-02-2022 10:59am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118574630#Comment_118574630

That's exactly what I was thinking. Just because the LNDR exists doesn't mean the good people of Moyross are going to trade in their sulkies for cars.

Cetyl Palmitate · 03-02-2022 7:07pm

Cycle lanes on the LNDR are pretty useless and I doubt will be used much. Its a ring road. people on bikes have no use for ring roads in general. One benefit of a bike is to go the most direct route. There are not many places, from what I can see, on the proposed LNDR you cannot already get to on a bike using existing routes.

Cetyl Palmitate · 03-02-2022 7:13pm

Do you think the number of cars in the city will stay the same in the next number of years?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118574775#Comment_118574775

breezy1985 · 03-02-2022 7:54pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118577623#Comment_118577623

Well I will be using that cycle lane going in 2 of it's many directions and ya it's crap but less crap than all the useless drivers on the road

phog · 03-02-2022 8:23pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118577623#Comment_118577623

If the LNDR links from Knocklisheen onwards to/towards UL it would have a permanent cycle lane between the north side of the city and LIT to UL and the canal Greenway whenever that opens up

Limerick Northern Distributor Road Plan

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