Irish businessman stopped from leaving China.

I've lived almost 13 years in China... and that's why I'm saying the result by the Irish govt is superb. As I said, I fully expected to see O'Halloran disappear into a work camp for the next decade or so.

I've read the article, and a few others on the topic. O Hallorans opinion doesn't change my own perspective on Chinese Justice. It's corrupt. It's political. It's incredibly awkward. And anyone trying to deal with that system needs to appreciate Chinese culture and their response to confrontational demands.

Ahh... innocent... TBH I'm not so sure people taken by the Chinese are actually innocent. You've no idea of the craic that goes on over there by Western companies, and how they smooth their business dealings. Sure, it's all part of Chinese culture, and not involving themselves will result in far less actual business, but at the same time, those westerners doing higher levels of business in China, would likely be considered dirty beyond belief for doing the same here. The Chinese justice simply turns a blind eye most of the time until someone in authority makes a big fuss or the foreigner does something remarkably stupid by the Chinese standards. In the 80s/90s a whole industry was created in China of companies who would help smooth the way for foreign companies, allowing them to maintain the illusion that they weren't {directly} involved in the shady agreements.

Honestly, the vast majority of trouble I've seen or heard foreigners being involved in... they caused it themselves. It's a corrupt system, but it's still a system with rules, and those who break them are likely to be punished, one way or another. (usually needing to pay a hefty bribe.. and generally speaking the people who really face serious trouble are those who refused to pay the bribe, forcing things to escalate).

Entrepreneurship isn't any kind of crime in China... if anything it's actively encouraged both by the culture and the CCP. After all, more businesses means more revenue and decreases their social problems with unemployment. The problem with Min Jiedong wasn't that he was an entrepreneur. His job was to shake hands, grease palms, etc.. that's what fund raising is. It's an incredibly corrupt area of business, considering the way that Chinese culture expects the showing of respect, and gift giving.

Personally I suspect the bribes weren't made high enough on the ladder of seniority, or someone else saw a great opportunity to embarrass a competing colleague.

If you feel that way, you should rule out the vast majority of countries in the world. I'm not even joking here. Cultural/institutionalised corruption, and racism is extremely common outside of western nations.

However, to be plain, most foreigners are never touched by it, beyond the most basic of experiences. In 13 years in China, I never had any serious problems with the police, or Justice system in China. I was careful. I knew the score, and I avoided being a dick. However, some people believe that as being a foreigner, they're going to be treated differently (as they are in other aspects of living there) and so be immune to being arrested or treated as a criminal. These idiots are the ones that make things difficult for the rest of us, and shape public opinion of foreign groups. I've known 9 people who have been arrested for various offenses in China, and in each case, they were involved in something illegal. Whether that was business fraud, selling drugs or something as simple of breaking their visa responsibilities by working two jobs, they all broke the rules, and did it more than once. Idiots. The system is well known, the rules are obvious, but some people either see themselves above the laws/rules, or see some advantage by breaking them.

As for why I went to live in China? Originally it was money. Pure and simple. I was leaving Australia, and the company I worked for recommended me for a contract position in Beijing, and the money was too good to pass up. Then, I started to enjoy the differences between Chinese and western culture, and.. I stayed. Great experience overall. I have my own dislikes about Chinese culture and Chinese people, but generally speaking, I see my time there as a definite plus. But then, I always kept a reserve of money in a non-Chinese bank to pay for flights out, or enough to pay a decent bribe if I needed to.

It's important to know the score when living in a country like China... and it's not difficult to find out. It's even easier to stay within the boundaries of the law, and not make yourself a target. Most Chinese officials want nothing to do with foreigners from an official aspect.. too much paperwork, and attention from all the wrong places.

I didn't say anything about foreigners being English teachers, but in reality, they're more likely to be on the radar of Chinese authorities, because they're the most likely to be breaking their visa agreements in working two jobs, and therefore are a wonderful way for Police/PSB officers to make extra money in the run up to Spring festival.

Dunno what your focus on English instructors is. I've worked as an English Instructor, Business lecturer (State Universities), and as a Business Consultant. I have a very wide circle of friends and contacts among the foreign community in various places in China (as I've lived in a variety of cities), and I understand what goes on. But somehow, you know better, and feel the need to suggest that I don't know what I'm talking about. Amusing.

haha.. so your logic is to use first, the most hated foreign profession for Chinese authorities, followed up by the second one most likely to generate distrust?

As for strategic industries, as with most Asian countries, strategic industries are off limits to foreign influence. You're not going to get a foreigner working in a wide variety of industries in China because they're not allowed. Foreign companies that touch on those strategic industries use Chinese staff for integration. Of course, some industries/professions will receive more attention...

It's a rule based country for the vast majority of foreigners because the State doesn't give a **** about most foreigners there. As long as they do their jobs, keep their mouths shut about negatives, and don't break the laws. That's what I stated earlier. If the State wants to screw with you, nothing will prevent them from doing so. It's a police state ffs.

You keep trying to twist points. You're not doing a good job at it.

Nope. It's discussing the topic, and considering what else might be at play. As stated earlier, O'Halloran was held guilty for what people did before he arrived. I don't believe he was completely innocent though, probably knowing something of the shady dealings before arriving.. but innocent of direct involvement? yes. Which is likely why he got released in the end.

And nobody is waiving anything that happened to him, as one of those Chinese things. We were having a discussion over what else might have happened, and how that intersected with Chinese culture.