Russia - threadbanned users in OP

Your position on this is disingenuous. Or else you clearly don't get it.

I'm no US fanboy. All invaders of foreign lands should be dealt with summarily. If we are still a neutral or non-aligned people, we should find the menacing nature of military exercises and build-up (and the constituent nature of those resources) anathema to all we believe in as peace-lovers. We should recognise the destabilising effect that such lingering threatening menace has on industry, investment, family plans, marriages, interconnectedness with other countries etc.

It's not rocket science. Ask any publican of the effects of rapid fluid changes ré Covid restrictions and what-if scenarios. Then multiply that by 1000 for the poor Ukrainians and ask who is to blame for that social and economic rot that is now upon them? Russia. It's very simple. Don't blame Ukraine for wanting to join NATO as that's what an abusive person does. Look what you made me do???

It is clear that USA, being the power broker for many decades, has committed many compromises and outright crimes. In addition to often being the bulwark against worst beasts. But here in Europe, we've had 70+ years of stable manageable tension. Even the Balkans became manageable with US/EU solidarity. But that also is becoming a powderkeg due to Russia playing games again, stoking old embers.

It is self-evident that NATO's origin was a bulwark against USSR. It is self evident that a number of former satellites of USSR have decided that status will never revisit them again. It is self-evident that Russia, like any other warmonger with an economic agenda to maintain, does not appreciate lose of spheres of influence.

It is extremely self-evident that a country surrounded on 3 sides by the sort of resources that are used to take territory would be caught in stasis and both losing billions in lost economic opportunity and wasting billions in reaction. It is self-evident that, provided Russia can secure assurances from its Eastern flank that all is well in the world, that it can then bring forward any amount of resources required to hold a territory the size of Ukraine or at least Russia-swayed Ukraine. Without having to worry about being exposed on other flanks. Such is the nature of war and geopolitics.

I suggest a Gofundme page and we raise enough money for a free all expenses paid trip to Eastern Ukraine for a lucky winner from the select few bourgeois intellectuals here. We can set a timeline. If there is no invasion by a certain date, we can reward you with a cash bonus when you arrive home. If it's a less than optimal holiday experience, we can still arrange for the idealist hero to be flown home horizontally.

People believing Russia has no intention to invade would do well to remember that they also said they had no intention to annex Crimea before they went and annexed it.

You could be right, you could be wrong. We all don't know. Maybe it's just a cat and mouse game with Putin and the NATO. The only thing we know is that post-Covid we certainly don't need a war. Refugees all over, and gas prices as high as you didn't even imagine.

The only thing is, that in the event Russia doesn't invade the Ukraine, the threat will certainly not go away, at least as long as Putin is in office.

And the 2nd thing is that in the event of Russia invading the Ukraine, the Baltics will be next on the list. Don't be fooled about these two points. Trusting Putin is like trusting Hitler. Chamberlain was fooled as well back then as well.

Strategically, it's probably better for NATO and the West not to get involved in the Ukraine, even though it'll be morally wrong as the integrity and self determination of one country is compromised by a neighbour.

Strategically it would be better for NATO to focus on their NATO members, and re-inforce as much as possible in Poland, Romania, Bulgaria and the Baltics. Especially the Baltics could easily look like another evacuation of Dunkerque for NATO and Putin knows this as well.

This is at least the third time you've made these insidious claims about homophobia. The funny thing is if you knew the first thing about me you'd know how ridiculous your lies are.

Do you really lack that much confidence in your own arguments that you need to lower your self to the gutter so much. Remember your friends in Western Imperialism are solid friends of the House of Saud and Bolsanaro neither of whom are exactly brimming with support for gay rights!

It's time the US and other western powers gave Russia the respect they deserve and are entitled to.

Deserve and entitled,but Russia need to take a stand against US behavior.

Jesus wept

What nonsense is that

Well, it's either that, or you have a nuclear armed superpower playing it's roll as grand disrupter to the west. And being pushed ever closer into a truly scary alliance with China.

When future generations look back on the decisions our leaders made, might they talk about the missed opportunities to pull these nations back from the edge of the cliff? By any means possible?

Putin is not wrong to protect his nation's interests. He's also not wrong when he talks about NATO's eastward migration since the end of the cold war, or the fact that the US would never tolerate such aggressive moves in their own back yard. Why should Russia sit back and tolerate it any longer?

Give Russia more respect, and you stand a much better chance of maintaining peace. Or keep following the American model for a peaceful world, and possibly have mutually assured destruction at some point in the future.

I'm actually amazed that so many people trust America to police these matters. Look at how they police their own cities and neighborhoods, and these are the guys we want leading the line globally to keep us all safe from potential nuclear Armageddon? lol

What utter horseshit you are posting here.

Russia has absolutely no entitlement whatsoever to invade another sovereign nation.

Have I missed something or has Ukraine already invited the US into their country and started setting up missile bases to point at Russia?

I am no fan of the US, they have been involved in unjustified invasions themselves, which I will not defend at all. But that does not take away from the fact that Russia has absolutely no right or justification to invade Ukraine.

A retired NATO general has just said on RTE radio that he would expect a false flag operation against separatists in eastern Ukraine to provoke a Russian invasion.

Very honest of him it has to be said.

edit: ‘false flag’ were his words

It's what been said for years.

Remember when you told us about mass Graves of Russians been found in eastern Ukraine as evidence of genocide .....

What was that called other than bullshit ?

NATO had very advanced plans to set up in Ukraine. Crimea was earmarked for a major NATO installation.

Lets remember something here. History and context does matter to all of this, and too many people want to take some of these latest developments in isolation and ignore what has gone in the past.

NATO was set up to directly counter the supposed threat of the soviet union - despite the fact that the soviet union played as big a roll as any of the allied nations in ending ww2. Once the soviet union broke up, many people in Russia naturally believed that NATO would gradually cease to exist as a useful entity.

In fact many in europe had the same belief, hence why financial obligations were not being met by many nations as there was an understanding that it would eventually start to wind down. And there was an agreement that NATO installations would not move eastwards "not one inch" as is the famous quote.

Of course, none of that has happened. The opposite in fact. US led NATO has actually prioritized the move eastward, and has been giving Russia the proverbial 2 fingers for many years now. Trump even managed to increase their budget and force more commitments from nations who were looking for a de-escalation.

This is the power of American bullying tactics, and too many nations simply roll over and let them get their way. Putting everyone's safety in jeopardy in the process.

Ukraine is basically a failed state at this point. It's completely out of the question that Russia were ever going to allow the US to get their hands on Ukraine. Anyone who sees this as a simple sovereignty issue, is either being deliberately disingenuous or is badly misinformed. (I would be inclined to believe in most cases it's the latter)

No I don’t ‘remember’, I never said anything about mass graves and you’re lying.

No