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Civil Service - Post Lockdown - Blended Working?

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,433 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    I was lucky in hindsight I got out when I did. Only reason I left was my contracts had ended at the height of the crash and they were cutting numbers. Didn’t seem it at the time but best thing to ever happen me. I did struggle for a while to get into the private sector as there’s a definite prejudice against ex public service people. I think I’d have been completely institutionalised (can happen in private too)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,433 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    Friend of mine joined a PS department not long after college. Quite a technical regulatory environment- she had exactly the red pen experience from an institutionalised pen pusher “managing” her. She left and went to NZ. Working in the private sector down there .

    I actually wouldn’t know what a printed memo even is? Sounds archaic if the person is in the same office. Why not just talk to them



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,862 ✭✭✭SouthWesterly


    I suppose for me I have 25 years in transport management and a post grad in IT with experience.

    The Cs suits me and I'm hoping for mobility soon to where I'm living. 5 days in the office wouldn't be a killer for me then.i could cycle to work.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,077 ✭✭✭TaurenDruid


    Well, exactly. That's what we do. That, or an email.



  • Registered Users Posts: 112 ✭✭Avenger2020



    Return to office harms culture and productivity.

    However, Vice-presidents continue to push for return to office.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 124 ✭✭James2020App




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,862 ✭✭✭SouthWesterly


    Your misquoting. I'm not the one 3 hours from work.



  • Registered Users Posts: 124 ✭✭James2020App


    Maybe broaden your accommodation search to AirBnbs as well for your one day a week. They are often cheaper than hotels and may be in a more favourable place close to your work. You could even make a deal with them if you are planning to do a day a week for a longer period, after renting a few weeks.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,668 ✭✭✭Gusser09


    Did people really move 100's of km's away from their place of work based on being told to WFH during a once in a lifetime pandemic? It seems to be really shortsighted by them. Again not really the depts fault or problem.



  • Registered Users Posts: 259 ✭✭exitstageleft


    Or people got a job over the last two years. Told to work from home. Didn't move to Dublin in the middle of a lock down. And now wonder why bother when they've been doing their jobs perfectly for 20+ months while living somewhere they like.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,815 ✭✭✭Burgo


    So our department sent out a survey yesterday on blended working.

    "Please note that fully remote working arrangements are not on offer under the DPER Blended Working Framework."

    So it would appear to be a max of 3 days WFH, as also stated in the survey.

    Link to the publication from July 2021.

    I know not all departments will follow, but I know a few that will just do what DPER does.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,257 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    Faint praise indeed given that the unions have done nothing at all! 😁🙄 what exactly is it we're paying for again, the masterfully negotiated 1% pay rise?

    As for the "1 day a week, all agreed" in my dept, nope not agreed because agreement requires consultation. What has been imposed is 1 day a week currently, going up to mandatory 2 days a week before the end of this month, after that no idea but I'm not hopeful whatever talk there is about us supposedly being a "progressive employer".

    Pissed off to high heaven atm, today is another pointless day in the office but there's more around so more annoying people I'm forced to listen to

    I enjoyed the spin in so that was something, but my device took soooo long to log in I got an infringement, yay. Seems flexi in the office is just being used as a weapon against us. No recording or compensation for extra hours wfh of course.

    Oh and yes, we do have air quality monitors, but there's no point because no matter what they say or how overheated it gets no c**t will ever open a window here except me.

    Scrap the cap!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,257 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    I voted against the merger because I knew our interests would count for fcuk-all in such a mega-union, and so it has proved. I used to be on the branch committee, went to conferences etc. Couldn't be arsed to 'attend' the virtual branch AGM this year or last year, and they can't be arsed to tell us from one year to the next what motions were passed (for all the good that does) and what action 🤣 was taken on them. Fuckwits.

    Scrap the cap!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,942 ✭✭✭billyhead


    I thought it was 3 in and 2 from home. That's what the general rumour is.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,257 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    When I was an EO we had an AP who insisted on the whole "print it out, attach it to the file, send the file up to my office, I add commas in biro, repeat" process. And there was a typing pool office next door to our office! Only two typists left by then I think and feck knows what they actually did all day because everyone else was using Word and (internal only) email. By the end of my year there he'd finally been converted to using email and Word to approve drafts of letters going out.

    This was the late 90s though!

    Scrap the cap!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,257 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    So our department sent out a survey yesterday on blended working.

    Will they actually give a shite what anyone says in a survey?

    Scrap the cap!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,737 ✭✭✭Dr. Bre


    I am hoping the opposite- 3 at home 2 to n office



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,077 ✭✭✭TaurenDruid


    Stay in Dublin while WFH, pay a minimum of €1200 rent a month for anywhere decent (I saw a place advertised last night for I think €700/month that included a shower in the kitchen/dining room!); or move 'back home'/out of Dublin and get somewhere bigger and better for less, saving at least €200/month just in rent? Why wouldn't you if you had no particular ties to Dublin and no immediate prospect of WFH ending.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,077 ✭✭✭TaurenDruid


    Sorry, by "all agreed" I meant all those who responded agreed that the "return 1 day a week to the office" was what they'd been told to do, not that it had been agreed with management/unions.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,077 ✭✭✭TaurenDruid


    That was a quarter of a century ago, though...

    Sorry!



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,543 ✭✭✭jaffa20




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,431 ✭✭✭BrianD3


    All manner of archaic stuff goes on or at least did pre pandemic i.e. 2019 early 2020. Mountains of paper generated but if you go looking for something in it, best of luck finding it. Worst of both worlds.

    Even though many (but not all) people have managed to move on from printed memos and red biros to email, it has resulted in a different type of absurdity in some cases.

    E.g.

    Massive chains of emails and cc fests, emails with attachments attached to emails "please review and comment on the Excel spreadsheet that is attached to my email of x date which is attached to this email". People writing their responses in different colour fonts and after a while, they start running out of colours.

    This may very well be used as a reason to say that electronic communication and WFH "don't work". Back to the office and back to printed (or in rare cases handwritten) memos and red biros - with more memos generated if someone wants to purchase a box of said red biros.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 170 ✭✭Shuffl_in


    Ours certainly didn't. Over 90% responded that they'd favour WFH or blended with just one or two days per week in the office.

    It was never mentioned again and we kept getting emails from the top about how everyone is looking forward to returning to the office.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6 Office123


    I moved 100s of kms away as I moved back to my home town to care for my parent who has chronic underlying conditions and cancer. The elderly were told they had to cocoon by an Tánaiste and doctors especially if they had underlying conditions. Let’s not forget the corona virus was a very real concern up to a week ago. But seems to be a trauma blocked out by society now. I sympathise with careers as they are completely forgotten about in our society yet they are holding up our economy by keeping people out of hospitals and expensive care homes.

    Also, I could not afford keeping two places going. The rent in Dublin was extortionate for a box room I physically could not work in. I was taking calls from my bed at the start until I moved out and would dread if anyone turned on the camera and see my damp cramped box room.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,668 ✭✭✭Gusser09


    I have empathy for your situation but if you are looking after someone full time then you aren't in a position to carry out you duties. WFH was never going to happen full time. The best we could hope full was 3 days at home and 2 in the office. At local level I think most managers will facilitate that unless the staff member is being totally unreasonable or inflexible.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,174 ✭✭✭hardybuck


    I genuinely don't know how DPER can be allowed bring in a Civil Service Blended Working Policy (or whatever it'll be called) which doesn't offer scope for remote working. How does that tally with a Government commitment that remote or home working should be the norm for 20% of public sector workers?

    I expect some attempt to feign ignorance or fudge a description of what remote working is, and a bold faced attempt to make out that hybrid working is remote working.

    Will be interesting to see if HR Units get snowed under with request for remote working when the new legislation eventually arrives (and I feel that this has been delayed cynically).

    Also interesting to see PeoplePoint sending out emails in expectation of high volumes of retirements and resignations in Q2 - let the games begin!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,077 ✭✭✭TaurenDruid



    All I can say is your experience of the civil service does not match mine, and I've been in it for 25+ years, working in three departments and three other CS organisations. Yes, 25 years ago, there were typing pools and red biros. And in the last 25 years they've all disappeared. The only "memo" I've written in ten years was to let an A/Sec know that the six-figure invoice they were being asked to sign off on was legit, and I don't think that's unreasonable! Ironically, the one place I've worked that produced the most paper was because most of the staff there weren't career civil servants, they were recruited from the private sector.

    It looks like you have managed to end up in one of the few places that's still fairly archaic, though. If someone doesn't know how to use email efficiently - show them! Or if it's winding you up that much - use the mobility system, and look for a transfer!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,431 ✭✭✭BrianD3


    I'm not talking about the civil service here but rather other parts of the public service. My impression is that the civil service is relatively modern, well resourced and forward thinking in comparison. But the civil service makes up less than 20% of the public service.

    The closer you are to central government or to the money (i.e. Revenue, Social Welfare) the better things likely are.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,077 ✭✭✭TaurenDruid



    Fair point. I worked in Revenue years ago and although it was old-fashioned in some respects (deference to tax inspectors and the like), it transformed completely over the course of a few years. Early adopters of decent IT systems and changes to bring in greater efficiency that actually worked, rather than change for the sake of it.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 259 ✭✭exitstageleft


    This was really, really interesting. Great work TaurenDruid!



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