Yet another young woman attacked by a male. When will it end?

Tell me how · 05-02-2022 6:20am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118584934#Comment_118584934

As for not seeing these things around them, I honestly wonder where you spend your time, because I rarely, if ever, see anything on the street, even remotely approaching harassment, or abuse towards women. I genuinely do feel that the posters who complain about this being so common, are actually seeking examples to get annoyed over, rather than this being such a common experience.

And... before you say that all women experience these things.. I'm sure they do. However, there is this argument put forward to suggest that all women experience this harassment/abuse on a regular basis, when I suspect that they have a few actual experiences, and are instead sharing their experiences with other women, so that the illusion of it being so common, becomes "real".

You are sure all women experience uncomfortable engagements approaching harassments but don't want any sort of a discussion as to how this might be stopped? What's that all about?

On this very forum, many of those appalled at the conversation over the last couple of weeks, actively use singular examples of criminal activity to argue for much more stringent vetting procedures of asylum seekers, but you don't want any conversation on how to reduce something that you are sure every woman experiences?

As has already been pointed out, humans are naturally inclined to focus on or remember more vividly negative experiences. It's an evolutionary development to help us recognize and defend against a potentially stressful situation should it arise in future. All of us do it, male and female. I would suggest that you ask these women you trust (interesting statement in itself) if they think there needs to be a conversation about how men in general engage with women in general. On the street or otherwise.

(Your categorization that the drama genre of Movies 'tends to focus quite heavily on female centric issues is one of the most bizarre/absurd statements I've seen you come out with. Does that men that the action move genre is focused on male centric issues in the same way?)

cj maxx · 05-02-2022 6:42am

I'm sorry, but I didn't see any reference to skin colour in the OP

zv2 · 05-02-2022 10:44am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118583079#Comment_118583079

'These issues' is a bit vague. Do you mean how damaging feminism is for women because that is one of the issues I mentioned?

05-02-2022 10:48am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118585054#Comment_118585054

Right, of course!!! There isn't really a problem with men's behaviour at all, it's all just women exaggerating!!

People online, the media, and some feminists are exaggerating. As I said, the women I've spoken to have said that they have never experienced the level of harassment, abuse, or whatever that is promoted as being commonplace.

And there aren't problems with regards to most men's behaviour with regards to women... The stats do support the belief that it is a minority of men who commit violence or abuse towards women.

So only the experiences of women you personally trust, are dependable and their experiences are representative of the whole female population? Okay then.

Whereas your claims and that of people online are representative of the whole female population? You can't really say that my female friends aren't representative, while claiming that your own are. Although, I didn't say that they were representative of the whole female population, but their lacking those experiences does raise some doubt that these experiences are as common as you say.

So, how many times does a woman have to experience harassment/abuse before objecting to it? Does it only become "real" after the first few times?

Object the first time, of course. Nobody should be made to experience such things... nor did I say that such experiences are unreal. I said, that the sharing of such experiences makes it appear more common than it is... and that's the illusion.

It only takes one bad experience, to make someone afraid for a very, very long time

Depends on the experience. A lot of these claims about harassment/abuse (in relation to these threads or comments in the media), merge the experiences so that the worst possible impression is formed.. Being wolf whistled (with nothing more added to it) is unlikely to make anyone fearful for a very very long time. That's part of the exaggeration that goes on with these discussions. That being whistled at is just as bad as being groped, with the assumption being that groping becomes commonplace (even though, they're really referring to being whistled at).

Generalising the harassment into one lump so that the worst is assumed, and promoted as common. So, all women have been groped, harassed, etc perhaps a few times, but by combining them, the level of severity or actual danger involved is ignored, so that it appears to happen much more than it actually does... and they're all treated similarly as being extreme.

Downplaying it in this manner is pretty disgusting.

Except I didn't downplay the experiences themselves. I haven't downplayed any form of harassment or abuse. I have pointed out the possibility that certain parties are exaggerating their claims.. and honestly, I'd find that exaggeration to be just as disgusting, because it seeks to promote the world as being more dangerous than it really is, and so, encourage "women" to be fearful.

There's been a lot of hysteria over the last few weeks suggesting that Ireland is a remarkably dangerous place for women, but the statistics don't support such a view, especially when you compare those statistics with other European countries. Irish Society, and general social norms, aren't aggressive towards women, nor is there any cultural beliefs that allow/encourage the abuse of women in society... but you, and others, would have us believe that it's common.

zv2 · 05-02-2022 10:49am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118582867#Comment_118582867

@CreadanLady has failed on the very first line by saying there is 'some' domestic violence against men. This is an obvious attempt to minimize violence against men and insinuate there is less than violence against women. There is a lot of violence against men in the home. A LOT.

05-02-2022 1:59pm

Because married women are never subjected to harassment, and its only single, good looking women who are at risk, and sure what's wrong with them, they're supposed to be complimented by it, right?

Jesus wept.

If this post is a reflection of the true mentality of [some] men these days, then we have a much, much bigger problem on our hands then I actually originally believed, and much further to go.

I'm out. I honestly cannot deal with reading any more of kind of crap being spoutedby [some] men on this thread.

This, lads, is why women don't want to engage in your threads.

Its obvious to me that if any change is going to happen, it will have to be driven by women - because according to [some] men on this thread, there is no problem in the first place, and if there is, its not up to them to try and do anything to fix it.

I'm sure your mothers must be proud.

05-02-2022 2:02pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118586031#Comment_118586031

Not really, its the acknowledgement that certain factors are going to increase the attention, and frame the manner of that attention from "men", but also from the kind of men who are assholes or push their own desires on to strangers. Men are more inclined to focus on physical attributes and appearance due to instinctual attraction. A woman wearing a short skirt is going to receive more attention than a woman wearing a jeans... because the showing of flesh/skin, along with the display of legs being uncovered tends to attract men more. That's not to say that a woman wearing jeans isn't sexy or attractive, but short skirts tend to cause more attention to happen. The wearing of high heels is well known to change the shape of the legs, and science has shown how that can affect many men as a result.

There is also the aspect that for many of these assholes, a woman wearing revealing clothing, or that which is considered intentionally to be sexy, is permission for them to act the way they do... that doesn't mean they're right to think or act that way, but the appearance of the person can affect how much and the kind of attention they receive.

Its about understanding and appreciating human behaviour and the choices being made. There's a certain movement to remove how a woman appears from the reactions or attention she receives from men, even though most men are hardwired to notice that appearance, and some men will decide how to behave entirely based on those looks and what it means to them.

A lot of female fashion was designed to be attractive to men, and to affect them on the physical level. It's important to realise that effect on men remains even when women decide that they're dressing that way for themselves.. but more importantly, it's important to remember that the minority of men who do act aggressively, or assault women, are more likely to act due to what they see... judging others on their appearance. So, it's stands to reason to consider that, and not ignore it because some women want to pretend that their wearing sexy clothing shouldn't affect anyone she doesn't want affected.

05-02-2022 2:16pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118586093#Comment_118586093

This, lads, is why women don't want to engage in your threads.

There's about 15 people (more than a few posts each, and then a skew of single/double posters) posting to the thread, and I'd say 1/4 of those posters are female, or are promoting female centric viewpoints. Which would match up pretty well with boards in general, except for the women's forum.

If this post is a reflection of the true mentality of [some] men these days, then we have a much, much bigger problem on our hands then I actually originally believed, and much further to go.

First off, boards isn't really representative of Irish society... Secondly, the internet in general is not representative of society at large for either gender. And third, judging or two posters, and saying that they represent a sizable population of others is a bit much. You posts don't represent other women, they represent yourself.

Because married women are never subjected to harassment, and its only single, good looking women who are at risk, and sure what's wrong with them, they're supposed to be complimented by it, right?

Not right.. because that's not what he said. You exaggerate in quite a dramatic fashion... Did he even mention married women? or the rest?

zom · 05-02-2022 3:58pm

"I don't think that would be possible. I suspect that it might even be unconstitutional. What you are talking about is imprisoning one person for the crime of another. More nonsense."

You say I can convice someone into making a crime, likely underaged, and I am 100% clear in terms of law?

Tell me how · 05-02-2022 4:48pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118586093#Comment_118586093

Its obvious to me that if any change is going to happen, it will have to be driven by women - because according to [some] men on this thread, there is no problem in the first place, and if there is, its not up to them to try and do anything to fix it.

Or, there is a problem that every woman experiences at some point, but that's still no reason to suggest that there should be a discussion around it.

05-02-2022 6:09pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118586611#Comment_118586611

Nope. That is not what it says.

it says imprisoning one person for the crime of another. If you incite or instructed someone on a crime, you yourself are guilty of a crime.

if your child commits a crime, with no input or inducements from you, unknown to you, you cannot be imprisoned for their crime.

05-02-2022 6:13pm

I see this thread has gone down the road of another recent thread about women and their safety etc

Imagine suggesting that women who discuss their safety and/or the behaviour of others towards them are somehow bitter, because they have been cheated on 😂

Or those that are not 'conventionally beautiful ' could never be a victim of harassment or assaults 🙄

That's the level of rubbish women have to put up with.

Leg End Reject · 05-02-2022 6:13pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118571898#Comment_118571898

I haven't read the full thread but ask yourself one question. Do you think this 13 year old boy was a normal, well-adjusted teenager right to the moment he attacked that lady?

That seems unlikely to me. There is usually an escalation in violence before an attack like this. Was any abnormal behaviour not observed in school? Perhaps if there was a functional social care system, a thorough follow through if the schools he attended had referred him, psychologists and social workers involved with his family etc., this could have been addressed before he got to this point. We need to accept that it is sometimes in the best interests of a child to remove them from their family quickly, and then to have proper supports and services to care for these children to allow them to function normally.

So yes, properly funded early childhood care and education, more supports for schools and families, functioning mental health supports, more guards and an overhaul of the judiciary systems will help.

This is not the behaviour of a normal 13 year old, the behaviour of the man who murdered Ashling Murphy is not the normal behaviour of all men. You acknowledge that the woman who attacked the homeless man was an outlier, surely you can see that boy and the men who attack women are outliers too?

05-02-2022 7:12pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587247#Comment_118587247

One poster made that claim about being bitter. One. One, other poster spoke about not being a victim due to appearance. Yup.. that's really representative of the variety of views on the thread.

Well done, Bubbly... you've just shown another great example of lumping the majority in with a minority of opinions.... Along with the level of rubbish that everyone has to put up with.

Smooth as always Bubbly.

Tell me how · 05-02-2022 7:38pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587453#Comment_118587453

One commentator on a radio show mentioned in passing about a license for socialising, and that was worthy of 1500 plus commented thread in just a couple of days.

Strumms · 05-02-2022 7:46pm

How do we go about sorting out the judiciary? Genuine question because they are failing the people of this country, they are enabling criminals…

Leg End Reject · 05-02-2022 7:54pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118580720#Comment_118580720

If you saw a woman mauling a young lad in a pub would you intervene?

What about 2 women fighting on the street?

A woman shoplifting?

A group of teenage girls or scumbag women roaring and whistling at men?

A woman hitting someone in the back of the head with a stiletto?

A woman harassing passersby for money?

I wouldn't, nor do I feel any obligation to do so just because I'm the same gender. I don't expect a man to do the same just because they see other men acting like scumbags. They don't have a collective obligation to monitor, or attempt to change, the behaviour of other men. I'm flabbergasted that so many women believe they do and suggest that they put themselves in the firing line when other women act like thugs and report back on how they got on.

anewme · 05-02-2022 8:18pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587453#Comment_118587453

There has been numerous posts deleted from all of these threads. Same attitude.

There have been 2 posters with that attitude TODAY.

Tell me how · 05-02-2022 8:18pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587643#Comment_118587643

It's nothing to do with gender, it's too with trying to live in a society in which we live and helping to make that better when we can, if we can, without putting ourselves at undue risk.

You're not inclined that way, that's fine, there's no law that says you have to be. Thankfully though, a lot of people are and for many it comes down to the idea that if they were in need, they would like the idea of others supporting them rather than just abandoning them to whatever they are experiencing.

05-02-2022 8:21pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587643#Comment_118587643

Personally I would and have done, whether the offenders are male or female.

I believe everyone in society should stand up to wrongdoing when they see it.

zv2 · 05-02-2022 8:33pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587250#Comment_118587250

Maybe he was drugged off his head, looking at porn for hours and listening to too much RTE and it all got too much for him. The thing is, people are talking about 'men' and 'women', but many of these problems are far more complex than that. Society is becoming more and more fubar'd by the day and these problems have their roots in the general miasma of moral decay and pathology we are all sinking into these past few decades. These problems are complex and multivariate. You have to fix the entire fubar, not just one aspect of it. So we need to start another thread on fixing the world. Maybe Greta can help us out.

Leg End Reject · 05-02-2022 8:34pm

@Tell me how and @bubblypop, I wouldn't be physically able to defend myself so I wouldn't intervene. Self-preservation and an awareness of my own physical limits doesn't mean I disregard society or don't want to help others.

I've never been physically violent and it's not something I've been exposed to. I think I'd just cry if I was attacked after intervening. I don't expect others to though, and those of you willing to take the risk shouldn't judge those of us who aren't.

05-02-2022 8:41pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587805#Comment_118587805

Standing up to wrongdoing or doing something does not necessarily mean doing anything physical. I'm 5'5' and not that big. But I would intervene where I could. That could be as simple as phoning 999 or waiting, going as a witness to court, getting other people's attention to what is happening etc

I don't judge people for not being physically involved, I would judge someone that just turns and walks the other way, I understand why they might do that, but I'll judge them in my mind

Leg End Reject · 05-02-2022 8:45pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587851#Comment_118587851

I'd ring 999 and act as a witness no problem. That in itself won't stop an assault though. Emergency services aren't appropriately funded to ensure an immediate response.

My post was in response to the suggestion that all men need to step up and intervene. I simply asked that poster if they would do the same if they saw women acting accordingly.

05-02-2022 8:47pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587865#Comment_118587865

I would suggest not all men would be physically about to intervene physically either. And I wouldn't expect then too. But there are still things that they can do. It's the doing absolutely nothing that I think is a problem.

Leg End Reject · 05-02-2022 8:51pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587879#Comment_118587879

I never said I would walk away though. To me intervening is actively stepping in to try to stop a situation.

In an ideal world all the emergency services would have sufficient personnel and resources to respond immediately, but sadly calling 999 won't always change the outcome.

tom1ie · 05-02-2022 8:53pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587604#Comment_118587604

This is a good question.

It’s almost as if repeat criminals keep the law industry going……

I suppose if they were locked up there would be no money to be made.

Tell me how · 05-02-2022 8:58pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587800#Comment_118587800

Interesting you mention societies problems and the need to resolve them and then make (what I'm interpreting as) a dismissive comment about Greta.

Many of the vehemently non-woke who are offended at the concept of discussing societies issues if it includes discussing mens role in resolving them were and are equally offended at Greta pointing out the need for action with respect to the climate.

If you said Joe Rogan, I'd be more confident those who heretofore don't want to talk about change might then be willing to.

05-02-2022 8:59pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587920#Comment_118587920

Nah, the appeal process would keep them in gravy... but yes I agree with you that the legal profession seem more interested in making money, than doing their duty, and putting the interests of the public first. But then, that's the same with the legal profession when it approaches just about any kind of service.. they charge incredible prices compared with other European countries for less actual work.

05-02-2022 9:01pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587732#Comment_118587732

He was specific in the posts he was referring to, and he used them to represent the overall thread.. and I've seen most of the posts to the thread, and the deleted posts weren't the same as what he referred to.

Yet another young woman attacked by a male. When will it end?

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