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Ireland Team Talk XII: Farrell's First Fifteen

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Comments

  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Is the Andy Farrell press confrence going to publically streamed?



  • Subscribers Posts: 41,863 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    Casey / Doak are not as good as JGP... so not a like for like choice

    Henshaw injured. Aki is better than Hume or Frawley... so not a like for like choice

    Earls injured, Hansen obviously playing better in camp than Balacoune... all the rest not in the squad...


    Personally i prefer to have our best available plyers on the pitch because, believe it or not, international test rugby is a bloody hard game to play. There is no player starting on saturday that does not deserve to be there.



  • Registered Users Posts: 195 ✭✭EachSmallChime


    You should make apologies for your opinion because it's pretty toxic and outdated at this stage. You must be very new to international rugby to be giving out about players who aren't Irish enough for you.

    The conversation has been had, move on.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,194 ✭✭✭Must love hardship


    Obviously I don't see the training I'm only going on my limited watching of pro 14 and h Cup games. Fair play to him for taking his opportunity

    I'm sure it's a very proud day for hansen and his family.

    But I think farrell made a mistake not including a zebo or a J o'brien when Lowe got injured late before the squad announcement. I said it at the time there was only 1 player who regularly plays on the left wing in the squad and that's hansen and his defence is very sketchy and he is very unproven.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,194 ✭✭✭Must love hardship


    Yeah very new. Only started watching in the late 80's early 90's I didnt like it when the Australian Brian Smith played 10 for ireland back then either.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,541 ✭✭✭Luckycharm




  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ Alessandro Vast Numskull


    There real entry level job - 5 years experience needed vibes off of this



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,859 ✭✭✭ionadnapokot


    Where does Mack Hansen's moustache rank amongst the greatest in Irish rugby?

    Post 1899 & Pre Movember

    1. Phil Orr
    2. Donal Lenihan
    3. Willie Anderson
    4. Donal Spring
    5. Nigel Carr
    6. Mack Hansen?
    7. Mick Doyle
    8. Des Fitzgerald
    9. David Irwin
    10. Philip Rainey


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,225 ✭✭✭✭Clegg


    From Farrell's pressed conference. Some injuries were picked up in camp. Looks like Earls is having issues with his hamstring and requires a scan. Herring also picked up a calf injury. Baloucoune missed some training sessions last week with a small niggle. Henderson and Henshaw should hopefully be fit for France. The latter was actually ok for selection this weekend, but Aki and Ringrose were selected ahead of him.




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  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ Everleigh Freezing Oasis


    If Henderson is in full training I find it really weird he's not even on the bench.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,654 ✭✭✭beggars_bush


    Not surprising with number of schools, clubs and general population in leinster



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,952 ✭✭✭TRC10


    Just listening to BOD on OTB

    Why does everyone think Mack Hansen is left footed?



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,194 ✭✭✭Must love hardship


    Agreed Will be some craic when Mike catt and farrell find out hes right footed Saturday

    Post edited by Must love hardship on


  • Registered Users Posts: 595 ✭✭✭jimdemp


    BOD doesnt watch much rugby to be fair. Id say hes always got something on so just repeats what he hears in the media. He is out of touch with the game in many areas but gets by on his big profile



  • Registered Users Posts: 595 ✭✭✭jimdemp


    Doris is from Mayo, Aki and park are Kiwis, Hanson is a aussie with a cork mum.

    Where did you get 13 from ???????????



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,225 ✭✭✭✭Clegg


    Bernard Jackman and Murray Kinsella made some good points on Ireland's attack in the 42 Rugby podcast this afternoon. We don't have the luxury of springing a new attacking shape on our opponents for the Six Nations. We might see refinements and better decision making, but our shape won't change. It will now have been analysed thoroughly by opposition coaches who will set up defensive traps to stifle us.

    We caught Japan and New Zealand out last November with how well we shifted the point of attack. Japan weren't up to much anyway, but New Zealand definitely weren't fully ready for the wide game we deployed. Argentina were the last side we faced in that series and even though we thumped them, that was done mainly through our work up front. They did quite well to stop us from getting the ball to the wider channels. They hit up fast in the outside to stop our second receiver distributing to the wing.

    We'll need to see further improvements in order to get the best from our outside backs. The other sides will be well prepared for us.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Just seen Farrells comments on Joeys selection ahead of Carty. Essentially he’s saying that as long as Carbery is fit he is golden to get the spot. Must be really disheartening for any of the other 10’s to have heard that today. “Sorry boys don’t care what you’ve been doing while Carbery has been broken for the last 2 years but Carbery’s got the spot”.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,621 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    It is stupid! Carberry is not going to take Ireland far in a world cup. Fortunately, Healy and Crowley will be right up his ass in the neat future.



  • Registered Users Posts: 367 ✭✭OneLungDavy


    It will certainly be interesting to see how the other nations adapt to Ireland. But the current attacking shape is designed to get around the rush defence, it really all boils down to ruck speed.



  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ Alessandro Vast Numskull


    The man's been an Important part of 2 (is it 3)of our most famous wins vs nz and is only 26. Like I don't think he should be starting for munster automatically never mind ireland but ti say he can't take us far is laughable



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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 10,640 Mod ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    That’s, at best, slightly disingenuous tho. Here’s what he actually said, from Murray Kinsella:

    He’s essentially saying

    1. Carbery’s been in camp plenty so knows the plays and what they’re trying to achieve
    2. He covers more positions than the alternatives (which is obviously important for the bench spot) and
    3. He’s gone well in training.

    The 2nd point in particular is a real point of differentiation for Carbery over the alternatives.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,377 ✭✭✭✭phog


    Yes, yes, yes, that's exactly what he said.


    I hope you're suitably outraged.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,253 ✭✭✭Former Former Former


    It's press conference waffle.

    Would you feel better if he had just said they think Carbery is the better player? Because that's the truth.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,803 ✭✭✭irelandrover


    This is strange to me. Ireland brought a new game against Japan. They varied it a little and beat NZ.

    Argentina stopped that game and Ireland adapted and beat them in a different way.

    So three games and three different ways of playing. One was attacking through the backs, one was through the forwards and one was a mix of both.

    For once feel Ireland do t have a set way of playing and can adapt based o the opposition.



  • Registered Users Posts: 401 ✭✭Tommybojangles


    No keen to reach for the "T" word for what is a fairly harmless opinion. Generally I'd say a good percentage of rugby fans agree with it, but anyway.


    From a Connacht point of view I. Not sure what to make of the Hansen selection, thinking of how badly rhe 6 nations went for Lowe last year after he was dropped in, I don't know of a Connacht player would be able to work his way back in. Especially when you see the media myth that's developed about how bad Carty apparently was in the world cup.


    I'd echo a few people who have said the center discussion is getting tiresome. We just have 3 team good players, Bundee has gotten back to his best in the last year I think after slipping just a little for a period.


    I think it's one of the most exciting packs we've ever put out, ball players and power everywhere. Really can't wait for Saturday!



  • Registered Users Posts: 595 ✭✭✭jimdemp


    To be fair Jameslowe made at least 1 awful read every game which cost a try. Ringrose and henshaw play their best rugby when Bundee is a 12. You should be happy there are more Connacht born players (doris) then munster and ulster born players have starting combined.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,293 ✭✭✭All_in_Flynn


    Not sure I would agree with the assessment of Jackman and Kinsella. Argentina were shooting up but we were punching holes in them through the forwards all afternoon. There just wasn't the need to get the ball out the back all that often.

    The other obvious factor was the starting 9 and 10 in comparison to the other 2 games. Night and day.

    The reality is that you earn the right to go wide and if we are as dominant up front as we were in the autumn I don't think Wales will be stopping us getting to the edge whether they know it's coming or not.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,320 ✭✭✭Teferi




  • Registered Users Posts: 595 ✭✭✭jimdemp


    No why? it was taken down. the IRFU made him do another after to upload on their YouTube channel. Channel 4 did another video of his best bits after it was removed. Jim Hamilton was one of the few who highlighted this, Irish media ignored it like the always do. Anyone watching channel 4 live would have seen it too. But at least the edited version of it worked on people like you. I still think it sounds awful



  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ Everleigh Freezing Oasis




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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 10,640 Mod ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    He definitely has had some excellent defensive contributions. But I think it’s fair to say he’s had some lapses too. For me, it’s his work rate that’s as big a worry. We’ve seen him switch off on occasion.

    The one he picks off for the intercept try vs the Ulster scrum is the kind of thing I think could almost always ends up a try at the other end at international level.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,253 ✭✭✭Former Former Former


    Look at the first gif. On first viewing, it is an excellent scramble tackle. Then watch it again and ask, why does he end up in the position to need a scramble tackle at all? Because he's in no man's land when the pass comes out. There's loads of cover but he's marking no-one. He does very well to rescue it, in fairness but he's all over the shop positionally.

    I think there's plenty of grounds to think he might be exposed, it's not just about getting stepped by Sheehan... but then Farrell spent years as a defence coach so he should know what he's at.

    And if he misses a tackle, so what? He'll work on it and improve, like Lowe did, like Earls did, like they all did.

    Post edited by Former Former Former on


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I marginally prefer players who get in through residency than the granny rule...



  • Registered Users Posts: 7 Braindead Gorilla


    You make no apologies? You know 88 people on Utoya have died due to people like yourself holding fast to the white is right ideology. You’re probably a little hard man that read 8 Chan ten years and spread your ideology across the rugby boards to intimidate confuse and mislead children. And now hold fast to it? Making it seem like it’s some 50-50 call? Nice username BTW - is that designed to belittle or mock people who have a conscience or have suffered grief in any way? Don’t belittle the issue you have spread across rugby boards for the last ten years you fool.



  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ Alessandro Vast Numskull


    Jesus I didn't agree with the guy but not wanting rugby players to be able to change country to "white is right" is some leap. Hansen is white ffs



  • Registered Users Posts: 305 ✭✭The Guru 123


    Not a rugby fan at all but will watch the game Saturday. But just been reading these last few pages. I would have thought it wasn't an outrageous opinion to say you'd prefer to have Irish players playing for Ireland than guys that qualified through no reason other than playing here for 3 years?

    To take the example to the extreme would people have any problem if the full team was made up of 15 South Africans/Aussies/New Zealanders that have played here for 3 years?

    And before anyone says it I'm not questioning Aki or Lowe or all the other guys dedication or commitment to playing for Ireland.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,227 ✭✭✭Stephen_Maturin


    Doris is from Mayo but I’m pretty sure he played all of his rugby for Blackrock before Leinster - in rugby terms he’s a product of Leinster



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,413 ✭✭✭✭salmocab


    I’d say people would have an issue with that because it would mean our systems aren’t working. Ideally all our provinces would be using lads born and bred within their own province and be competing at the top with them but that’s an unrealistic thing so we need to prop up in certain areas at certain times. If those players brought in can do a job for Ireland then most won’t have a particular issue with it, personally I’ve no beef with someone who comes, works and pays their taxes here becoming part of the system. It’s maybe not ideal but nothing is.



  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ Alessandro Vast Numskull


    Is that how it works? Knox is a munster product so is he?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,227 ✭✭✭Stephen_Maturin


    Eh no?

    Was Knox playing rugby in Munster since he was 12? Because Doris was in Leinster.

    Stupid analogy



  • Subscribers Posts: 41,863 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    depends on your definition of product

    Doris spent all his second level education in Blackrock where he would have received his youth grade rugby coaching, before joining the Leinster academy

    Knox attended Michaelhouse, in South Africa, for all his second level schooling, before joining the Munster academy.

    These two things are not the same, but ill let you argue the semantics of it.

    Post edited by sydthebeat on


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,194 ✭✭✭Must love hardship


    A great addition to a rugby forum. A brain dead gorilla.. id simply prefer if we trusted the talent we produce in the acemedies over importing players that didn't make the grade all ready.

    Anyway this place with get a bit messy over the next few weeks.. will be like shouting at the sky.

    So I'll make a few predictions for the 6 nations and drop off And see how they pan out.

    Winner: France

    Runner up: Ireland

    Irish player of the tournament: Doris.

    Player that will have a worrying drop in form:Keenan

    Starting Half back pairing for Scotland: Murray and Carberry.

    Top try scorer for Ireland:Kelleher.

    Player of the tournament : Jaminet.

    Bolter not in 23 for the Wales team to start v scotland: Balacoune



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 10,640 Mod ✭✭✭✭aloooof



    I can see this point of view tbh. Obviously your example is an extreme one to illustrate the point, but it's extremely unlikely to happen in practice because 1) sheer lack of numbers - are there even 15 players across the provinces who've qualified thru residency? and 2) the qualification has now changed to 5 years.

    Also, I think the discussion this time originated from Mack Hansen's inclusion who isn't qualified thru residency. His mother is from Cork.

    Personally, I don't have much of a problem with it, especially when you see what a guy like Aki has brought to Connacht. And I'll always have a grá for CJ.



  • Registered Users Posts: 20 Violent Mediocrity


    Ah yes the apologist for “protectionism”. That sort of ideology of creating a preference for home grown stuff leads to violence and it always ends badly for both sides.

    To say you are within your rights to defend that ideology by taking the logic to the extreme and saying we would be colonised or having 15 foreigners playing for us is cretinous.

    Let us deal with the issue at hand rather than extreme defensiveness - there are as I see it three foreign born players vying for places. Your extreme defensive ideology has no place here.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 10,640 Mod ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    You'd know it's 6 Nations time anyways...



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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,458 ✭✭✭kuang1


    Took a bit longer than other years, but with the last page here, NOW it feels like 6ns time!!!

    Yippee!

    Edit: snap aloof



  • Registered Users Posts: 1 Couponkoz.in


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  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 35,508 Mod ✭✭✭✭pickarooney


    This is probably the most constructive comment on the page



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,225 ✭✭✭✭Clegg


    Six Nations already revving up I see.

    Hopefully we don't have an influx of new posters bashing the side if we lose a game.



  • Registered Users Posts: 305 ✭✭The Guru 123


    Easy now before you go burning people at the stake there Martin Luther King.

    What makes international sport so special is it's one countries finest players against another countries finest players. I used an extreme example above (15 non Irish players that are eligible through moving here for a short period) but in my example if it gets to that point or even close to it are we not then at the point where the international team is almost a club team that's just representing Ireland? It's not actually representative of the best Irish players anymore.

    You say I'm guilty of "protectionism" which is a very loaded term. Would you like to see this 3 year rule relaxed even further then? Maybe if a player was on holiday once in Ireland they become eligible? Or maybe forget about it altogether. We could just field the best 15 players that will agree to play for Ireland and other countries do likewise. At which point it would just become a club team.

    Without having some kind of eligibility criteria you don't have International sport and I can't think of any other international sport where the eligibility criteria is so loose.



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